hi guys,
this is my first post here and I am kind of a newbie. I have built a css sdx-15 based ported sub, but this is my first attempt to build speakers. I know how to use winisd etc, have some knowledge about electronics, have help for woodwork and soldering🙂
I want to build floorstanders eventually for my main system and taking this computer speakers project as a prototype.
Basic Info:
Source - M-Audio revolution 7.1 sound card. Might replace with a good 2 channel card if speakers turn out to be very good, or might go with a separate DAC.
Amp - Undecided yet, most likely will be a 30-50w SS integrated/power amp, preferably used. Will buy after the speakers are fully done and I have listened to these with a few amps.
Room Size is about 10x14 feet.
Music - blues, classic rock, heavy metal, jazz, western classical, indian classical etc in that order of preference.
Max Speaker size - limited by my computer desk, max size of the spkrs will be wxhxd - 9x10.5x9". gives a max internal volume of about 10L including port, driver, bracing etc, assuming 0.5" wood.
Budget: I wouldnt want to spend more than 100-120$ on the parts. Cabinets are extra.
Options:
1. How would a 3-5" FR driver do in such a setup. I dont have a sub for this system as of now and if needed I can build one later for this.
2. Use a small 2" FR/WR driver and add a small 4-5" woofer.
3. Use a 4-5" FR and a 1" tweeter.
4. Use a regular 2 way.
Which ones of these are good options for my setup. Please recommend some drivers/kits etc. Please also explain your reasoning if you can as I need to learn from these to be able to make full speakers after a few months.
Thanx
this is my first post here and I am kind of a newbie. I have built a css sdx-15 based ported sub, but this is my first attempt to build speakers. I know how to use winisd etc, have some knowledge about electronics, have help for woodwork and soldering🙂
I want to build floorstanders eventually for my main system and taking this computer speakers project as a prototype.
Basic Info:
Source - M-Audio revolution 7.1 sound card. Might replace with a good 2 channel card if speakers turn out to be very good, or might go with a separate DAC.
Amp - Undecided yet, most likely will be a 30-50w SS integrated/power amp, preferably used. Will buy after the speakers are fully done and I have listened to these with a few amps.
Room Size is about 10x14 feet.
Music - blues, classic rock, heavy metal, jazz, western classical, indian classical etc in that order of preference.
Max Speaker size - limited by my computer desk, max size of the spkrs will be wxhxd - 9x10.5x9". gives a max internal volume of about 10L including port, driver, bracing etc, assuming 0.5" wood.
Budget: I wouldnt want to spend more than 100-120$ on the parts. Cabinets are extra.
Options:
1. How would a 3-5" FR driver do in such a setup. I dont have a sub for this system as of now and if needed I can build one later for this.
2. Use a small 2" FR/WR driver and add a small 4-5" woofer.
3. Use a 4-5" FR and a 1" tweeter.
4. Use a regular 2 way.
Which ones of these are good options for my setup. Please recommend some drivers/kits etc. Please also explain your reasoning if you can as I need to learn from these to be able to make full speakers after a few months.
Thanx
a sub + sealed satellites with any of the small markaudio from chr to alpair 7 would be a very good setup.
consider:
.being nearfiled pc speakers you can go sealed and have good results in the LF with some equalization, search the forum for markaudio with dsp setups
.then once you have the sub you can leave them as satellites and have a very good setup also for farfield listening
.i'm considering doing the same with a pair of alpair6 i own and four ikea bowls, also you can search for it on the forum
.notice the new alpair6 will be out soon.
.then if you'll want mains floorstander you can set them on stand cabinets with woofers in a FAST fashion
i don't really see a reason not to go sealed when you are talking nearfield or a sub/helper woofer is a viable option. specially when one accepts to trade some purity for heavy metal 🙂
also your 7.1 card can give you 'easy' digital crossover functionality with the right software and make possible an OB with the same drivers (and that's where i'm not decided to go sealed or find a pair of woofers to make OB minimonitors with the alpair6 like gainphile a member here did with tangbands in the multyway forum, making them ready to be on top of OB subs also, time and money will choose for me)
if you want to experiment cabinet design than i think that MJK tools would be more useful than winisd to get the juice out of a single fullrange driver, have a look:
Quarter Wavelength Loudspeaker Design
consider:
.being nearfiled pc speakers you can go sealed and have good results in the LF with some equalization, search the forum for markaudio with dsp setups
.then once you have the sub you can leave them as satellites and have a very good setup also for farfield listening
.i'm considering doing the same with a pair of alpair6 i own and four ikea bowls, also you can search for it on the forum
.notice the new alpair6 will be out soon.
.then if you'll want mains floorstander you can set them on stand cabinets with woofers in a FAST fashion
i don't really see a reason not to go sealed when you are talking nearfield or a sub/helper woofer is a viable option. specially when one accepts to trade some purity for heavy metal 🙂
also your 7.1 card can give you 'easy' digital crossover functionality with the right software and make possible an OB with the same drivers (and that's where i'm not decided to go sealed or find a pair of woofers to make OB minimonitors with the alpair6 like gainphile a member here did with tangbands in the multyway forum, making them ready to be on top of OB subs also, time and money will choose for me)
if you want to experiment cabinet design than i think that MJK tools would be more useful than winisd to get the juice out of a single fullrange driver, have a look:
Quarter Wavelength Loudspeaker Design
Hi,
There are loads of posts on computer speakers not suprisingly,looking
at those wil giove you loads of options, but note this case is very
diiferent to larger flloestanding farfield hi-fi speakers.
A selection of the best links to learn / for reference :
rgds, sreten.
Paul Carmody's DIY Audio Projects - undefinition
Zaph|Audio
FRD Consortium tools guide
RJB Audio Projects
Speaker Design Works
HTGuide Forum - A Guide to HTguide.com Completed Speaker Designs.
Humble Homemade Hifi
Click below to go to
Quarter Wavelength Loudspeaker Design
The Frugal-Horns Site -- High Performance, Low Cost DIY Horn Designs
Linkwitz Lab - Loudspeaker Design
Music and Design
There are loads of posts on computer speakers not suprisingly,looking
at those wil giove you loads of options, but note this case is very
diiferent to larger flloestanding farfield hi-fi speakers.
A selection of the best links to learn / for reference :
rgds, sreten.
Paul Carmody's DIY Audio Projects - undefinition
Zaph|Audio
FRD Consortium tools guide
RJB Audio Projects
Speaker Design Works
HTGuide Forum - A Guide to HTguide.com Completed Speaker Designs.
Humble Homemade Hifi
Click below to go to
Quarter Wavelength Loudspeaker Design
The Frugal-Horns Site -- High Performance, Low Cost DIY Horn Designs
Linkwitz Lab - Loudspeaker Design
Music and Design
Maybe something with the CSS EL70?
I really like that driver in my Mar-Kel70 cabinets and they aren't even finished yet!
I really like that driver in my Mar-Kel70 cabinets and they aren't even finished yet!
There are a large number of good FRs that are perfect for this application.
The Gen 2 Mark Audio (which started with the CSS EL70) are very good and don't really need tweeters. Boxes that fit your criteria exist already for EL70, CHR-70, Alpair7. The new Alpair6s hold lots of promise -- the metal cone one should work in a box as small as 1.5 litre.
dave
The Gen 2 Mark Audio (which started with the CSS EL70) are very good and don't really need tweeters. Boxes that fit your criteria exist already for EL70, CHR-70, Alpair7. The new Alpair6s hold lots of promise -- the metal cone one should work in a box as small as 1.5 litre.
dave
Yeah, there's no real need for a tweeter if you go with EL70. Good highs.
Still lacking some bass i think. Dave, can you tell me how much i should stuff them?
That's the thing that keeps me from finishing them :S
Still lacking some bass i think. Dave, can you tell me how much i should stuff them?
That's the thing that keeps me from finishing them :S
Find some 1/2" wool or cotton felt (carpet underlayment for home or car is probably your best source). Line all the walls (don't impede the entrance to the port slots). Rock wool is not a good choice.
dave
dave
Well. I think i got some of this... Foam?
Is that something i can use? I also got some... I can get pictures tomorrow. I lack the words for those uncommon things in life.
Is that something i can use? I also got some... I can get pictures tomorrow. I lack the words for those uncommon things in life.
Foam doesn't work so well.
If you get really strapped i can send you some of the 1/2" cotton felt we use for a token + postage.
dave
If you get really strapped i can send you some of the 1/2" cotton felt we use for a token + postage.
dave
Thanks, but i will try and get some pictures of what i mean.
What do you think it would cost to send that things?
What do you think it would cost to send that things?
Depends how quickly you want it... i'd have to cut a batch up and see what it weighs.
I'd consider it a last resort.
dave
I'd consider it a last resort.
dave
You can buy that at any craft/sewing store...likely for less than the shipping. Polyfluff, BAF, polyester wool/batting, dacron wool/batting, pillow stuffing.
You can use that, batting is better then fluff, needs to be about 1" thick, not as effective as the wool or cotton felt, but better than rock wool. And cheap.
dave
You can use that, batting is better then fluff, needs to be about 1" thick, not as effective as the wool or cotton felt, but better than rock wool. And cheap.
dave
Hi Guys,
Sorry, I have been away for a bit, was busy buying things🙂 and doing a lot of research also.
The amp will be topping tp20 mk2 for the setup. I am also getting a sub, the amp for that is jack hidley's foster plate amp. The sub driver is yet to be decided, will be a cheap one in 50-75$ price range, hopefully black friday sale will help me in this regard and i will be able to get a great 8-10" sub for this.
I checked the room size also, its 11.5x11.75x10.5.
I am still undecided about the FR speakers, but the choices have been narrowed down to:
MA CHR-70
MA alpair 6 (the old one, is available for around 80$ pair).
CSS EL70.
I dont plan to add a tweeter unless I am not et al satisfied with the top end.
Which out of these is best for my application? All of these are ballpark in the same price range. I am not considering the new alpair 6 as of now as its not yet out, and secondly, if the price is around 140$, I might as well put some more and get alpair 7 itself. That is ofcourse assuming alpair 7 is better than alpair 6 mk2.
For rock and metal needs, I am thinking of building another pair, something like overnight sensations/microbe/new horizons etc. Plenty of designs to choose from there also, but thats for another thread in multi-way forum.🙂)
Sorry, I have been away for a bit, was busy buying things🙂 and doing a lot of research also.
The amp will be topping tp20 mk2 for the setup. I am also getting a sub, the amp for that is jack hidley's foster plate amp. The sub driver is yet to be decided, will be a cheap one in 50-75$ price range, hopefully black friday sale will help me in this regard and i will be able to get a great 8-10" sub for this.
I checked the room size also, its 11.5x11.75x10.5.
I am still undecided about the FR speakers, but the choices have been narrowed down to:
MA CHR-70
MA alpair 6 (the old one, is available for around 80$ pair).
CSS EL70.
I dont plan to add a tweeter unless I am not et al satisfied with the top end.
Which out of these is best for my application? All of these are ballpark in the same price range. I am not considering the new alpair 6 as of now as its not yet out, and secondly, if the price is around 140$, I might as well put some more and get alpair 7 itself. That is ofcourse assuming alpair 7 is better than alpair 6 mk2.
For rock and metal needs, I am thinking of building another pair, something like overnight sensations/microbe/new horizons etc. Plenty of designs to choose from there also, but thats for another thread in multi-way forum.🙂)
Based on what I've read, and the statistics, I'd take the EL70 out of those three. The EL70 and the 6 have higher sensitivity than the CHR-70, which is IMO important with that amplifier. Then the EL70 has the new cone design etc. that the old Alpair6 doesn't have ... That, and it's a bit bigger driver which gives you more flexibility in terms of cabinet design+size vs. bass.
(AFAIK the Alpair6mk2 and Alpair7 can't really be described in terms of better/worse, just different ...)
(AFAIK the Alpair6mk2 and Alpair7 can't really be described in terms of better/worse, just different ...)
Thanx for the info.
the efficiency wont be that important in this app. This amp can give around 7-8 clean watts, with 85 db efficiency, I can get around 94 db. thats probaby enough to make me deaf at a 2feet distance in long term.
any other opinions, someone who's heard these drivers?
I am actually using EL70 as computer speakers (EL70eN actually). The wife will have CHR-70eN but that is more because the boxes they are in match her furniture.
dave
dave
Thanx Dave,
So you recommend EL70 over CHR70 and alpair 6 mk1 for my needs? You're the resident guru here and your recommendations are very valuable.🙂
Also, there's an el70 kit with the ert26 tweeters. does it make sense to get the tweeters also, only costs like 14$ for a pair extra.
Hi Guys,
Sorry for bugging you again, I promise this will be last for driver selection for this app🙂.
Among the list looks like EL70 is the best so far. If I can put in more money, is an alpair 7 worth an upgrade for this application. Its almost double the price and would hit me pretty hard in terms of finances, but I dont do these things everyday, and these speakers I am making will last me a good few years atleast. I want a good sounding, non-fatiguing system as I spend a lot of time on my computer, and want to get the best possible sound quality (good resolution, neutral to warm tube like sound).
Once I have more money, I will also upgrade from topping tp20 to something better, preferably diy like gainclone or firstpass, but thats some time away.I will not be using mp3s etc, the sources will be flacs or cds. This is probably going to be my main music system, till I can replace my ageing B&W 602s2 in my main system. Even then, I dont get to listen to much music on the main system as either the kids are watching cartoons or wifey is watching soaps😡
thanx a lot for all the support.
Sorry for bugging you again, I promise this will be last for driver selection for this app🙂.
Among the list looks like EL70 is the best so far. If I can put in more money, is an alpair 7 worth an upgrade for this application. Its almost double the price and would hit me pretty hard in terms of finances, but I dont do these things everyday, and these speakers I am making will last me a good few years atleast. I want a good sounding, non-fatiguing system as I spend a lot of time on my computer, and want to get the best possible sound quality (good resolution, neutral to warm tube like sound).
Once I have more money, I will also upgrade from topping tp20 to something better, preferably diy like gainclone or firstpass, but thats some time away.I will not be using mp3s etc, the sources will be flacs or cds. This is probably going to be my main music system, till I can replace my ageing B&W 602s2 in my main system. Even then, I dont get to listen to much music on the main system as either the kids are watching cartoons or wifey is watching soaps😡
thanx a lot for all the support.
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