TB W5-1611SA vs. MA Alpair7 - Page 2 - diyAudio
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Old 20th March 2010, 08:00 PM   #11
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The tang band looks to have a very flat response; the small alpair definately needs a sub or bass driver to support.
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Old 20th March 2010, 08:42 PM   #12
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Bill,

How do you come to that conclusion?

Both these small drivers will need bass support for real slamming bass, but a quick look at the data doesn't have a whole lot between them in terms of bass extension (the TB will need quite a bit bigger box)... in Callanish A7 is getting into the low 40s.

Also keep in mind that TB factory date has typically been suspect, the MA data has been seen to be pretty accurate.

In the end a side-by-side is what it will take to get beyond educated guesses.

dave
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Old 20th March 2010, 10:10 PM   #13
xTr3Me is offline xTr3Me  Germany
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Hi,

im using the TB W5 since I guess about 1 year now. Im using the driver in this enclosure:
http://oaudio.de/media/products/3aac7ea456ba5e49f69.pdf

Its a german-pdf but you should be able to understand the most relevant points.

The sound is very natural, voices sound very good. Sonic imaging is quite good, but I have heard better speakers regarding sonic imaging (some speakers with the Veravox3- Fullrangedriver). This doesnt mean that the imaging is bad, it is quite good but there exist better speakers regarding this point. The Speakers also like acoustic music a lot, because of its natural sound, but I also use them for electronic music.
The bass for the size of the speaker is very good. 55hz is no problem. But for a really good bass-performance I suggest a subwoofer or better two, or whatever you like. Crossover at about 75hz sounds good, especially if you dont want to hear where the subwoofer is located.

I hope this helped a bit.

greetings,
Chris
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Old 21st March 2010, 06:17 AM   #14
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Thank you all.
So the story is like this, I'm leaving Japan on the 3rd of April, and if I can get enough money saved for the Sigmas,and they still have them, it will be them.I put them in a sealed enclosure around 14L (.................................insert your opinion here.................). And it will be supported by woofers later on for sure.
If my budget can't stretch that far, I have to look elsewhere for a driver.
Your opinions are very much appreciated.
Forgot to mention, the driver goes in an enclosure the shape of B&W style midrange or just a sphere.Not decided on that one yet.

P.S.: I might be able to buy a FF125K for 10Euros a pair/ used. Something for my father to play with


Oh, by the way, in that shop, I heard a Visaton Ti-100 in a BLH, laminated construction, CNC'd. According to FR plot and data, the driver is only good to around 8kHz. Bud funny thing, I didn't miss any treble.... Can someone tell me why is this? The sound was very nice, laid back, much better than the big visaton horn speaker.It was shouty and over the top on treble.Perhaps just a wrong set up.
Also, the visaton is around 90-120Euro in europe, and here in Japan, it's insane 334Euros/each :O !!! Speak about import duty

Last edited by barackuda; 21st March 2010 at 06:37 AM.
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Old 21st March 2010, 09:11 AM   #15
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Well, realistically, most adults can only hear to about 15kHz, and the story only gets worse as you get older. (I'm 19 - I can still hear to 19kHz, but the dropoff after 17k is already easily apparent)

So, assuming you can hear, optimistically, to 16kHz, a speaker reaching to 8kHz is only missing one octave of response. Most musical material is in the 4 octaves 200-3200hz. Sure, there's 2 and a bit octaves of content below that, and 2 and a bit above, but those four octaves (the extended "telephone band") are the crucial ones. Cymbals have a fuzzily defined fundamental (the shimmer) around 7.5-10kHz, but there's other sounds in there too - typically a "gong" around 200hz, and sometimes a distinct "strike" around 4kHz.

Point is that there was probably enough material there on the high end for you to hear the music, and perhaps you personally prefer a "darker" mix (certainly I do - I mix on Sennheiser headphones because they're quite dark - if it sounds good to me on Senn's, it'll tend to be about right for everyone else through the PA).
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Old 21st March 2010, 11:09 AM   #16
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TheSeekerr thanks for the explanation I'm 31, so obviously the hearing isn't that good anymore, considering I've been working in manufacturing industry for 10y
I often read about the 168E Sigma that they need a helper tweeter on top... Than again Mr.Pass said that the Sigma is good from around 150Hz to 10kHz, so this might be enough for my ears
And I think your right that I might like more darker mix

Danny
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Old 21st March 2010, 12:00 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post

Also keep in mind that TB factory date has typically been suspect

dave
Going by the data the alpair 50 hz spl response is in the low 60s; its a small driver so that what I would expect. The tangband isnt great but is acceptable - I've read some very good reviews of this product, some saying its their best driver yet.
But if Tang Band are generally supplying innaccurate data like you are stating then thats no good .
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Old 21st March 2010, 01:37 PM   #18
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MODS:
Please can you change the topic name to TB W5-1611SA vs. MA Alpair7 vs. 168E Sigma?
I forgot to put it in, because I'd liek to hear opinions on the Sigmas as well.

Thanks
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Old 21st March 2010, 02:27 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barackuda View Post
MODS:
Please can you change the topic name to TB W5-1611SA vs. MA Alpair7 vs. 168E Sigma? I forgot to put it in, because I'd like to hear opinions on the Sigmas as well.
Thanks
Hi Barackuda,
Why are you trying to compare the Alp7 with the 168? The drivers aren't close in physical size. While I can't see any data for the 168's cone Dia, it looks significantly larger than my Alp7. Certainly the coil is larger on the 168.

These driver's are very different. The Fostex concentrates on high efficiency, low Q and limited Xmax, power handling being traded off. The Alps concentrate on wider band width, linearity on larger Xmax, trading off some efficiency.

It maybe better to further think about the type of system to be built, available amplification, room size and a preference for a particular box type like BR, MLTL, Horn etc etc. Going down this rout may give more inside on driver choice.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for encouraging chat on various drivers but to make better use of opinions, there needs to more effort on looking at similar size drivers. Expecting smaller drivers to "compete" with larger counterparts isn't likely to be beneficial.

Cheers

Mark.

Last edited by markaudio; 21st March 2010 at 02:35 PM. Reason: additional info.
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Old 21st March 2010, 03:52 PM   #20
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The FE168ESigma? 17.515in^2 cone area (0.0113m^2); roughly a 6 1/2in frame. More than twice the size of the A7. Paper cone, high efficiency, very different design objectives. Couldn't be much further from the A7 & still be a nominal FR driver. They're both fine units indeed within their own design criteria, but like Mark, I can't quite see the point of trying to compare them.
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