Anyone use thier FR's with heavy metal? - Page 11 - diyAudio
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Old 4th August 2009, 08:23 AM   #101
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Yes, I know. I regularly point that out myself, although if you'll permit a slight reworking, I think you'll find the major bass energy (& excursion demands) in rock / metal is in the 60Hz - 120Hz region.

I wasn't concerned about the Nait's 'sound' but it's output impedance not being ideal. Still, YMMV of course. GM's suggestion for a pair of 50s style Klipschorns strikes me as a good un, if you have the corners available.
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Old 18th July 2010, 08:05 PM   #102
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I used some years ago.
and later 2x12"+FR.
for ~all music. from symphonic to pornogrind.
incl. heavy, excl. pop.
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Old 20th July 2010, 05:49 AM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayH3 View Post
Ill start off by saying that I have never heard a set of quality full range speakers. I am, however, very intrigued by the minimulistic approach. I am considering trying out a set of Audio Nirvana Cast Frame 8's. I would probably supplement them with a set of tweeters. Those would be powered by my ST70. I would then add powered subwoofers to pick up the bass.

I am sure that they sound great simple music, but I listen to a wide range of music that includes metal. Are the dynamics of the speaker going to fall apart when there are several tracks of distorted guitar, bass, double bass drums and crashing cymbals, and screaming vocals?

I just want to make sure these are versatile speakers before I include them in a project.

Thanks for any comments.
Depends on what you want out of them but I have had great fun out of a pair of Karlson speakers - not the big 15" but the slightly smaller box (590mm high from memory - have build both sizes and much preferred the smaller) with 12" Fane speakers in them and hung upside down against the ceiling in my parents pub. At 100 watts RMS / 160 watts peak each it was enough power to drive the people out of the place with ear splitting levels. No need for a tweeter either. The eliptical slot makes for great dispersion of the sound and little beaming effects.

AM
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Old 20th July 2010, 02:46 PM   #104
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Just as a by the by, a regular 4 string bass guitar has a bottom "E" string fundamental of around 41Hz. There aren't many metal tracks which don't go there! So Good output in room at 40hz would be my target.
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Old 20th July 2010, 04:05 PM   #105
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It wouldn't be mine. Not for unsupported wide-band drivers reproducing metal anyway. Dynamic bandwidth is not one of their strong-suits, and tuning to 40Hz with a vented alignment will typically put maximum excursion ~an octave above this -right at the point where most of the bass energy in rock / metal tends to be. Granted, a lot of metal is heavily compressed (the Iron Maiden remasters for e.g., which have all but ruined the albums), but even so, you're going to run out of linear travel very quickly as soon as you crank the volume up, to say nothing of AMD kicking in. Better IMO, if unsupported wide-band units are desired & a v. large horn is out of the question, to tune a bit higher so you've got more dynamic BW available, rather than aiming for 40Hz & paying a heavy price elsewhere for it.
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Old 20th July 2010, 04:38 PM   #106
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I appreciate flat to 40Hz anechoic is too big an ask, but I'm curious, not even an Alpair12 in a sympathetic alignment, say -6 to-10dB at 40Hz could go there, even with room gain?
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Last edited by simon dart; 20th July 2010 at 04:39 PM. Reason: typo fix
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Old 20th July 2010, 05:52 PM   #107
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It is pretty easy to get most of the Mark Audios down to 40 Hz, particulairily inroom, but limited cone area will limit dynamics, impact, and volume. Still a single or twin set of EL70 can stun people with their bass capabilities. And in this recent post an interesting comment on the bass from a pair of CHR70Mk2.

We'll soon see how well A12 does in a big horn (actually Scott may have some comments from Kurt?), a beta build of Avebury R2 is pending.

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Old 20th July 2010, 06:55 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simon dart View Post
I appreciate flat to 40Hz anechoic is too big an ask, but I'm curious, not even an Alpair12 in a sympathetic alignment, say -6 to-10dB at 40Hz could go there, even with room gain?
Ah, well, that's a different story. Much more realistic. Actually, that's roughly what the Pencil 12 does. Just to stress, I don't think 40Hz anechoic (or lower) is impractical with widebanders, just usually not for something like metal / classic rock / orchestral etc. unless in something like a big back-horn to keep displacement down as far as possible.
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Old 29th August 2010, 06:49 AM   #109
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There were a lot of recommendations to cross the FR driver to a woofer somewhere between 100-500Hz to take the bass excursion out of the FR driver. That means we need to use a woofer that is about 98db/w efficiency, if the FR is 95db/W, with an additional 3db BSC margin for the woofer. Any recommendations for woofers with such high efficiencies?

Would a more regular woofer in a tapped horn work? The upper range would be limited, maybe 150Hz max?

With the FR relieved of bass duties, what would the optimum enclosure alignment be? Sealed? Open baffle?

I'm finding myself in a similar path to heavy metal enjoyment - can't play loud and clean.

I find that speakers regarded as 'audiophile' or jazz speakers tend to sound harsh when playing metal - the guitars are too much 'in your face'. What is the cause and would the FR have a similar problem?

Thanks!
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Old 29th August 2010, 09:03 AM   #110
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Front horns for both bottom end and wide-band would be the 'optimal' if done properly in terms of maximum SPLs and dynamic BW. If you want simpler, something like the Basszilla with monopole bass unit[s] crossed to a wide-band on OB is good, or you could run the wideband unit sealed. Depends on the sound you prefer, how complex you want to make things, space & cost considerations etc. There's a huge variety of options available; same goes for drive units. Eminence are popular & not overly expensive. Fane make some excellent units. There are dozens of manufacturers so have a look around.
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Last edited by Scottmoose; 29th August 2010 at 09:10 AM.
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