Scott,
I think you're right on many points... however, not everyone is in a position to buy a McLaren, Ferrari, or even a Porsche or Lotus... yet, there's no denying they are certainly far beyond a souped-up Mustang or Camaro as a well-designed, well-engineered and well-executed product. The same can be said for the other products as well be they automotive, audio, etc.
When I was a kid I earned a lot less and bought, designed and built toys, all within my means and lived with them... and I appreciated them and took care of them because I had to work hard to get them. However, I'm not a kid anymore... and I've continued to work hard for over 30 years and have been fortunate enough to have some wonderful opportunities make themselves present, and, hopefully, smart enough to take advantage of them and make things better for myself.
I still live within my means... which admittedly are greater now. Yes, I've been fortunate enough to be in a position to obtain some of the above luxuries including a pair of Feastrex drivers. And yes, they are certainly better than most stuff out there hands down. Whether or not you or anyone else can afford them is a different topic altogether... tell the guy that owns the Ferrari that he wasted 6 figures when he could have gotten most of the performance from a Mustang and he probably won't bother to acknowledge you.
I think most of us can agree that diminishing returns is the norm is any high-end product as you take each (increasingly smaller) step in price/performance, but everyone has their own measurement stick for what is an improvement and, more importantly, what that particular improvement is worth. I also look at other aspects of products I buy, things like reliability, consistency (of performance) and useful lifespan. I truly believe that a Feastrex product will easily last a lifetime if properly used and cared for.
For me, it's absolutely worth the price... not just for the Feastrex drivers, but for the other audio components I invest in and other products as well. I prefer to buy things once and be able to use them and appreciate them for decades.
Regards, KM
I think you're right on many points... however, not everyone is in a position to buy a McLaren, Ferrari, or even a Porsche or Lotus... yet, there's no denying they are certainly far beyond a souped-up Mustang or Camaro as a well-designed, well-engineered and well-executed product. The same can be said for the other products as well be they automotive, audio, etc.
When I was a kid I earned a lot less and bought, designed and built toys, all within my means and lived with them... and I appreciated them and took care of them because I had to work hard to get them. However, I'm not a kid anymore... and I've continued to work hard for over 30 years and have been fortunate enough to have some wonderful opportunities make themselves present, and, hopefully, smart enough to take advantage of them and make things better for myself.
I still live within my means... which admittedly are greater now. Yes, I've been fortunate enough to be in a position to obtain some of the above luxuries including a pair of Feastrex drivers. And yes, they are certainly better than most stuff out there hands down. Whether or not you or anyone else can afford them is a different topic altogether... tell the guy that owns the Ferrari that he wasted 6 figures when he could have gotten most of the performance from a Mustang and he probably won't bother to acknowledge you.
I think most of us can agree that diminishing returns is the norm is any high-end product as you take each (increasingly smaller) step in price/performance, but everyone has their own measurement stick for what is an improvement and, more importantly, what that particular improvement is worth. I also look at other aspects of products I buy, things like reliability, consistency (of performance) and useful lifespan. I truly believe that a Feastrex product will easily last a lifetime if properly used and cared for.
For me, it's absolutely worth the price... not just for the Feastrex drivers, but for the other audio components I invest in and other products as well. I prefer to buy things once and be able to use them and appreciate them for decades.
Regards, KM
Nelson Pass said:I have prepared some larger baffles, and it's my intention to
try to get some comparisons without a woofer. I'll be happy to
share the results, but don't hold your breath.
Great! Thanks (as always) Nelson. I know I speak for everyone when I say it's appreciated, whenever you manage to find time.
kmaier said:
Oh, I agree wholeheartedly in principle, as you noticed. And I've certainly nothing against them. However, as Feastrex are getting a great deal of free advertising via the forums, and the comments are universally positive, I thought it would be well to introduce a slightly cautionary note. I've seen people who can't really afford things buy them anyway, on the strength of rave forum comments, with all the problems it entails. Yep, it's entirely their decision, & ultimately their responsibility, but I also believe that along with our fun, we are here to help each other, and however great something is, it's a good idea to point out the other side too. Not trying to be a killjoy, just careful.
Slightly OT, actually, I have told a bloke I knew who was trying to decide whether or not to buy a Ferrari 328 to leave it & buy a Lotus instead. He really didn't want to hear it, but it did give him pause for thought. Eventually, he in fact bought a non-turbo Esprit. Not quite as quick as the 328, but he could afford to keep and run it. AFAIK, 4 years on, he still has it. Sure, there are quicker cars out there (although the jury's out on that -not much beats an Esprit of any kind on a twisting road) but he's got the best he could realistically afford. Doesn't stop us admiring the higher end drivers / cars of course, but doesn't cause dissatisfaction with our lot either.
I know a fellow who wanted a pair of the more expensive Feastrex drivers but couldn't afford them . . . until he hit upon the idea of putting his knowledge and listening room to profitable use and started selling them to people who wanted, and were willing to pay for, the sort of "plug-and-play" solutions he could provide. Several sales later, he now has his high-end drivers, paid for by his customers. The fact that bare drivers are available means that in theory at least this is always an option for people with the requisite knowledge and facilities . . .
-- Chris
-- Chris
Thank you Nelson for your earlier response to my Lowther/ Feastrex query, your response was more than the 'little clue' that I asked for and you still managed to remain fair and impartial ...you really are an ambassador at heart!
Scott: raises some important issues about affordability vs. perceived sonic improvements, and that is really the reason why I asked the question about Feastrex compared to Lowther. I'm not a k-zillionaire either, and have a loving wife, three children, two cats and a mortgage to look after (these are my number one priorities), but it is important to 'push the envelope' with audio within one's sphere of ability and financial means.
As you can see from this Audiogon thread which I use as my personal blog space ( http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&1146370182&view ), I have experimented with a lot of speaker technologies from planars to the best of Accuton/Raven cone-domes to point source Goodmans Axiom 80/Coral B10/Fostex/Lowthers to Edgar Horns. I just wanted to let people know that instead of jumping all the hoops like I have, just get a Lowther DX3 (or better) ...they really are that good. And, in this short-cutting context they are not that expensive.
Loudspeakers *are* the most important part of your system and luckily, that's where the biggest bang for the buck is to be had DIYwise. We can't all build ground breaking Class A amplifiers, valve constructs or stratospherically soaring DA converters, but I would encourage everyone to spend most of their audio budget on speakers, that's where the best results will come from. Its very rewarding when someone with a plethora of audio gear including Sonus Faber Cremonas walks into your little audioworld and upon hearing the DIY Lowther MLTL with Eton subs or the Edgar Horns, shakes his head and says "..gee Steve the difference between your sound and mine is that you have MUSIC in your room, and mine sounds like its coming from a hi-fi system". That's the best compliment I could have had.
Regards,
Steve.
BTW: Using the car analogies discussed above, I am a Subaru WRX or Outback kind of guy. Its affordable, does the job well and also has some street cred!
Scott: raises some important issues about affordability vs. perceived sonic improvements, and that is really the reason why I asked the question about Feastrex compared to Lowther. I'm not a k-zillionaire either, and have a loving wife, three children, two cats and a mortgage to look after (these are my number one priorities), but it is important to 'push the envelope' with audio within one's sphere of ability and financial means.
As you can see from this Audiogon thread which I use as my personal blog space ( http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&1146370182&view ), I have experimented with a lot of speaker technologies from planars to the best of Accuton/Raven cone-domes to point source Goodmans Axiom 80/Coral B10/Fostex/Lowthers to Edgar Horns. I just wanted to let people know that instead of jumping all the hoops like I have, just get a Lowther DX3 (or better) ...they really are that good. And, in this short-cutting context they are not that expensive.
Loudspeakers *are* the most important part of your system and luckily, that's where the biggest bang for the buck is to be had DIYwise. We can't all build ground breaking Class A amplifiers, valve constructs or stratospherically soaring DA converters, but I would encourage everyone to spend most of their audio budget on speakers, that's where the best results will come from. Its very rewarding when someone with a plethora of audio gear including Sonus Faber Cremonas walks into your little audioworld and upon hearing the DIY Lowther MLTL with Eton subs or the Edgar Horns, shakes his head and says "..gee Steve the difference between your sound and mine is that you have MUSIC in your room, and mine sounds like its coming from a hi-fi system". That's the best compliment I could have had.
Regards,
Steve.
BTW: Using the car analogies discussed above, I am a Subaru WRX or Outback kind of guy. Its affordable, does the job well and also has some street cred!
talawalla said:
That's funny . . . sometimes those guys seem to get maddeningly tight tolerances, and things get stuck. Mr. Teramoto had to trade up to a lower-precision scale because he was becoming too much of a fetishist on getting everything just right out to some silly level of precision. He recently assembled about twenty drivers and was cursing his metal parts fabricator for leaving nearly zero tolerance on the threads, so that his whole body was sore from tightening down threads. That led him to come up with an idea for a tool that will allow him to tighten things down without getting so darn tuckered out.
Good luck getting the drivers out of their circular ***-basket.
-- Chris
agent.5 said:
Don't think so... I've driven the Elise in the UK with the Rover powerplant (to the Lotus factory in Hethel for a private tour no less... lucky me) and I've driven the Toyota/Yamaha US version with some well done upgrades (my buddy's daily ride). while it's a great car... I'd never give up the Esprit V8 for one plain and simple. A well sorted Esprit is a great driver's car... for me, even moreso than the Elise... for track day, well... I'd probably pick an Elise, preferably with another 50+HP.
Regards, KM
talawalla said:
That sounds great (pun), but wait until I get some newer baffles built,
as I want to try some larger ones with better woofers.
Plus my wife will give me a bad look if I don't clean up the listening room first.
In the meantime, I do believe I'll be in your neighborhood in about
two weeks or so...
Nelson Pass said:
Larger baffles...I guess that taller and narrower may be more WAF preferred over wider and shorter ones. What about the baffle like Jamo's R909, with two 15" woofers, and a D9e Type II Feastrex on top?
Nelson Pass said:
Plus my wife will give me a bad look if I don't clean up the listening room first.
Hopefully the kitchen table will be free of active crossover parts too!
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