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Old 12th July 2009, 10:28 AM   #31
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Hi Sam,sorry for jumping in like this but i saw your post.
I have a pair of Chilli Changs which Scott altererd slightly to work with my fostex 168e Sigma's.Ive had them for a year now and to be honest they took for ever to Run in.It's only after around 6 months that they realy smooth out .Even then they just get better and better.Ive listened to lots and lots of speakers ,at shows etc and i've yet to hear a more open sounding speaker through the midrange.A carefully chose sub works wonders with these which need some help from around 100hz down.
I use a WE 300b Set for these speakers which is a superb match.

Regards James
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Old 12th July 2009, 12:34 PM   #32
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James, thanks for your input and comments. I agree that the FE168EZ sounds fantastic in the midrange and my guess is that the microdynamics changes with the type of enclosure and the stuffing. But I am surprised that in your Chilli-Chang enclosure, modified to suit the said driver, they need assistance from 100Hz down!!

I think that the Ceinwyn is good to near 50Hz. As you rightly point out, a fast sub that does not colour or sound lumpy is the answer. The question is how to achieve this. Electronic correction is not very attractive as it hinders the minimalist approach.

A TH style sub would be very suitable, but the size...?

Would anyone like to add their comments about the Ceinwyn per se?
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Old 12th July 2009, 03:25 PM   #33
mr ed is offline mr ed  United States
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Hi Sam,

I too have a pair of 168es waiting for a build. I had talked to Peter a while back about the Ceinwyn vrs BIB. after building both he prefers the Ceinwyn.

I will send hin a note to look on this post and get him to comment.

Cheers
Ed
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Old 12th July 2009, 04:12 PM   #34
peterr is offline peterr  Netherlands
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Hallo Sam,
Sorry I didn't see your question earlier (thanks Ed for letting me know).
My Ceinwyns have been playing for over a year now and I am still quite happy with them. Compared to the BIB boxes I used before they sound much more balanced and open and generally are very pleasant to listen to.
They are quite sensitive to stuffing and it took me a while to get that right. They needed more than I expected.
I have them toed in the tiniest bit.
Like James I could do with a bit more low end. This is partly a room problem though. I have never tried them in another environment so I don't know how much of it is the room and how much is the speaker.

Here they are in my current system:

Click the image to open in full size.

Hope this helps
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Old 13th July 2009, 03:59 AM   #35
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Thanks Peterr and Ed. Yes it sure does help to know that the Ceinwyn is better than a BiB.

But consistent comments on slightly inadequate bass output from both the Ceinwyn and modified Chilli Changs with the FostexFE168EZ driver necessitates a question? What is the horn-loading lower frequency? If the horn loads down to 50Hz or even 60Hz, the indadequacy of bass should not be felt on most types of music.

I am asking because the same driver, say for example in a BiB puts out so much bass, that most people have had to say that they had to cut it down and many feel that their BiBs with the 168EZ do not need corner loading.

(IIRC the BiB is a Half-Wave Loaded Tapered Tube, so F3 will be lower than the BVRs.) But what about the level of bass output from 50-100Hz?
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Old 13th July 2009, 06:37 AM   #36
peterr is offline peterr  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally posted by Samuel Jayaraj
But consistent comments on slightly inadequate bass output from both the Ceinwyn and modified Chilli Changs with the FostexFE168EZ driver necessitates a question? What is the horn-loading lower frequency? If the horn loads down to 50Hz or even 60Hz, the indadequacy of bass should not be felt on most types of music.

I am asking because the same driver, say for example in a BiB puts out so much bass, that most people have had to say that they had to cut it down and many feel that their BiBs with the 168EZ do not need corner loading.

(IIRC the BiB is a Half-Wave Loaded Tapered Tube, so F3 will be lower than the BVRs.) But what about the level of bass output from 50-100Hz?
Like I wrote in the previous post lack of bass is a mostly problem of the room, the Bibs were bass light as well.
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Old 13th July 2009, 08:11 AM   #37
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Peterr, thanks for the very quick reply. Since you suspect the slight lack of low end is a room problem, though not having tried them in another environment, would you guestimate that the horn loads down to atleast about 50Hz?

An added comment about the stuffing might help others as they build these marvellous cabs!

Thanks,
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Old 13th July 2009, 09:30 AM   #38
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Design was 60Hz, quasi-EBS style alignment. They're not bass monsters, they're intended for smaller-scale acoustic music, so if you need significant LF output, you'll probably be better off looking elsewhere.
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Old 13th July 2009, 09:34 AM   #39
peterr is offline peterr  Netherlands
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I would guess it should go to 50Hz but that guess is worth very little since I haven't heard it anywhere else.

Scottmoose sent me a simulation plot once that shows it should go down that far.

Peter


Edit: Scott posted while writing this.
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Old 13th July 2009, 12:03 PM   #40
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Thanks Scott and Peterr. Now that we have it from the designer himself, it is 60Hz. Scott, what is your recommendation of suitable subs that don't 'blur' the performance of your superlative design of BVRs?
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