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-   -   If 4.5" Fostex needs sub & 6" needs tweeter? (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/120509-if-4-5-fostex-needs-sub-6-needs-tweeter.html)

artfuldodger 31st March 2008 06:09 PM

If 4.5" Fostex needs sub & 6" needs tweeter?
 
Hello I was trying to compare using a Fostex FE167e in a Bob Brines FT1600 MLTL design versus a FE126 in a back loaded horn.
Some people say a full range design should not be any bigger than a 4.5" (FE126) and that you'll probably need a sub. Some people say that with a 6" (FE167) that you might need a tweeter.
I would be using these in a 12' x12' bedroom.
I'm not real crazy about crisp metallic highs and I don't need thumping lows. My wife watches TV in the next room and would complain about the bass. I would think it would be easier to add a tweeter if needed. Just trying to get a few ideas such as back loaded speakers would have to be further from the wall etc.

chrisb 31st March 2008 06:33 PM

Re: If 4.5" Fostex needs sub & 6" needs tweeter?
 
Quote:

Originally posted by artfuldodger
Hello I was trying to compare using a Fostex FE167e in a Bob Brines FT1600 MLTL design versus a FE126 in a back loaded horn.
Some people say a full range design should not be any bigger than a 4.5" (FE126) and that you'll probably need a sub. Some people say that with a 6" (FE167) that you might need a tweeter.
I would be using these in a 12' x12' bedroom.
I'm not real crazy about crisp metallic highs and I don't need thumping lows. My wife watches TV in the next room and would complain about the bass. I would think it would be easier to add a tweeter if needed. Just trying to get a few ideas such as back loaded speakers would have to be further from the wall etc.



ya gotta luv the internet

"I read it on the grapevine...."

One guy's opinion (more to follow, no doubt?)

12x12ft is not a huge room, and you could probably get quite adequate SPL and bass extension with a single FE127E in BVR, Fonken, or Mileva style enclosure ; or FE126E in a BLH (not, however the factory recommended hybrid design). Several of these mentioned enclosures are floor-standers, and if you are pressed for room, the little milliFonken with FE127 would be worth consideration.

FE167E in an MLTL such as Bob's, could well overpower a room this size; and the Scottmoose double-mouth BVR's could need more room to properly integrate.

artfuldodger 31st March 2008 11:59 PM

The Fonken's with the Fe126e look nice. I like what i've read about the FE126e more than the Fe127. The miniOnkin likes a bigger amp I have a small Yulong t-amp. I didn't see a milli Fonkin.
What's the point of building a smaller speaker if you have to put it on a speaker stand full of heavy sand. I would just as soon build a floor stander it has the same basic foot print?
Are their any MLTL's with 4" drivers? The Mileva looks good too.

tinitus 1st April 2008 12:37 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Mileva or Demetri ought to work fine with your room

http://www.planet10-hifi.com/boxes-fostex.html


Would like to hear it with a Supravox 165GMF and supertweeter


rcdaniel 1st April 2008 05:06 AM

Quote:

Would like to hear it with a Supravox 165GMF and supertweeter
A bit OT, but me too. From the published info, that driver looks to be the pick of the Supravox line. If I could be assured of build quality and there were more (any?) optimised designs around, I'd seriously consider it.

Now, back to regular programming...

Cheers

Scottmoose 1st April 2008 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by artfuldodger
The Fonken's with the Fe126e look nice. I like what i've read about the FE126e more than the Fe127.
The Fonken doesn't work with the 126.

chrisb 1st April 2008 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by artfuldodger
The Fonken's with the Fe126e look nice. I like what i've read about the FE126e more than the Fe127


horses for courses

As Scott pointed out, the enclosure tuning for the entire Fonken family was optimized for the FE127E (except the microFonken using the FF85K). In the same enclosures, the FE126 would not retain the same tonal balance; - dynamic, yes - but likely very thin on the bottom octaves, and very forward.




Quote:


The miniOnkin likes a bigger amp I have a small Yulong t-amp. I didn't see a milli Fonkin.


Mini-onken in our specific vernacular refers to the CSSFR125 version of the design - in which case, the sensitivity difference would certainly require more power than many small T-amps comfortably provide.


Quote:



What's the point of building a smaller speaker if you have to put it on a speaker stand full of heavy sand. I would just as soon build a floor stander it has the same basic foot print?


You said this system was for a 12x12ft bedroom, so assuming that there is other furniture (such as bed), that would not necessarily leave a lot of room for a floor-standing or stand-mounted enclosure - hence my suggestion for the milli-Fonken. It's small and light enough when built with plywood that they can easily be hung in a corner with wall-mount bracket - and don't let their size scare you.

There are some things that a narrow baffle, stand-mounted mini-monitor can do very well indeed, of which the Fonkens are a great example. By willfully sacrificing the maximum bass extension and SPLs from a limited excursion driver, such as these in question, and being mindful of room gain/boundary loading, it's possible to lose less than you'd think.



Quote:


Are their any MLTL's with 4" drivers? The Mileva looks good too.


Technically, I think Scott / Dave would refer to the Mileva (& her steroid enhanced brother Demetri) as ML Voigt Pipes (get it, ML-V?)


If you have the floor space, the Mileva or Soott's Brynn (Chang) work very well indeed . In a room this small, 3-4w of SET can be enough for very enjoyable SP levels with virtually any of the FE127 designs, and you certainly wouldn't need to worry about your wife complaining over thumping bass. Hell, if she likes music at all, you might just be sharing the listening couch (bed?).

artfuldodger 1st April 2008 05:10 PM

Thanks for the responces, I'll have to rethink the FE127e as I like the Fonken design. Do you make this enclosure and then cut the front two corners off?
I can't find any reference to the "mili-Fonkin" design.
I will also check out the Mileva and Scott's Brynn (chang) designs as I do have room for floor standers. My original plan was to make MLTL's with FE167e's but someone suggested they might be too big for my room.
Getting back to my original question I guess a 4" fullrange design is better for a small room and 6" speakers are more suited to a larger room such a a living room?

chrisb 1st April 2008 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by artfuldodger
Thanks for the responces, I'll have to rethink the FE127e as I like the Fonken design. Do you make this enclosure and then cut the front two corners off?


'cause I'm too lazy to carefully pre-cut all the parts to the exact sizes with the bevel (and have access to a large table saw), yes

Quote:




I can't find any reference to the "mili-Fonkin" design.


This might not be the best for you after all, but as I said before, don't let the size fool ya.



http://homepage.mac.com/tlinespeaker...en-plan-tn.gif

http://homepage.mac.com/tlinespeaker...-0v999-map.pdf


Quote:



I will also check out the Mileva and Scott's Brynn (chang) designs as I do have room for floor standers. My original plan was to make MLTL's with FE167e's but someone suggested they might be too big for my room.


Getting back to my original question I guess a 4" fullrange design is better for a small room and 6" speakers are more suited to a larger room such a a living room?

based on personal experience with the FE167 in the Demetri, I can tell you that even a 6" driver can be too large for some rooms ( in my case 8'6"w x 23' long is too small, but 15ft w x 26ft long is fine)



PS, regarding performance in a coincidentally same sized room:



http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showt...81#post1472281



type 2nd April 2008 02:48 AM

I can tell you that the Fe127e is perfect for a 12x12 room. I just finished a pair for the same size space and they sound great with a surprising amount of bass. Definitely a lot more bass than I was expecting based on what I've read about these drivers. I'd suggest giving them a try and if you don't like the sound (but I bet you will) you can sell them pretty easily in the market place or on ebay.


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