Full Range?

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Magnetar

Magnetar

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Joined 2004
planet10 said:
The Omnes sensitivity is probably optimistic... to get that high efficiency one would likely need an 8" or larger, which probably limits you to Fertin or Supravox. A new contender would probably be the 9" Feastrex, but it may not like an OB, you need seriously deep pockets, and it would probably be a waste restricting it to such a narrow band. As well it would be very challenging to find woofer & tweeter that would mate with it.

Relaxing things a bit further efficiency wize to bring the price down to what mere mortals can afford, the Visaton B200 with phase plugs is a good candidtae. A 5k XO is pretty low thou.

dave
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I think I'd need a pair of those minimum for high output (120 db). If I do that the rising response won't be so bad and the treble won't matter much.
 
C

Caferacer

Member
Joined 2007
"I was thinking that myself! The dust cap is "Zurette" what ever that means??? Maybe it's there to cause the peak for guitar? I think I'll carefully cut one out and see. "

I suspect it will help a lot. The dustcap looks huge on that driver for no good reason compared to the size of the voicecoil.
 
Magnetar

Magnetar

Banned
Joined 2004
Caferacer said:
"I was thinking that myself! The dust cap is "Zurette" what ever that means??? Maybe it's there to cause the peak for guitar? I think I'll carefully cut one out and see. "

I suspect it will help a lot. The dustcap looks huge on that driver for no good reason compared to the size of the voicecoil.
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Thanks, I think you are right, I love the midrange but the top end is a bit ragged, The answer to my Wide Range mid may already be here...

:D
 
O

OzMikeH

Member
Joined 2007
AER's MK1 is 103dB/W it's an 8 incher.
Quite beamy up high which is the ONLY thing I don't like about it. in the right box it'll do 40Hz with ease. Bass you can feel with 1 watt, it's bizarre.
not sure how it's response is OB, but you have 3dB to throw away with a filter.
I'd run it up till it starts getting beamy then XO to something special with it's own amp. I think around 15k but it's been about a year since I listened to one. If you're in the right seat in the room at the right height they're magical. It's what got me back into audio again.
 
navin

navin

Member
Joined 2002
elektromag.com
Magnetar said:
So if you guys were to pick the best 'Wide Range' driver for use between 120 and 5K what would you use? It would be electronically high passed and used on open baffle...Hemp Cone
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Magnetar said:
high QTS (for use on a baffle) no rising response, 100 db sensitivity and can handle some power with little to no coloration,
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Magnetar said:
six to ten inch
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In order of price
Omnes 8"
Hemp FR8
Visaton B200
Supravox 165/215 RTF (not bicone)
Supravox 215 Signature
Veravox 7x
Fertin 20D

but I would consider a freq. response of 60-10k (2 octaves wider than your specs) so that your bass and hf drivers can be easier integrated. Also consider a driver with a minimlar breakup as this will allow you to integrate the HF driver without using a LPF filter on the widerange.

BTW what bass and hf drivers do you have in mind.

inrank said:
http://www.spectrumaudio.de/breit/omnesaudio/omnesaudioL8.html
i used them on a relatively small baffle, about 18"
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can that baffle be folded so say somethng like 12-15" wide with 3-4" wings on either side?

planet10 said:
The Omnes sensitivity is probably optimistic...
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by how much? about 3db? that would bring it to the same level as the Fertin 20D.
 
S

sumacSK

Member
Joined 2004
Magnetar

Magnetar

Banned
Joined 2004
navin said:


but I would consider a freq. response of 60-10k (2 octaves wider than your specs) so that your bass and hf drivers can be easier integrated. Also consider a driver with a minimlar breakup as this will allow you to integrate the HF driver without using a LPF filter on the widerange.

BTW what bass and hf drivers do you have in mind.

can that baffle be folded so say somethng like 12-15" wide with 3-4" wings on either side?

by how much? about 3db? that would bring it to the same level as the Fertin 20D.
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Thanks!

I don't like the idea of crossing the treble in that high or crossing the bass to mid that low for various reasons. Mostly I don't think there is a single driver that will have that efficiency and power handling over that range on an open baffle, and if it did I think I'd be compromising in IM distortion that I find clearly audible and irritating. I quad amp with horn loaded low bass.

The baffle can be any size, here is the bass section: five 16 ohm woofers in parallel -

An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.


I have several HF drivers - ribbons AMT, compression drivers/tweeters - the best sounding is the B&C DH10 in a Transylvania slotted tube. It's best used above 3K and has plenty of sensitivity and wide dispersion.
 
Magnetar

Magnetar

Banned
Joined 2004
sumacSK said:
I think that most of those fullrange drivers will not be efficient enough for you (especially below 1KHz or so). This fostex looks rather nice: http://www.fostexinternational.com/docs/speaker_comp/pdf/ff225k.pdf but it has really small xmax.. maybe using 2 per side? From pro drivers this one seems interesting http://www.ciare.com/pdf/catalogo/PM250.pdf and really 100dB! There are some distortion measurements of this driver on german forum that looks very nice..
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Thanks,


That curve, resonance specs and efficiency reminds me of the B&C 6.5" driver I have loaded in the tractrix horn in the picture above. It fullfills what I seek but does not radiate as a true dipole due to being front horn loaded and only is usable to 350 cycles. I suspect the Ciare would also require horn loading to cover the range and would have weak low midrange mounted on a boaed.
 
H

hagar

Member
Joined 2004
Hi,
I wonder if 12" alnico guitar speakers like tone tubbys ,celestion blue or
the speakers of Ted Weber could be interesting as widerangers?
Brought in discussions for some times ,but who has build
something with these so far ?
Maybe some tweaking like cone treatment,ENABLing or phaseplugging
would be worth giving a try.

I think of something like the Bastanis Atlas but with drivers mentioned above.
Open back HF compression driver for true dipole treble looks like an interesting approach,too.
Stand alone bass dipoles for frequencies below 100Hz.
This could help keeping the mid/high baffles as narrow as possible.

Worth giving it a try?

regards
Simon
 
Magnetar

Magnetar

Banned
Joined 2004
I cut the dustcap out of the lil' buddy driver and away went the treble peak, now they go out to 2.5 k go down 3db and stay level out to 6-7K and then roll off nice and smooth. So they sound better but don't extend out too far. Now I might make a 1.75" phase plug. Seems like this driver will be hard to beat for a high efficiency Wide Range mid on an open baffle if I can get the top end straightened out a bit.
 
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