free of charge and fostex of visaton

[nightuser]

hello!

first, sorry, my terrible english.

i have read the articles by marin king. they seems quite easy to understand, but i want (too much) to see the calculation worksheets (equations). where i can find his models free of charge? (mail to nightuser@inbox.ru)

ind i am interesting in different books about design loudspeakers enclosures. pdf. free of charge. (i'm not 100% sure, that i can read them, but i will try!) 8-)

i'm interresting in building a transmission line enclosure.
i have two pairs of drivers: fostex fe166e and visaton bg20, and i'll be glaid if someone help me to find the designs of the enclosures for this drivers. please, give links and your suggestions about how/what to do better.

and what about comparison between those drivers. i know, that fostex is much better, what you can say about visaton (about bg20 and about visaton in common).

[gychang]

Originally posted by nightuser
hello!

first, sorry, my terrible english.

i have read the articles by marin king. they seems quite easy to understand, but i want (too much) to see the calculation worksheets (equations). where i can find his models free of charge? (mail to nightuser@inbox.ru)

ind i am interesting in different books about design loudspeakers enclosures. pdf. free of charge. (i'm not 100% sure, that i can read them, but i will try!) 8-)

i'm interresting in building a transmission line enclosure.
i have two pairs of drivers: fostex fe166e and visaton bg20, and i'll be glaid if someone help me to find the designs of the enclosures for this drivers. please, give links and your suggestions about how/what to do better.

and what about comparison between those drivers. i know, that fostex is much better, what you can say about visaton (about bg20 and about visaton in common).

Your English is much better than my Russian...


If you have FE166E, consider Bigger is Better (BIB) speaker. These cabinets are amazing.

http://www.zillaspeak.com/bib-fostex.asp

gychang

[Scottmoose]

You can't find his models free of charge. Martin put a great deal of personal time and effort into developing his MathCad worksheets, and certain people saw fit to use them to develop commercial speakers, without in any way acknowledging, or renumerating him. So he decided to make a very modest charge for the worksheets instead, so at least he gets something out of it. Surely $25 isn't too much to ask?

You say you want books free of charge too. Without meaning to sound rude, you don't seem very willing to pay for your education or software! Try looking for second-hand books like 'How To Build Speaker Enclosures', and older editions of The Loudspeaker Design Cookbook. Anything by Gilbert Briggs is worth a read too -old, yes, but useful, and should cost very little.

Re your drivers, the FE166E is not suitable for transmission-line loading, although it will work, with a fair bit of effort, in a resonant QW line (not the same thing). It's better in horns & their variations though. Have a look here: www.zillaspeak.com/bib.asp and www.frugal-horn.com for some examples of it's use, plus plans & dimensions for cabinets using it. The BG20 should go into the Bruce cabinet on the 2nd site I mention quite happily.

[BHD]

hello!

Zdrastvuitye!

first, sorry, my terrible english.

Your English is fine. Welcome to the forums!

i have read the articles by marin king. they seems quite easy to understand, but i want (too much) to see the calculation worksheets (equations). where i can find his models free of charge? (mail to nightuser@inbox.ru)

Martin charges only 25 dollars for a user license, if you can afford Fostex drivers, you can afford to pay his reasonable license fee. Trying to get around this is not a good way to introduce yourself, IMHO.

If you want to see designs for those drivers, check out the BIB thread. Here's a link to your driver, fifth one from the top. All you need to make a BIB:

http://www.zillaspeak.com/bib-fostex.asp

For what it's worth, the FE166e is not really well suited for a transmission line enclosure.

Poka!

[ScottG]

C'mon guys..

He is *asking* for information and software for free.

Its neither a demand nor an expectation, so try not to view it that way. Ask yourself, how much freeware do use? (..as an even better example...) How much free information do you routinely get from the net (..and that includes this forum)?

Moreover, at one time Martin's stuff WAS free of charge (..so there can be some confusion there).

So next time someone asks for something for free, try editing out the negative commentary. After all - who doesn't want something for free?

Some kindly supplied freeware:

http://www.tolvan.com/products/

http://www.pvconsultants.com/audio/frdgroup.htm

[Scottmoose]

I don't think either of us viewed it as a demand or an expectation; we merely pointed out that $25 is not a lot of cash. There shouldn't be any confusion; Martin makes this quite clear on his site.

We also both gave several helpful suggestions & links, plus I made some book recommendations to look out for 2nd hand, where they can often be picked up for a couple of £. Keeping with the book-theme briefly, most full-texts of audio related books are still in copyright, so you have to be careful; I've been hit with copyright in the past, with people using my research, so I know exactly what it's like from an author's perspective. No-one's suggesting it's meant maliciously. But I can't help break it.

Additional freeware: WinISD (not perfect, but it's a start) http://www.linearteam.dk/ and these little collections: http://diyaudiocorner.tripod.com/software.htm & http://www.hal-pc.org/~bwhitejr/ old, but still fairly useful. The TL designer of DosBox is not especially accurate as it's based on Bradbury's moving-fibre hypothosis, and the since exploded notion of aerodynamic drag. Possibly better than nothing, but Martin's free alignment tables will give better results. Then again, it could be used (sort of) to model them after designing, although it's accuracy will be sporadic at best.

[BHD]

Ask yourself, how much freeware do use?

Martin's stuff isn't freeware, so what's your point?

The fact that it was once free doesn't make any difference. The gentle chiding he received was well deserved.

[ScottG]

Originally posted by Scottmoose
I don't think either of us viewed it as a demand or an expectation; we merely pointed out that $25 is not a lot of cash. There shouldn't be any confusion; Martin makes this quite clear on his site.

Not entirely.

Negative comments (..none of which were grossly negative by any means):

Yours:

"Without meaning to sound rude, you don't seem very willing to pay for your education or software!"

There isn't anything there that reader doesn't already know, and you expressly recognize that it could be a bit "rude".

and BHD's:

"..if you can afford Fostex drivers, you can afford to pay his reasonable license fee. Trying to get around this is not a good way to introduce yourself, IMHO."

Maybe he can't afford 25 US (..and perhaps budgeted it all on the drivers and some wood)? Such a comment *could* lead a poster to feel like some cheap bum. Trying to "get around it" - suggests something less, i.e. theft.

Now neither comment is IMO that bad.. but both are unnecessary.

More importantly though, THIS IS A NEW POSTER HERE! Try extending *ALL* courtesy for such occasions.

Finally,

Note that while Martin does say the licensing fee is 25US.. it IS buried in text on a page that specifically is entitled:

"MathCad Computer Models : Upgraded Versions"

starts with:

"The MathCad worksheets, that have been available for the past few years, have now been upgraded to include several new features.."

and follows with:

"The biggest change in the worksheets is that they are no longer free."

Note the appellation "upgraded versions". The *upgraded versions* have *several new features*. One *change* is that they are *no longer free*.

All of this begs the question: "what about the old NON-upgraded versions that are free (..or were a least free to some)"?

I happen to have them and paid nothing for them (..and am very thankful to have them). However, I'm not going so far as to extend the file to another (..because I *believe* that Martin's intention was to halt distribution of these files in favor of the new paid versions). That doesn't mean however that I'm going to effectively tell someone else to pony up the change for Martin's new work. (..there *IS* a difference.)

BTW, don't take any of the above to seriously - its just there to give a little perspective.

[Scottmoose]

Sorry that you felt so strongly about our posts Scott -I thought they were relatively innocuous to be honest.

As far as I can see, I extended all due courtesy to our (very welcome) new member by making several suggestions of software and sites to consider, plus some very valuable books that are worth looking for. I stand guilty as charged for pointing out the fact that Martin's worksheets are not freely distributable, nor are audio-books which are still under author's copyright (i.e everything published over the last 75 years). However, it's necessary to point this out, not unnecessary, and a gentle reminder / observation is not, I think, impolite. Flip side of the coin: you can view it in a positive or negative light. I regard it as discouteous not to mention it as it's in his own interest, not ours. In addition, Martin's a friend, and as such I owe it to him to mention it too.

Given that you yourself say that neither of our posts 'were grossly negative' when critquing them, and it's fairly apparant they were not intended to be either, I'm a bit puzzled why you're so worried. That said, I freely admit I have a sardonic sense of humour which sometimes gets the better of me, but how insipid a world we would live in if we couldn't express ourselves informally.

Fair point -& I stand corrected re the fact that it's not clear about earlier versions of the sheets on Martin's site. FWIW, as I understand it, technically, the user should either pay for the latest versions, or delete the earlier versions, but that is indeed a shady area & possibly a legal minefield. Perhaps Martin could step in & give us the definative (assuming there is one!), but that's the way it works to the best of my knowledge. Might be a good idea for Martin to put an explanatory paragraph on his site though. I suspect he hasn't bothered as it'd be next to impossible to achieve in practice.

Best wishes
Scott

[ronc]

The above is one of the many reasons i never offered to the public any developed software.

ron