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Old 30th October 2008, 07:34 AM   #1351
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Default Actually

Actually,

I think that Tanaka-san is the owner of a set of D5e Type I's. It is appropriate: his speakers are definitely taking advantage of the capabilities of that family of magnetic circuits.


---I think that no one would deny that physics are at play here. There are so many measurable aspects of the drivers that have not yet been measured. I think that gauging from the interest we have seen here, these measurements will be taken someday by somebody and the results could be VERY interesting.

For me at least, I know that there are 24 hours in a day. As far as getting a viable speaker design refined and tweaked to "perfection," I get much further much quicker if I "play with legos" than if I try to "play with numbers" or "play on paper." Naturally, there is some basic math to begin with, but after that, just like 95%+ of Tanaka-san's design process, it has been all cut and try for me. It is not a matter of available resources. I personally could afford the software, and could train myself with it. I also have access to an immensely capable woodshop, and cumulative decades of experience in building speaker cabinets (if we consider it a team effort between myself, Jason and our close local friends). In general, I go with the woodshop. If I track myself back as a child, metaphorically, I always have just chosen to "play" with "it." It is just faster, more efficient regarding materials taken to refine a design, and more "screwup resistant" for me. Also, and this is the most important aspect of this approach to me, by simply cutting and trying, I generally find my mind in the zone of discovering legitimately new techniques for accomplishing tasks (be it speaker related, or whatever) or of discovering new interactions. More "inventive." Of course, I mix all methods and approaches together where applicable and take everything and every piece of information as it comes, just like everybody else. But If I were to be stranded on a deserted island with a pair of Type IIIs and could only bring along one part of my brain, I know which half I would leave behind...

But of course, to each their own! I think that many people here are on the verge of a crossroads perhaps. People who have been sitting on the fence up until now will get specs, will design cabinets strictly with specs, and, just like the people who do cut and try as the primary method of design, there will be varying outcomes in regards to quality. I personally feel that there is no "superior" method. Just varying results. We all have different brains, and different ways of tackling a problem. I am excited to see what sorts of things people come out with who have different approaches than I do. To me, Feastrex drivers are such "chameleons," that hearing different approaches to enclosure design is like going to an art gallery which requires only that all the artists who wish to display there paint in "oil." The results can be pretty varied. Here, in this community, we all help to grow each other. So for me, there simply is no argument. There is one thing for certain though: using measurements or intuition, the cutting edge will get pushed to the limit when designing enclosures for Feastrex drivers.

-Clark
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Old 30th October 2008, 10:39 AM   #1352
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Default Re: Actually

Quote:
Originally posted by blumenco
It is just faster, more efficient regarding materials taken to refine a design, and more "screwup resistant" for me. Also, and this is the most important aspect of this approach to me, by simply cutting and trying, I generally find my mind in the zone of discovering legitimately new techniques for accomplishing tasks (be it speaker related, or whatever) or of discovering new interactions. More "inventive." Of course, I mix all methods and approaches together where applicable and take everything and every piece of information as it comes, just like everybody else.
I note you are NOT saying your approach is necessarily the best one for everyone to use . . . we all have to use the approaches and tools that we are most comfortable with. I'm not sure if there is a sense in which "all roads lead to Rome" or if different approaches tend to pre-determine different end results, but I'm glad that we have the diversity in the audio community to be able to (mostly) satisfy everybody.

And speaking of satisfying everybody, I spoke to Mr. Teramoto today and he informed me that he is running in the pair of NF5ex drivers that he'll be performing tests on. He has an overnight business trip away from his workshop but he plans to be back tomorrow and if all goes well he could have the NF5ex drivers measured at various field coil voltages as early as this weekend.

-- Chris
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Old 30th October 2008, 11:17 AM   #1353
kmaier is offline kmaier  United States
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I would be nice to see the specs for the NF5ex drivers, especially along with the D5nf drivers. At some point I'd like to have the field-coil version, would be nice if you could share an enclosure design between these two.

Regards, KM
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Old 30th October 2008, 11:32 AM   #1354
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Quote:
Originally posted by kmaier
would be nice if you could share an enclosure design between these two.
Probably can, although depending on the enclosure design it might be necessary to reduce the field coil voltage to make it fit. Mike Luckow was telling me that he and his wife both really liked the sound of the NF5ex in the pine Freddie enclosures. (Whether that enclosure can be considered optimal for the NF5ex is a separate matter, of course.)

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Old 30th October 2008, 11:32 AM   #1355
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Quote:
I note you are NOT saying your approach is necessarily the best one for everyone to use . . . we all have to use the approaches and tools that we are most comfortable with. I'm not sure if there is a sense in which "all roads lead to Rome" or if different approaches tend to pre-determine different end results, but I'm glad that we have the diversity in the audio community to be able to (mostly) satisfy everybody.


Only some roads lead to Rome, I think. It can happen that two people, using different methodologies will arrive at a similar destination. Equally though, they can go off in completely different directions.

I think it's important here to separate a design goal from the methodology used in order to attain it. From my POV, the method used is really neither here nor there. Whatever works best for the designer is the appropriate one to use.

Glad to hear about some of the measurements coming through.
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Old 30th October 2008, 04:52 PM   #1356
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Quote:
Originally posted by cdwitmer

Mike Luckow was telling me that he and his wife both really liked the sound of the NF5ex in the pine Freddie enclosures. (Whether that enclosure can be considered optimal for the NF5ex is a separate matter, of course.)

-- Chris

Yes, that's right. I don't yet have a cabinet for my NF5ex drivers that was specifically designed for them, but I desperately wanted to listen to them when I got them so I just pulled my D5nf drivers out of my beautiful pine Freddie cabinets (which Scott and Dave designed and Rich built), plugged in the NF5ex drivers, wired them up, and turned them on.

They sound really, really good in the Freddie cabinets. The first song I played was something that my wife and I had listened to many times before. Within ten seconds, she said that she liked the sound a lot more than when the D5nf drivers were in those cabinets. After listening to a lot of music over the past few days, I agree as well. It's surprising since these cabinets weren't even designed for those drivers.

However, I think it's unlikely that they wouldn't sound even better in an enclosure that's designed specifically for them, so I'm definitely looking forward to trying them in such a design. In the meantime, I'll be very happy listening to them in the Freddies!

Mike
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Old 31st October 2008, 08:47 PM   #1357
kmaier is offline kmaier  United States
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Mike,

Thanks for the feedback... now it looks like I have to add a pair of the NF5ex drivers to my list... ugh, not cheap. Any idea on the sensitivity? More or less than the D5nf driver? Have you varied the voltage much on these and if so what sonic differences are there?

I plan on building a new pair of Freddie cabinets. The latest design update has the driver mounted up higher by 2.5 inches. Just not sure of the wood yet... first pair was solid red oak.

Regards, KM
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Old 31st October 2008, 09:02 PM   #1358
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Default New Cab

I want to build a new freddy out of spruce or yellow alaskan cedar.
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Old 31st October 2008, 09:32 PM   #1359
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Default C'est une vie de chien

As if you needed any more evidence, here is the ultimate proof that being a Feastrex owner is a dog's life:

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

This also proves that if France didn't already exist, it would be necessary to invent it.

-- Chris
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Old 31st October 2008, 10:09 PM   #1360
kmaier is offline kmaier  United States
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Default Re: New Cab

Quote:
Originally posted by Phil Townsend
I want to build a new freddy out of spruce or yellow alaskan cedar.
Hey Phil,

Interesting choices... do you have local sources for wood or are you doing mail order? I'm leaning towards cocobolo, but will have to go mail order as I've not found any good sources locally in South Florida to date.

Chris,

I always enjoy France.... wine, food, art, etc. Those, however, are for the dogs... of course, just my $0.02.

Regards, KM
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