FastEddy said:
It's done all the time...using a wire basket with the parts placed inside connected as the cathode in a dilute plating bath....
called "barrel plating"...
Best finish is obtained with a heavy levelling brite nickel undercoat and a gold "flash" of 10 - 20 uinches (.25u - .5u)
John L.
plating with???
Gold plating bath...
0.5 oz/gal potassium gold cyanide
2.0 oz/gal. citric acid
4 g/gal cobalt citrate
pH 4.0
temp. 70 - 90 F
current density 5 ma/cm^2
1 - 2 minutes /.000010" thickness
Brite nickel is for corrosion resistance and mirror finish
If you're happy with the el-cheapo chinese finish, why do you want to gold plate them.???
You need to strip the el-cheapo stuff off in dilute HCl or H2SO4 depending on what it is, or the gold won't stick very well.
Volts doesn't matter, as plating is based on coulombs/second integrated over time.
Platinum or stainless steel anodes (for short time only, will ruin the bath over time)
W/o some effort and expertise, the finish you obtain will look worse than the chinese finish already there.
Good luck
John L.
Gold plating bath...
0.5 oz/gal potassium gold cyanide
2.0 oz/gal. citric acid
4 g/gal cobalt citrate
pH 4.0
temp. 70 - 90 F
current density 5 ma/cm^2
1 - 2 minutes /.000010" thickness
Brite nickel is for corrosion resistance and mirror finish
If you're happy with the el-cheapo chinese finish, why do you want to gold plate them.???
You need to strip the el-cheapo stuff off in dilute HCl or H2SO4 depending on what it is, or the gold won't stick very well.
Volts doesn't matter, as plating is based on coulombs/second integrated over time.
Platinum or stainless steel anodes (for short time only, will ruin the bath over time)
W/o some effort and expertise, the finish you obtain will look worse than the chinese finish already there.
Good luck
John L.
" ... If you're happy with the el-cheapo chinese finish, why do you want to gold plate them.??? " ... Not!
I want to make 'em look good for the new "under glass" amp I'm buildin' ...
" ... strip the el-cheapo stuff off in dilute HCl or H2SO4 depending ..."
... in inert plastic buckets, natch. Got it. After stripping the chinese gunk off, cleaning (and neutralizing), then plate on a little "bright" nickel, yes?
" ... Volts doesn't matter ... coulombs/second ... over time ..." Got it, based on surface area of the anode & cathode, right? I plan on using a motorcycle battery with timer switch and experiment. (Got an alternate suggestion?)
" ... [no!] Platinum or stainless steel anodes ..." or in any of the chemicals, I suppose. Understood = contamination.
Effort & Expertise or = " ... the finish you obtain will look worse than the chinese finish ..."
I found some very interesting books about older plating technics at Linsay Tech Books Publishing ( www.lindsaybks.com ) ... anything else to add?
That's why I asked here, knowing someone with your level of expertise would respond = Thanks a bunch.
I want to make 'em look good for the new "under glass" amp I'm buildin' ...
" ... strip the el-cheapo stuff off in dilute HCl or H2SO4 depending ..."
... in inert plastic buckets, natch. Got it. After stripping the chinese gunk off, cleaning (and neutralizing), then plate on a little "bright" nickel, yes?" ... Volts doesn't matter ... coulombs/second ... over time ..." Got it, based on surface area of the anode & cathode, right? I plan on using a motorcycle battery with timer switch and experiment. (Got an alternate suggestion?)
" ... [no!] Platinum or stainless steel anodes ..." or in any of the chemicals, I suppose. Understood = contamination.
Effort & Expertise or = " ... the finish you obtain will look worse than the chinese finish ..."
I found some very interesting books about older plating technics at Linsay Tech Books Publishing ( www.lindsaybks.com ) ... anything else to add?
That's why I asked here, knowing someone with your level of expertise would respond = Thanks a bunch.
Caswell Inc. - AVOID
I order and receive Gold Plating kit, but - this is not s gold plating solution they send to me, and is old ..
This product have 4 moths shelf life and this particular gold plating solution expires on December 20 2008, and i should have a 4 moths time to use this solution not a little more then 2 ...
I do everything like thay say in manual, and online video, this gold plating dont work .. I try to call company but one answer the phone .. I was waiting for online help for some time and i was disconected several times! I post problem on technical support forum with photo of bad result, but post was deleted [marked like "junk"] and i am banned on forum ...
Forum moderator contact me and give me instruction how to clean copper sheet i want to gold plate, and i do everything what he suggest, but i have same dispointing result - THIS IS NOT A GOLD PLATING solution ! After i send mail back about same bad result, i dont have anymore answers from company ...
Just permanent ban on Technical support forum, for treating i will report internet fraud, damaged Copper Clad sheets, waste of my money and time ... All results i have are complete opposite of what this company promise online ... There is no a little sign of gold layer on Copper metal surface, There is Dark brown almost black layer on place where i try to apply gold, and there is brown marks on cloth on Gold plating want - NOT a Blue like should be .. I got same results never mind how good i clean metal surface i want to gold plate and never mind what metal i want to Gold plate, always same disapointin result ... All i have from this comapny was - waste of my money, waste of my time, damaged PCB copper clad boards, and being humiliated from "technical support" ! And my worst technical support EVER !
There is a links of photos damaged copper clad boards:
1. This is PCB ready for soldering, now damaged and useless:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_01_damaged_PCB.jpg
2. This is dark brown - black marks on cloth on plating want [should be blue ]:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_02_mark_on_cloth.jpg
3: This is same damage on brand new copper clad board, just cleaned and washed:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_03_plating_on_new_pcb.jpg
4: This is color of gold sollution [should be blue not almost clear] and some yellow sediment on cap and protective tape:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_04_sediment_on_bottle.jpg
5. To avoid any possible "Camera Lie" problem, this is photo of damaged PCB next ro Gold Plated Cellular Phone:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_05_compare_to_real_gold_plating.jpg
6. One more comparation to RAEL Gold Plating:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_06_compare_to_real_gold_plating.jpg For me, this chemicals i receive dont have anything in common with Gold Plating !
To eliminate any possible Copper Clad problems or possible mistakes, i try to apply gold plating to my Wedding Band, made of White Gold !
1. This is photo of white gold wedding band before any plating:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Wedding_Band_01_Bend_Before.JPG
2. This is same weding band after "Gold Plating" with Caswell Brush Electroplating System Kit:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Wedding_Band_02_Bend_After.JPG
3. Just to compare - same ring before on Gold Plated Phone:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Wedding_Band_03_Before_on_Phone.JPG
4. .... and same ring AFTER "Gold Plating" on gold plated cellular Phone !
http://www.hifiholic.com/Wedding_Band_04_After_on_Phone.JPG ... and still brown mark [stain] on cloth on plating wand !
After all probelms i got, i open PayPal dispute!
This morning i got email from company president, Mr. Lance Caswell:
from: Lance Caswell <techsupport@caswellplating.com>
reply-to: techsupport@caswellplating.com
to: komigenie@*****.com
date: Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 1:09 PM
subject: [#JDJ-157976]: Plug N Plate Gold
mailed-by: 128295-web1.caswellplating.com
> I try couple time .. cleaning copper, washing, using gloves - doing
> everything to be sure copper is clean, but i have same results, dark copper,
> and brown marks on cloth, i dont have idea what else i can try ...
>
> I am not interested in other materials, cuz i buy this kit for gold plating
> traces on PCB boards for my hifi DIY devices ...
>
> Do you have any idea what else can be wrong ?
>
>
Now you've filed a PayPal dispute???!!!! You say I ignored your last 2 e-mails!!!??? You expect me to work 24 hours a day, sir!!!???
You're completely nuts. Go **** yourself, and NEVER contact my company with your ******** again.
--
Caswell Inc. President
7696 Route 31
Lyons NY 14489 USA
P: 315 946 1213 F: 315 946 4456
Ticket Details
Ticket ID: JDJ-157976
Department: Tech Support (After Sales)
Priority: Low
Status: Closed
Now guys, go and order something from CASWELL INC.
Regards !
I order and receive Gold Plating kit, but - this is not s gold plating solution they send to me, and is old ..
This product have 4 moths shelf life and this particular gold plating solution expires on December 20 2008, and i should have a 4 moths time to use this solution not a little more then 2 ...
I do everything like thay say in manual, and online video, this gold plating dont work .. I try to call company but one answer the phone .. I was waiting for online help for some time and i was disconected several times! I post problem on technical support forum with photo of bad result, but post was deleted [marked like "junk"] and i am banned on forum ...
Forum moderator contact me and give me instruction how to clean copper sheet i want to gold plate, and i do everything what he suggest, but i have same dispointing result - THIS IS NOT A GOLD PLATING solution ! After i send mail back about same bad result, i dont have anymore answers from company ...
Just permanent ban on Technical support forum, for treating i will report internet fraud, damaged Copper Clad sheets, waste of my money and time ... All results i have are complete opposite of what this company promise online ... There is no a little sign of gold layer on Copper metal surface, There is Dark brown almost black layer on place where i try to apply gold, and there is brown marks on cloth on Gold plating want - NOT a Blue like should be .. I got same results never mind how good i clean metal surface i want to gold plate and never mind what metal i want to Gold plate, always same disapointin result ... All i have from this comapny was - waste of my money, waste of my time, damaged PCB copper clad boards, and being humiliated from "technical support" ! And my worst technical support EVER !
There is a links of photos damaged copper clad boards:
1. This is PCB ready for soldering, now damaged and useless:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_01_damaged_PCB.jpg
2. This is dark brown - black marks on cloth on plating want [should be blue ]:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_02_mark_on_cloth.jpg
3: This is same damage on brand new copper clad board, just cleaned and washed:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_03_plating_on_new_pcb.jpg
4: This is color of gold sollution [should be blue not almost clear] and some yellow sediment on cap and protective tape:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_04_sediment_on_bottle.jpg
5. To avoid any possible "Camera Lie" problem, this is photo of damaged PCB next ro Gold Plated Cellular Phone:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_05_compare_to_real_gold_plating.jpg
6. One more comparation to RAEL Gold Plating:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Plating_06_compare_to_real_gold_plating.jpg For me, this chemicals i receive dont have anything in common with Gold Plating !
To eliminate any possible Copper Clad problems or possible mistakes, i try to apply gold plating to my Wedding Band, made of White Gold !
1. This is photo of white gold wedding band before any plating:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Wedding_Band_01_Bend_Before.JPG
2. This is same weding band after "Gold Plating" with Caswell Brush Electroplating System Kit:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Wedding_Band_02_Bend_After.JPG
3. Just to compare - same ring before on Gold Plated Phone:
http://www.hifiholic.com/Wedding_Band_03_Before_on_Phone.JPG
4. .... and same ring AFTER "Gold Plating" on gold plated cellular Phone !
http://www.hifiholic.com/Wedding_Band_04_After_on_Phone.JPG ... and still brown mark [stain] on cloth on plating wand !
After all probelms i got, i open PayPal dispute!
This morning i got email from company president, Mr. Lance Caswell:
from: Lance Caswell <techsupport@caswellplating.com>
reply-to: techsupport@caswellplating.com
to: komigenie@*****.com
date: Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 1:09 PM
subject: [#JDJ-157976]: Plug N Plate Gold
mailed-by: 128295-web1.caswellplating.com
> I try couple time .. cleaning copper, washing, using gloves - doing
> everything to be sure copper is clean, but i have same results, dark copper,
> and brown marks on cloth, i dont have idea what else i can try ...
>
> I am not interested in other materials, cuz i buy this kit for gold plating
> traces on PCB boards for my hifi DIY devices ...
>
> Do you have any idea what else can be wrong ?
>
>
Now you've filed a PayPal dispute???!!!! You say I ignored your last 2 e-mails!!!??? You expect me to work 24 hours a day, sir!!!???
You're completely nuts. Go **** yourself, and NEVER contact my company with your ******** again.
--
Caswell Inc. President
7696 Route 31
Lyons NY 14489 USA
P: 315 946 1213 F: 315 946 4456
Ticket Details
Ticket ID: JDJ-157976
Department: Tech Support (After Sales)
Priority: Low
Status: Closed
Now guys, go and order something from CASWELL INC.
Regards !
gold plating
The pics you posted look like any one of several explanations.
1) The soln is bad, has no gold, etc. The darkened color is the result of some oxidation and/or surface corrosion from the cathodic current (you did connect the part to be plated as (-) and the wand as (+), right?)
2) Too high a voltage applied to the circuit (should run around 3 - 6 volts, depending on soln. and/or setup. If this happens, you "burn" the part and deposit what's called a "smut" on the part being plated
As to soln. color, that's due to the alloying metal. Pure 24K gold solutions are usually colorless, but normally aren't used for circuit boards due to softness.
As for Casswell, I know nothing about them, but I'd be leary buying anything over the internet having to do with precious metals.
John L.
The pics you posted look like any one of several explanations.
1) The soln is bad, has no gold, etc. The darkened color is the result of some oxidation and/or surface corrosion from the cathodic current (you did connect the part to be plated as (-) and the wand as (+), right?)
2) Too high a voltage applied to the circuit (should run around 3 - 6 volts, depending on soln. and/or setup. If this happens, you "burn" the part and deposit what's called a "smut" on the part being plated
As to soln. color, that's due to the alloying metal. Pure 24K gold solutions are usually colorless, but normally aren't used for circuit boards due to softness.
As for Casswell, I know nothing about them, but I'd be leary buying anything over the internet having to do with precious metals.
John L.
Re: gold plating
1. I agree with you about this ! Switchung poilarity is not possible, cuz on Negative wire you have small alligator clip and on Positive you have connector for wand! Mistake is not possible
2. they provide power supply [4.5v] with kit, and this should be corect voltage !
For this result - only reason can be bad plating solution, but alswer i got from company was - "go **** your self" !
1. I agree with you about this ! Switchung poilarity is not possible, cuz on Negative wire you have small alligator clip and on Positive you have connector for wand! Mistake is not possible
2. they provide power supply [4.5v] with kit, and this should be corect voltage !
For this result - only reason can be bad plating solution, but alswer i got from company was - "go **** your self" !
Re: gold plating
You was SOOOOO right !
I measure voltage on power adapater this company send me and multimeter shows 7,88 V ...
I found some universal adjustable voltage adapter, and adjust to 4.5 !
Everything come out good ...
Thanx for help, but this KIT going back to comany for Caswell President big mouth, i alredy contact my bank to pull money back !
Thanx for hint, i really apriciate !
auplater said:
You was SOOOOO right !
I measure voltage on power adapater this company send me and multimeter shows 7,88 V ...
I found some universal adjustable voltage adapter, and adjust to 4.5 !
Everything come out good ...
Thanx for help, but this KIT going back to comany for Caswell President big mouth, i alredy contact my bank to pull money back !
Thanx for hint, i really apriciate !
Your problems that you had are caused because you cannot gold plate copper directly, it needs to be coated with nickel first, than plated with the gold. The reason that your gold solution is clear instead of blue is because you purchased a cyanide based commercial grade plating solution. Chances are you probably contaminated your gold solution when you tried to plate the copper without first applying the nickel coating. That solution would turn a yellowish color if that happened instead of a cloudy clear solution that you started with. Non commercial grade gold plating solution,does not contain cyanide, will have a bluish color, and does not last as long. Need something plated, visit Home
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