Awww, come on - you all are missing the importance of CD demagnetizers, speaker cable directional burn-in gadgets and other such trailblazing inventions! No HiFi fair, tweakers' website or esoteric glossy FooFi magazine would be as screamingly funny without the snake oil peddlers and their gullible clientele.
On things esoteric, Harald Schmidt (the German Jay Leno):
"Esotericism (word?) is the effect of cellulite having reached the brain."
Pit
On things esoteric, Harald Schmidt (the German Jay Leno):
"Esotericism (word?) is the effect of cellulite having reached the brain."
Pit
I also am dubious of a lot of exaggerated claims about sound enhancing products and their science.
However.....
I also accept that science does not always tell us how a product will sound in an audio application.
Take for example the favourite bete noire of many here---cables.Science tells us that there is no way we should hear any difference between reasonable well constructed cables either for speakers or for ic´s.
I know that I have heard differences -and I only say differences- between cables not to mention resistors, capacitors etc.I and many others could be deluding ourselves of course but statistically I find this a small possibility.I also know that sometimes I have not heard any real differences between some of these components as well.
I have also copied a bit perfect cd with EAC and have heard a difference which should not be there.
So I say let´s use science as a general compass not to stray too far from our objective but use our immediate senses to lead us on the path we are following.
However.....
I also accept that science does not always tell us how a product will sound in an audio application.
Take for example the favourite bete noire of many here---cables.Science tells us that there is no way we should hear any difference between reasonable well constructed cables either for speakers or for ic´s.
I know that I have heard differences -and I only say differences- between cables not to mention resistors, capacitors etc.I and many others could be deluding ourselves of course but statistically I find this a small possibility.I also know that sometimes I have not heard any real differences between some of these components as well.
I have also copied a bit perfect cd with EAC and have heard a difference which should not be there.
So I say let´s use science as a general compass not to stray too far from our objective but use our immediate senses to lead us on the path we are following.
I will try your suggestion in the interests of performing a service to the audiophile brotherhood of the world and report the results forthwith.Pit Hinder said:protos,
you live close to the beach famous for the prettiest filled bikinis in the world - but isn't it the same as HiFi?
As soon as you get it home you notice the difference between looks and performance.
Pit
Attachments
protos said:
You probably *perceived* a difference with some of the changes you made, but it doesn’t mean you heard a difference. Perception combines physically hearing something then blending the sensation with emotion, anticipation, and other mental modifiers to produce a cognitive result.
Changing cables and capacitors probably makes music you like sound better, but try it with songs you’ve never heard or songs you hate. Anticipating changes to make improvements will produce fantastic results, albeit non-quantifiable.
Science doesn’t completely understand all physics in the universe, but I’m pretty sure it has a pretty good grip on CD-media’s properties.
DCPreamp said:
With cables, capacitors and other components, there are audible differences which can also be measured but I am talking about the difference between 'bellwire' and heavy-duty speaker cables !! Whether freezing the bellwire would make it sound better............I'll leave it up to you to decide.
Andy
By "making sense" I did not mean that the magnetizing makes sense. About that I know nothing. (I guess I know a bit more now.) What does make sense to me is that the quality of CDs has gone down. That is something I would expect. That's how a commodity-oriented market works. That's economics 101.
And desperate measures for me would be like buying some cleaning stuff for CDs.
But, yes, I'm desperate. I look at my some 30 CDs and feel like a complete idiot. How stupid are you when you pay money--any money--for junk? The PlayStation does make me feel a bit less like a moron. At least I haven't paid big money for a CD player only to play discs that are of so poor quality, Junji Kimura of 47 Labs says they shouldn't even be played.
And desperate measures for me would be like buying some cleaning stuff for CDs.
But, yes, I'm desperate. I look at my some 30 CDs and feel like a complete idiot. How stupid are you when you pay money--any money--for junk? The PlayStation does make me feel a bit less like a moron. At least I haven't paid big money for a CD player only to play discs that are of so poor quality, Junji Kimura of 47 Labs says they shouldn't even be played.
Swell, now I only have to find an old CD.
Seriously, I got into CDs about three years ago. I did work in a record store in 1989, the year the CD killed vinyl. We had quite a few returns. (Much more than we had vinyl.) Usually because the CD wouldn't play. I have never had any such problem. At best/worst this means nothing has changed.
Edit: I'm sure vinyl has more defects than a CD. Vinyl is inherently imperfect. The problem is the sound when the CD does misread, and I mean really misread. Vinyl hiss and pops I don't mind.
Seriously, I got into CDs about three years ago. I did work in a record store in 1989, the year the CD killed vinyl. We had quite a few returns. (Much more than we had vinyl.) Usually because the CD wouldn't play. I have never had any such problem. At best/worst this means nothing has changed.
Edit: I'm sure vinyl has more defects than a CD. Vinyl is inherently imperfect. The problem is the sound when the CD does misread, and I mean really misread. Vinyl hiss and pops I don't mind.
PHN,
Aren´t you exaggerating a little with the vinyl vs cd comparison?
I play my vinyl collection and have even bought some new and used vinyl recently.In most cases the vinyl sounds better than the cd if you A/B them but I would not say that all cd´s are disappointing at all with the correct set up.My cd set up is quite good not to have to make excuses.
Have a look at this thread as well.http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=91780&highlight=
Aren´t you exaggerating a little with the vinyl vs cd comparison?
I play my vinyl collection and have even bought some new and used vinyl recently.In most cases the vinyl sounds better than the cd if you A/B them but I would not say that all cd´s are disappointing at all with the correct set up.My cd set up is quite good not to have to make excuses.
Have a look at this thread as well.http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=91780&highlight=
I have no issues with the sound of CDs. I'm not anti CD. Since I don't like new 180g "audiophile" vinyl pressings, whatever issues I have with the sound of CDs seem to be related not to the format, but to modern sound engineering, or perhaps the equipment used in studios today. I can only speculate about the whys. But that's not what I'm talking about.
What I'm talking about is the manufacturing quality of CDs.
One of the DVD stores where I live have this note in the window that says they fix DVDs for a small fee. I don't know what they mean by fix. I have more than ten times as many DVDs as CDs. I have no problem with my DVDs (which have superior error correction).
When all is said and done, I have some 30 CDs that in three yrs have caused me more problem than my DVDs and three decades of vinyl use combined. I'm frustrated, mad, disappointed. The very reason I have so few CDs is that I'm not motivated to buy CDs. I mean, I have hundreds of DVDs and LPs. I guess I'm just venting my frustration.
What I'm talking about is the manufacturing quality of CDs.
One of the DVD stores where I live have this note in the window that says they fix DVDs for a small fee. I don't know what they mean by fix. I have more than ten times as many DVDs as CDs. I have no problem with my DVDs (which have superior error correction).
When all is said and done, I have some 30 CDs that in three yrs have caused me more problem than my DVDs and three decades of vinyl use combined. I'm frustrated, mad, disappointed. The very reason I have so few CDs is that I'm not motivated to buy CDs. I mean, I have hundreds of DVDs and LPs. I guess I'm just venting my frustration.
phn, Hugo
it's not CD technology that has us screamingly mad - overworked and uninterested goofs call themselves sound engineers nowadays.
Top 10 music (and I use the word "music" in the loosest possible sense here) gets dynamic compressed to a faretheewell, so it sounds "fat" on earkiller mp3 players - and the mucho stupidos use the same settings when remastering (leave the "master" out there) old tapes.
Gosh, aren't we lucky - I have a rather smallish LP shelf, only 600 or so, but they do for giving me goosebumps whenever I need music.
Pit
it's not CD technology that has us screamingly mad - overworked and uninterested goofs call themselves sound engineers nowadays.
Top 10 music (and I use the word "music" in the loosest possible sense here) gets dynamic compressed to a faretheewell, so it sounds "fat" on earkiller mp3 players - and the mucho stupidos use the same settings when remastering (leave the "master" out there) old tapes.
Gosh, aren't we lucky - I have a rather smallish LP shelf, only 600 or so, but they do for giving me goosebumps whenever I need music.
Pit
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