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Old 9th February 2007, 06:31 PM   #21
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I must tell you, Iíve never heard of this Wally Minto's Wonder Wheel.
It's most unfortunate that not many people have.

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Thanks man, Itís dam nice, it looks it might just work, I wonder what type of low boiling liquid with work the best without igniting then to then heated to much, how about Benzene, it evaporates very fast.
It most certainly works. Popular Science wouldn't have written it up if it didn't. I don't know what restrictions are in place in your country regarding Freon, but that would be the liquid of choice. Using Freon, you only need a temperature differential of 3.5 degrees F.. A black tarp over a tub of water would give you that easy.

-Casey
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Old 9th February 2007, 06:55 PM   #22
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freon
Iíve also never have heard of this chemical.
But if I can get it, it would be nice.
Do you by any change know if this device have the power to deliver power, like to drive a alternator and did you ever tried to build it, to check it out ?
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Old 9th February 2007, 07:37 PM   #23
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You need to read the article I linked to again, as well as the others listed in the Google search.

A 40 ft. wheel (or 10 4 ft. wheels on a common shaft) produces 8.69 hp, thats 6.48 Kw. The speed needs to be increased around a thousand times (it's all torque at low speed) through a tandem of 10to1 pulley/belt setups to get a usable speed to drive an alternator..but it most certainly will.

A point on alternators. You can fairly easily get up to 5 Kw out of an alternater by replacing the diode bridge with higher voltage ones, and modifying the field coil circut to produce 120 volts instead of 12, its the current limitations of the alternator that limits the theoretical output. 5Kw is the limit the alternator bearings can handle.

I was living in an area that was covered in snow and ice 8 months out of the year when I researched it, and have since moved to an area with cheap, clean Hydro power. I lost interest and never built one, but did enough homework to know it would work.

If I still had my notes I would share, but I don't. All of this is proven and low tech enough that if your serious, I suspect you could get a fully functional power plant up within a year, and an investment under $5K.

Besides the net, I would look at Lindsay's Books, for both the technology of alternators, as well as instruction material on the mechanics involved. Starting with this one.

Good luck

-Casey
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Old 9th February 2007, 08:41 PM   #24
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I am thinking more in building a small scale version, than a monster machine. Just to start of, it can be +- 400W just like my UPS. And the heat can be the sun or some burning wood or alcohol, with a high efficient heater.
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Old 10th February 2007, 09:43 AM   #25
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Does anyone know about his so called love meter thingy. If you hold the down part is your hand then and the liquid sucks up.
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Old 10th February 2007, 04:40 PM   #26
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Does anyone know about his so called love meter thingy.
Anybody who doesn't know about Wally's Wheel, or is familiar with that novelty toy, has got to think your nuts.

It does in fact demenstrate the very principle's involved, but works because of the short distance, and the skinny capillary between the bulbs. I think one of them dead smart guys invented it .

It uses alcohol.
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Old 10th February 2007, 05:08 PM   #27
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I don't believe it.

Look at the diagram. The claim is that it was running at 1 rpm. Think about what that means. The liquid in the bottom bottle is supposed to boil and recondense in the top bottle. At 1 rpm it has to boil and condense in 1/4 second (there are 4 bottles and each has to pass through the water tank). I find it hard to believe you'll be able to transfer enough energy from the warm water to the liquid in the bottle to boil it all (or enough to make the thing turn) in 1/4 second.

Think about large bottles of liquids and the mechanical support structure plunging into and out of the water tank 4 times per second. There's going to be a lot of work done to push the water aside. There's also going to be a hell of a lot of splashing.

There's no free lunch guys. The heat transferred has to be equivalent to the work required to raise the liquid from the bottom to the top bottle, which is what has to happen.

Imagine a large wheel. The tube will have to be large diameter to transfer the large amount of liquid/gas to the top bottle rapidly. What will prevent the liquid from condensing in the long tube and falling back into the bottom bottle?

This is why you don't see them everywhere: it doesn't work.

I_F
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Old 10th February 2007, 05:22 PM   #28
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Surely at 1 RPM it would require 15 seconds not 1/4 seconds?

maybe I'm being super dumb, which is entirely possible, I would think that it would work better with multiples of 3 bottles to get the balance off the vertical. or possibly with one way valves in a complete ring around the bottles

Nick.

Nice Idea, might try it with glass bottles and alcohol as a cheap experiment. Obviously using higher temperatures generated inefficiently.
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Old 10th February 2007, 05:32 PM   #29
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This is why you don't see them everywhere: it doesn't work.
I wont argue with your math, but a couple of things to consider.

The "1 rpm" claim was made by the reporter witnessing it (best guess), and the big wheel was never made to see if it would work. The key here is that the prototype was witnessed by an experienced science/technology reporter for Popular Science during their "salad days" before becoming what we see today.

Wally Minto was no charlatan. He had several write up's in the mag.

I believe the reason we don't see them around is two fold..1) a heck of a lot of work to construct a huge device for such a minimal output, and 2) It wouldn't be the first time something was developed for the "third world" that was rejected with the question "If it's so good, why aren't you using it?"

-Casey
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Old 10th February 2007, 05:59 PM   #30
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Originally posted by Grumpy_Git
Surely at 1 RPM it would require 15 seconds not 1/4 seconds?

Oops! You're right.

I still don't believe it is practical.

I_F
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