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Old 24th September 2005, 06:46 PM   #71
carlosfm is offline carlosfm  Portugal
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Good wine is like good hi-fi, it's almost ethernal.
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Old 24th September 2005, 06:51 PM   #72
SY is offline SY  United States
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I'll drink to that!
"You tell me whar a man gits his corn pone, en I'll tell you what his 'pinions is."
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Old 24th September 2005, 10:14 PM   #73
pjpoes is offline pjpoes  United States
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Though no doupt that much of the pricing in Audio is off the wall, and highly disproportionate to value, I have found that some of the DIY stuff I have done or would like to do can get quite expensive. One of the amp projects I want to do some day is make my own massive 500-1000 watt ultra high current amp inline with the large Macs, Music Fidelity's, and whoever else has made em that big. Mostly because I want to hear for myself if that much power would make for an effortless system, as the reviewers have said, and the amp makers. I only once heard such a system, I live near AudioClassics, which is a big Mac dealer, so I heard the complete top of the line refrence mac setup, probably half million dollars worth of gear, well atleast a quarter million. I was impressed, I dont think I would ever spend that much, but it was impressivly effortless, more so even than many horn systems I have heard. I looked into it, and I was quickly over 2000 dollars in parts alone using the kind of parts I had originally thought would be a good idea, and I still needed a chassis for it. At the same time, if I do ever build this thing, even made with the best parts money can buy, I probably still wont approach the 15-50,000 dollars that manufacturer statement pieces go for, and I would probably equal if not best the performance of many of them, given I go with a good design.

I also want to build a large set of speakers some day, something highyl efficiant and capable of huge dynamic swings, while being highly efficiant. Actually, USHER has a statement speaker that is basicly the design of my dream speaker, though I would wonder about the quality, Westlake audio has a better one, but for a cost. Same deal, I added up the costs of the parts, your quickly in the multi-thousand dollar price, and then cabinets would probably double the price of the project.

My point with this is that, even with DIY, trying out new audio equipment is a large investment. With premade stuff I can listen at a shop, sometimes, and hope to get a reasonable facsimile to what I might get at home, then if I like it, I have to buy it usually, but I get a 30 day money back guarantee. So I take it home, and hope that in 30 days I can be sure I want to live with it. With DIY, It usually costs me half as much or less, but at the expensve of being unable to try before I buy. So I spend the money, build the item, and end up stuck with it. On top of that, nobody wants to buy my creation, even if it does sound great for what it is, so if I dont like it, I have spent money fruitlessly. This is where I feel that reviews serve a purpose, and can benefit the public. They will never answer all my questions or give me all the information I need, but if they can get me into the ballpark, great. However, as is, most reviews are just semi-entertaining bits intermixed with more entertaining advertisements. As much as I would hate to see stereophile turn into Consumer reports, they atleast have pretty useful accurate reviews. Since I am not a videophile and dont care as much about the quality of my television picture, I tried to get the most reliable one I could. I have owned sony's in the past with ok luck, noticed that consumer reports rated JVC higher for reliability, I have one that is now 5 years old with no issues, and two broken sony's that are 7 and 3 years old, so they got that one right. I also have a broken Disen vacuum my parents bought for themselves, Consumer reports rated performance as good and reliability as bad, which is exactly my experience.
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Old 24th September 2005, 11:31 PM   #74
carlosfm is offline carlosfm  Portugal
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Originally posted by pjpoes
Though no doupt that much of the pricing in Audio is off the wall...
If you know someone on the retail business they will tell you that in high-end things cost what they sound.
My friend told me this many years ago and I was shocked. I took some time to swallow it, but it doesn't shock me anymore.

He told me: Carlos, the client doesn't care if it has just a pair of transistors inside, or a single chip, or whatever. He simply doesn't know and doesn't care.
If, for instance, a preamp costs 100 to manufacture but beats preamps in the 5.000 price tag, it is worth more than that, and it will sell for that price.

Take note: in hig-end you really PAY for quality.

The thing is... some things cost a lot of money and sound like junk.
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Old 25th September 2005, 03:10 AM   #75
Bratislav is offline Bratislav  Australia
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Originally posted by Jocko Homo
Agreed. How many other markets exist where the bulk of the consumers have to be told what to buy before they even sample it.
Hmmm. Way too many methinks. Cars. Tyres. Wine. Video gear (TVs/panels/DVD players). Restaurants. Hotels. Anything that gets advertised via "reviews" but is impossible to perform an in-depth evaluation by oneself one reason or another, or is subject to wide variations (cooks have good and bad days, hotels have rooms with nice veiews and ones next to the elevator shaft etc. etc. etc.).
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Old 25th September 2005, 01:31 PM   #76
carlosfm is offline carlosfm  Portugal
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Originally posted by Bratislav
Hmmm. Way too many methinks. Cars. Tyres. Wine. Video gear (TVs/panels/DVD players).
Well, excluding tyres, every other things you point here you can easily try before buying.
It is not wise not to do so.
The problem is, maybe there are too many people that don't mind to throw away money.
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