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Old 25th May 2004, 05:52 AM   #21
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My 2 cts worth (as if anybody cares...):

It really doesn't matter if you built 1, 10 or 37 amps. What matters is that when you start to sell them, you have no control over the weird things people do to them. No control over the speaker cables, the xover networks, the speakers. No control over whatever they shove down the input. But there is one thing a user hates most: a blown amp. Or, for that matter , an amp going into Spike protection.

It is simply a matter of responsible behaviour to try to avoid that type of problem for the unknown, unsuspection user. That is the real issue here, not whether PD's of FD's or mine amp works fine for me. I run my amps without fuses, because I think I know what I'm doing. But I wouldn't dream selling amps without fuses.

The responsible thing to do if you start selling these things is to put in a Zobel. And a fuse.

Jan Didden
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Old 25th May 2004, 07:19 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by fdegrove


Anyway, you could turn my remark about it the other way around and also wonder why on earth cable designers are putting out such high capacitance loudspeaker cable...at the risk of sending many amps into instablility?
You're probably talking very high capacitance cables now.
Otherwise, I know at least one case where low capacitance
is deliberately sacrificed in order to get low inductance, with
the motivation that a little extra capacitance doesn't matter
for speaker cables, but if anything matters at all, it is to have
low inductance. I wouldn't think those cables have so high
capacitance they would put you in jeopardy with normal
amps though. OTOH, normal amps have Zobel filters.
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Old 25th May 2004, 07:29 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by janneman
The responsible thing to do if you start selling these things is to put in a Zobel. And a fuse.

Jan Didden
I totally agree, but if it turns out that 1000 people use PD's amp and none of them are having trouble, then by statistics PD may be right but this is a gamble and I would not do anything like that if I wasn't very, very sure.

But the facts is that this Zobel thing isn't a major issue but I would recoommend Peter to connect a 10 m cable to a speaker and see what happens, and of course using an oscilloscope.

If Peter happens to sell readymade units I advice you to take a closer look to valid standards for safety and RFI/EMI with emphasis on safety. How should the power supply look like to fulfill standards?
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Old 25th May 2004, 07:35 AM   #24
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Default Re: You just did*

Quote:
Originally posted by Fred Dieckmann
"I will not say anything"*
... he he.... for one hour?
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Old 25th May 2004, 07:39 AM   #25
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Default Re: Public opion poll.........anyone?

Quote:
Originally posted by Fred Dieckmann
Who else on forum thinks I have no amplifier design experience
Fred, you don't have to prove anything and people don't have to listen to you. It is as simple as that. It is not a contest.

I say it again though that it would have been interesting to see what you have come up with.
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Old 25th May 2004, 07:55 AM   #26
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The whole audio chain should be regarded as one system. Cables and speakers definitely belong to it.
If the amp speakers impedance is corrected and the cable's properties allow it then you might run the amp without zobel. If not, use one.

If no one knows what will be connected to an amp in advance (most cases) a zobel AND a damped series inductor might be your life insurance.

Simple as that.

Regards

Charles
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Old 25th May 2004, 10:25 AM   #27
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Indeed. I forget to mention the damped series L, but for me that's part of the deal.

Jan Didden
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Old 25th May 2004, 10:44 AM   #28
ALW is offline ALW  United Kingdom
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Default Planet10

Quote:
Sure a Zobel makes proof against all sorts of stability issues, but there are also those who have made a stand that they won't use one because they don't like what it sounds like -- NAIM is the one that comes to mind... (they do specifiy no exotic speaker cable, because the amp is designed with the cable providing the funtionality of the zobel)
That isn't true, all Naim amps have a Zobel network, it's the series inductor at the output they lack, having a small series R and stipulating a speaker cable of moderate inductance to fulfil the role instead.

There's a clear stipulation in the user manual not to use cables other than Naim's own, without advice. The LCR specs of their cable are public knowledge, if one wants to try alternatives.

So even the most hard nosed use a Zobel, I wonder why?

Andy.
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Old 25th May 2004, 11:17 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by peranders

I totally agree, but if it turns out that 1000 people use PD's amp and none of them are having trouble, then by statistics PD may be right but this is a gamble and I would not do anything like that if I wasn't very, very sure.
[snip]


P-A,

Yes, but do you know how many millions of power amps have been produced since the dawn of SS audio, all with zobels & series L? Do you realise how cost concious manufacturers are? Do I have to spell out the conclusion?

Jan Didden
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Old 25th May 2004, 11:48 AM   #30
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Exclamation FIRE!!!

Nothing a little fire and a whopping lawsuit wouldn't change.
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