First off i'd like to say that i don't want to bring the great cable debate to this haven of sensibility 
I'm looking to connect my Aune X1S DAC's line out to my Topping TP-60's line in. The topping is eventually going to be quite modified. I have this problem where it drives me absolutely crazy if i have something and feel like i may be missing out, but i don't know enough science to be able to definitively answer this myself (give a man a fish...)
I am a DIYer through and through but i'm also lazy if it makes no difference and like to think i have got value for money. With this in mind, i am having trouble choosing to buy or build, because my DIY would use more expensive parts
There are ebay sellers selling RCA line cables using what looks like the cheapest Neutrik Rean RCAs and Van Damme tour grade XKE starquad classic cables for £14 a pair,delivered in the 25-30cm lengths i need.
My DIY would probably use the same cable(or VD session grade lo-cap coax), but some MS Audio Star Line plugs which appear to be copies of the Eichmann Bullet connectors, in rhodium plated tellurium copper, and cost about £17/pair but would require me to make them (and i'd want some better solder than the crap I have here now) so probably about £20/pair or £25/pair with the session grade cable
My question is, is it worth doing the DIY route? Will it actually make an audible difference?
I'm looking to connect my Aune X1S DAC's line out to my Topping TP-60's line in. The topping is eventually going to be quite modified. I have this problem where it drives me absolutely crazy if i have something and feel like i may be missing out, but i don't know enough science to be able to definitively answer this myself (give a man a fish...)
I am a DIYer through and through but i'm also lazy if it makes no difference and like to think i have got value for money. With this in mind, i am having trouble choosing to buy or build, because my DIY would use more expensive parts
There are ebay sellers selling RCA line cables using what looks like the cheapest Neutrik Rean RCAs and Van Damme tour grade XKE starquad classic cables for £14 a pair,delivered in the 25-30cm lengths i need.
My DIY would probably use the same cable(or VD session grade lo-cap coax), but some MS Audio Star Line plugs which appear to be copies of the Eichmann Bullet connectors, in rhodium plated tellurium copper, and cost about £17/pair but would require me to make them (and i'd want some better solder than the crap I have here now) so probably about £20/pair or £25/pair with the session grade cable
My question is, is it worth doing the DIY route? Will it actually make an audible difference?
I learned from spark plugs that iridium and platinum are actually less conductive than copper (I suspect the same of rhodium) Reason we use it is because it's very very hard and will have better longevity in the hot cylinder block environment.
That aside, copper is the standard that the conductivity of other metals are measured against. Silver is 105%, but everything else that I know of, including Gold is less conductive than copper. Gold is a darn good compromise though, because it is very close to copper, but will resist corrosion (oxidation), and after some months or years in a hi fi environment, the gold may be more conductive than a copper plug of the same age.
I know that wasn't your question,... I really like the Neutrik Profi connectors, they're like $15 or $20 USD per pair. They "look" like they sound as good as anything else I've ever seen! I once owned a pair of Nordost ($$$) cables -I swear they sounded good, but that was decades ago, and today looking back I think phychoaccoustically they sounded good because I believed it.
A few years ago I bought some nice (looking, but not most expensive) 12AWG oxygen free copper cable, some good looking inexpensive gold plated spades, good Cardas solder, pretty cable sheath, shrink tube, and made some speaker cables. They sounded okay, but I doubted my soldering abilities at the time (should I have used flux?). I put an ohm meter on them a few days later, and I got a barely a decimal (blinking back n forth on meter) point less resistance than some lamp cord that I compared them to. Honestly I was shocked that I could even measure a difference! But since then they sound better to me.
I like to make cables, cause I can make em look pretty without spending hundreds of dollars. I no longer measure them. I just like to believe they sound better.
If you have confidence in your solder skills, make some. If you doubt you could make them as well as someone else, then buy them. I'm really trying to stay out if the cable debate here, but I encourage you to go with what You Believe In. Make up your mind, then don't look back, and never doubt your decision.
That aside, copper is the standard that the conductivity of other metals are measured against. Silver is 105%, but everything else that I know of, including Gold is less conductive than copper. Gold is a darn good compromise though, because it is very close to copper, but will resist corrosion (oxidation), and after some months or years in a hi fi environment, the gold may be more conductive than a copper plug of the same age.
I know that wasn't your question,... I really like the Neutrik Profi connectors, they're like $15 or $20 USD per pair. They "look" like they sound as good as anything else I've ever seen! I once owned a pair of Nordost ($$$) cables -I swear they sounded good, but that was decades ago, and today looking back I think phychoaccoustically they sounded good because I believed it.
A few years ago I bought some nice (looking, but not most expensive) 12AWG oxygen free copper cable, some good looking inexpensive gold plated spades, good Cardas solder, pretty cable sheath, shrink tube, and made some speaker cables. They sounded okay, but I doubted my soldering abilities at the time (should I have used flux?). I put an ohm meter on them a few days later, and I got a barely a decimal (blinking back n forth on meter) point less resistance than some lamp cord that I compared them to. Honestly I was shocked that I could even measure a difference! But since then they sound better to me.
I like to make cables, cause I can make em look pretty without spending hundreds of dollars. I no longer measure them. I just like to believe they sound better.
If you have confidence in your solder skills, make some. If you doubt you could make them as well as someone else, then buy them. I'm really trying to stay out if the cable debate here, but I encourage you to go with what You Believe In. Make up your mind, then don't look back, and never doubt your decision.
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Yeah i use 40 amp dc automotive wire as speaker cable, soldered into cheap ebay china 'nanas.. it's my experience making them that puts me off making the rca leads a bit. Am a bit of a butcher when soldering the heavier stuff (i do component legs fine) and worry about melting the plastic on RCA plugs... and it was cheaper to do that because the cable was a free offcut
my diys in this case would be more expensive
my diys in this case would be more expensive
I know rhodium is less conductive than copper and gold, not sure about "hard gold" but (i could be wrong on this, my experience is with DC power electronics) but I think the electricity will follow the path of least resistance IE straight down the copper then out through the microns thickness of rhodium rather than along it. The superior oxidisation resistance and mechanical toughness of the rhodium plate is, i think, worth it considering the short distances involved.
Captain Indecision here is zeroing in on a decision!!!
MS Audio 'Star Line' RCA M x4 (Rhodium plated copper) £15.80
Quad eutectic LMP 4% silver solder - it's cheap enough if you only want a little bit and it has to be better than the wanhungelou brand 60:40 crap I have. This short length will be enough for these cables and the other bits of work i have in mind (eventually) £4.50
Van Damme 268-900-055 silver series session grade lo-cap 55 coax x1m £7.50
Some funky bootlaces I bought in my happy goth phase (many years ago!) but never used £0
The total cost of £27.80 is, i think, very reasonable considering the cost of buying decent RCA M-M leads and this is probably much overkill but there is no kill like overkill and i might as well do it properly because i'll be using these until they break beyond repair.
Captain Indecision here is zeroing in on a decision!!!
MS Audio 'Star Line' RCA M x4 (Rhodium plated copper) £15.80
Quad eutectic LMP 4% silver solder - it's cheap enough if you only want a little bit and it has to be better than the wanhungelou brand 60:40 crap I have. This short length will be enough for these cables and the other bits of work i have in mind (eventually) £4.50
Van Damme 268-900-055 silver series session grade lo-cap 55 coax x1m £7.50
Some funky bootlaces I bought in my happy goth phase (many years ago!) but never used £0
The total cost of £27.80 is, i think, very reasonable considering the cost of buying decent RCA M-M leads and this is probably much overkill but there is no kill like overkill and i might as well do it properly because i'll be using these until they break beyond repair.
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It's worth making your own if it makes you feel happy. To build a decent
pair of RCA cables might cost easily 10-15 € in parts and I don't have to
tell you that you would need a good hour of worktime assuming you have
all it takes to fabricate one.
Audible differences?
Would an average family car, just by installingimproved spark plug cables, become any faster?
I have built my own out of a C209 microphone cable (tasker.com)
and some generic RCA jacks.
Yes. It makes me happy. I can quote science to myself endlessly justifying the purchase. Just like red cars are always faster. As i've said elsewhere, i'm trying to get the absolute best out of what I feel is a well chosen setup in a bid to make it sound like thousands of euros to my ear instead of a few hundred
I used Kimber Kable interconnects for years and was happy. But after reading up on some of the threads, I ditched them for making my own in a quick and simple fashion.
I ended up purchasing Belden coax cable and Belden RCA compression connectors(all my equipment is unbalanced). I already had the tools for running video coax around the house, so in rapid fashion, I created several RCA interconnect pairs and I've been very, very pleased with the results.
I ended up purchasing Belden coax cable and Belden RCA compression connectors(all my equipment is unbalanced). I already had the tools for running video coax around the house, so in rapid fashion, I created several RCA interconnect pairs and I've been very, very pleased with the results.
I think about it like this. I spent several hundred hours on each component, from source to speakers. Do I hook them up with lamp cord speaker wires and the interconnect that came free with my dvd player. No. So I can buy fancy wires, or I can make fancy wires. If I buy fancy wires, there is always the next more expensive wire that I could have bought. If I make fancy wires, I can apply everything I can think of to make them "tricked out", silver, flat conductors (ebay fine silver bezel wire), microcrystalline wax, cotton, teflon... whatever floats my boat. If the skeptics are right, it doesn't matter and I'm fine. I had fun, I didn't spend serious money, and I have wires. If the golden ears are right, I have seriously tricked out wires. No next model up to drive me crazy. I can make something else and swap it in and compare. DIY fun. In short, if it doesn't matter, I'm good, if it matters, I'm good. Make 'em if you have time.
I have heard talks of golden ears (reviewers) how different this and
different that changes this or that and this all lasted for as long as they
were receiveing paychecks from the magazine the were working for.
Of course, the more it costs, the better it performs and only paired
to equivalently priced electronics. That's funny, how does a piece of wire
know when it's linked to a high performance piece of equipment?
Miles and miles of wire from the power plant , through the distribution
grid and all the way to entering one's own home, doesn't have to be
very special, but the last meter of it, that's where all the laws of physics
brake and the golden ear rules start to apply.
different that changes this or that and this all lasted for as long as they
were receiveing paychecks from the magazine the were working for.
Of course, the more it costs, the better it performs and only paired
to equivalently priced electronics. That's funny, how does a piece of wire
know when it's linked to a high performance piece of equipment?
Miles and miles of wire from the power plant , through the distribution
grid and all the way to entering one's own home, doesn't have to be
very special, but the last meter of it, that's where all the laws of physics
brake and the golden ear rules start to apply.
Don't fret much about conductivity. The load impedances swamp any of those considerations- as Pano showed, even a potato works fine. To put numbers to it, let's say you have an interconnect with 1 ohm of DCR and the load is 10k. The loss is then 20 log (10,000/10,001) = 0.001 dB. Double that resistance and the loss is 0.0017 dB. This is enormously smaller than even a bat can hear.
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