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Old 3rd February 2004, 08:32 PM   #1
Magura is offline Magura  Denmark
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Default Machining (was fully silver wired)

Quote:
Originally posted by eeka chu


Looks like I'll have to move to Denmark!

Do you have these at your house? They look like some seriously expensive tools. I thought I saw the BP close $100,000 new. I imagine tooling is not a fun job either.

I found a video clip of the Daewoo centre running and remembered using an old manual BP to machine something. I had to take off about half a mm per pass before it began oscillating. The Daewoo seems to be slicing thru the metal.

Very impress stuff!

I'm still stuck using a Denford Orac CNC lathe.
It's small enough that I'm even considering dragging it into the house so I can wind coils in the warm.

John

I fortunately dont have them at my house, but at the workshop approx. 100 meters from home.

The BP is around 200,000 usd, i happen to remember since its brand new

I prefer the BP any day to the daewoo. They both are sporting 25 KW spindle power and a max of 6,000 RPM, bút the BP is running heidenhain 430....thats simply superior to any other system.
They both will happily do more than 10mm cuts at 32mm tool dia. , but the daewoo is somewhat challenged when it comes to the chip conveyor...its very underdimentioned.

Besides all that, the BP is faster and generally more userfriendly

Magura
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Old 4th February 2004, 06:48 PM   #2
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Sorry... 10mm cuts? That is evil!

Do you download programs to the controllers or write them straight into them?

I'm taking a totally random guess here... but would I be right in thinking that you make a living by doing prototyping or custom machining? I mean, a centre that costs the better part of a quater of a million dollars has to be used for something other than having fun with right?!

I really appreciate CNC gear, probably since I own a CNC tool myself. While others consider things made with to be paint works of art, I consider things so well made, to such incredible precisions, to also be a works of art in their own right. People underestimate the amount of work in a lot of what CNC provides them with.

I never thought a chip conveyor could be so useful until I saw such machinery spraying chuncks of metal off their tooling.

I'm not questioning your judgement, but why did you decide to go for a new BP? I am genuine in my questioning. I know a lot of second hand machinery has often been quite badly treated by it's operators. Have you considered making the jump to 5 axis machining? If I remember rightly, Haas sell some of their 5 axis centres for around $3-400,000.

click me...

I soooo wish I had this kind of gear in my workshop!

John
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Old 4th February 2004, 07:13 PM   #3
Magura is offline Magura  Denmark
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Ohh...you got it a bit wrong.

Im in the lucky situation that i dont own the machines (my employer does), but i can use them as much as i please...free of charge. This brings me 3 major benefits.

1) i dont have to trouble with financing them (or pay for maintainance)....im free to do whatever i wanna do , instead of being pushed to make commercial stuff to make two ends meet.

2) There are so many different machines...each with their own special benefits....no way thats gonna happen in a home workshop.

3) Tools are not an object....i know of very few tools i dont have access to....all the newest and best...at no cost!

I have a crap job from 7am to 3:30pm, it is custom machining and toolmaking, but terribly boring.....4pm, and life begins

Ohh, and the chip conveyor....id go crazy if i didnt have one on any machine i use. The workshop includes 3 machines without....i never touch them.

I have acces to a 5 axis Daewoo puma (cant remember the number) and a wasino as well(too cant remember the model number). 5 axis is rarely a benefit. They lack (generally) rigidity, and therefore are not really interesting. I actually frequently find myself making quite complicated programs to use a 3 axis instead of a 5 axis.

Most of the programming i do on the spot. The heidenhain software is very adept and surely invites you to program even rather complicated things manually rather than using cad-cam. I do have mastercam, but am not all that happy with it....i cant get to terms with it for some reason


Ill bring home one of the heatsinks ive machined last year and make a photo with the webcam. Its done on the BP....a curved heatsink, to be mounted on a cylindrical cabinet It shows quite well what heidenhain is good for...all programming is done manually.


Magura


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Old 5th February 2004, 02:34 PM   #4
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I am looking forward to seeing what you can do manually on the controllers!

Out of interest, what kind of finishes can these machines get? I used a shell tool, on the BP I mentioned, and I managed to get something fairly smooth with almost no errors in it to the touch. If I held the surface up to the light, I could see bumps in it however.

Since the ways on most of these machines are covered, does that mean it's alright to use wearable abrasive tools to finish surfaces with? Like a lapping plate?

John
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Old 6th February 2004, 04:22 PM   #5
Magura is offline Magura  Denmark
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I rarely see reason for a lapping tool in a milling machine, but it shure wouldnt do any harm, since everything is sealed off reasonably well.

You can get Ra 0.5 without trying too hard, 0.3 if you really have to.

Here are some pics of the heatsinks. I am aware of the lousy quality, but theyre made by webcam since i dont have a real digicam.

Magura
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Old 6th February 2004, 04:23 PM   #6
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Old 6th February 2004, 04:24 PM   #7
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Old 12th February 2004, 09:18 PM   #8
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Hi Magura,

I'm sorry I didn't reply earlier, I've been a bti busy with things!

I like the heatsinks! The control must be incredibly powerful to be able to program something like that directly into it. Does it take long? I mean, it takes me about half an hour to get my lathe to take a straight pass!

I guess the manual mode is mainly a secondary feature and most of the time you have the machine taking downloads from some form of CAD program right?

I sooo want one of these things!

John
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Old 13th February 2004, 12:36 AM   #9
Magura is offline Magura  Denmark
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Quote:
Originally posted by eeka chu
I like the heatsinks! The control must be incredibly powerful to be able to program something like that directly into it. Does it take long? I mean, it takes me about half an hour to get my lathe to take a straight pass!

Thanks

To make the programs for the entire heatsink took something like 4 or 5 hrs. but then again...they took more than that to machine a piece running the mill full throttle (6000RPM).


I use manual programming mode mostly, with the heidenhain its no big deal to make even as complicated programs as the heatsinks manually. It may even be quite a bit faster than making the part in mastercam and postprocessing it, since you get better tooling by doing it manually, ie. no double runs or backwards runs, so you can speed up things to their max. wich is usually not possible with CAM made programs.

It all depends of complexity, but the line is moving towards making more manually than on the CAM.

Wich controlsystem do you have on your lathe?

Half an hour of programming for a straight run sounds like a lot. I may be able to give you a few hints to speed up the process....its a pitty to have such a machine just collecting dust.


Magura
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