Dielectric strength - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > General Interest > Everything Else

Everything Else Anything related to audio / video / electronics etc) BUT remember- we have many new forums where your thread may now fit! .... Parts, Equipment & Tools, Construction Tips, Software Tools......

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 28th July 2011, 01:10 PM   #1
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
M Gregg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Default Dielectric strength

SY,

Dielectric strength,

How does this link to bonding of electrons within atomic structure?

Regards
M. Gregg
__________________
What is the sound of one hand clapping?
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2011, 06:49 AM   #2
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
M Gregg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
So here is the first question:

What happens to the bonding of the electrons as the material ages?
I notice that if you measure insulation resistance value over a period "Years" the value will drop until flash over takes place.

Regards
M.Gregg
__________________
What is the sound of one hand clapping?
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2011, 07:51 AM   #3
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
M Gregg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
For anyone interested:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulator_(electrical)

Just gives some background might be of interest.

Regards
M. Gregg
__________________
What is the sound of one hand clapping?
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2011, 09:56 AM   #4
SY is offline SY  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
SY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Chicagoland
Blog Entries: 1
If you're reading Wikipedia, look at this:

Dielectric strength - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It's actually a pretty good article. Note that vacuum has a dielectric breakdown voltage, and one that is rather intermediate in their list of materials.
__________________
You might be screaming "No, no, no" and all they hear is "Who wants cake?" Let me tell you something: They all do. They all want cake.- Wilford Brimley
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2011, 02:26 PM   #5
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
M Gregg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by SY View Post
If you're reading Wikipedia, look at this:

Dielectric strength - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It's actually a pretty good article. Note that vacuum has a dielectric breakdown voltage, and one that is rather intermediate in their list of materials.
Yes the vacuum is interesting also the difference with extruded teflon Vs Film.

Looking at:

Avalanche breakdown - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disruptive_discharge

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakdown_voltage <<<<vacuum

I still wonder about the reduction of insulation resistance over time. Apart from contamination and absorption which would make sense. The ambient temperature effects the insulation properties. However it does not say if this returns as ambient drops to normal. Or if the damage is done!

Regards
M. Gregg
__________________
What is the sound of one hand clapping?

Last edited by M Gregg; 29th July 2011 at 02:29 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2011, 02:29 PM   #6
SY is offline SY  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
SY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Chicagoland
Blog Entries: 1
Electron avalanche - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

More applicable to materials like plastic or gases.
__________________
You might be screaming "No, no, no" and all they hear is "Who wants cake?" Let me tell you something: They all do. They all want cake.- Wilford Brimley
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2011, 10:32 PM   #7
BudP is offline BudP  United States
diyAudio Member
 
BudP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: upper left crust, united snakes
Two issues with dielectric materials in use. Temperature is an aging multiplier and corona is also. In transformers we exclude oxygen molecules, to the best of our ability, to allow maximum mtbf from the dielectric barriers that keep electrical gear from becoming Darwinian selection devices.

Different materials require different storage mechanisms to keep them from aging due to other environmental threats. An example is Kapton film, which must be kept from moisture and cold temperatures, which will accelerate that materials aging.

Bud
__________________
"You and I and every other thing are a dependent arising, empty of any inherent reality" Tsong Ko Pa
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2011, 07:53 AM   #8
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
M Gregg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Thank's Bud,

Thats realy interesting.

Open question.
So what is happening to the materials to enable reduced resistance or increased conduction to take place? (aging)

Regards
M. Gregg
__________________
What is the sound of one hand clapping?
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2011, 09:24 AM   #9
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
M Gregg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Thought I would post this because I found it interesting.

http://www.ipme.ru/e-journals/RAMS/no_21306/amin.pdf

Not quite what we are covering but still interesting!

Then this:

http://www2.le.ac.uk/departments/eng...tric-phenomena

Seems to be much closer.

Regards
M. gregg
__________________
What is the sound of one hand clapping?

Last edited by M Gregg; 31st July 2011 at 09:33 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2011, 10:49 AM   #10
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
M Gregg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
This again may be interesting to some,

http://eprints.ecs.soton.ac.uk/16113/1/04543118.pdf

Just for interest.

http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_1/chpt_12/8.html <<<easier

Over to SY's book I think.... Shive and Weber, "Similarities in Physics."

Regards
M. Gregg
__________________
What is the sound of one hand clapping?

Last edited by M Gregg; 31st July 2011 at 11:11 AM.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ribbon Field Strength Borat Planars & Exotics 18 10th October 2009 06:19 PM
Metal strength for enclosure rtarbell Parts 5 6th September 2008 07:39 PM
Electrical field strength Bazukaz Planars & Exotics 5 13th June 2006 03:31 PM
maximum inputsignal strength(V) on the lm3886? demogorgon Chip Amps 2 9th December 2004 08:11 PM
DIY Field strength meter ! darkm4n Parts 7 3rd February 2004 08:04 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 10:05 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2