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Old 5th March 2011, 05:10 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john curl View Post
Brian Cheney's strong advice to break them in with real music or sweeping test tones for 200 Hrs before trying anything else.
Perhaps if this was indicated in their literature. I saw no such suggestion.

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I know this seems stupid and difficult to you, but there it is.
Difficult? No.

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I will give you his number, privately.
Thank you, we can discuss this after further testing if am not satisfied with the results.

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Originally Posted by dave_gerecke View Post
I for one commend Cal for taking the monetary and time investments to do this evaluation.
Thank you Dave.

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Of course, from reading Cal's first post, the most obvious thing I can determine is that Cal has WAY too many different drivers laying around.
Geez Dave I only took drivers off three different shelves. I have a room full of that kinda thing.

Mind you I don't begin to hold a candle to planet10. I am addicted it's true but he's plain nuts.
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Old 5th March 2011, 05:13 PM   #12
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I am still interested in knowing if any of you have suggestions as to other tests I may conduct that might shed some light on these devices. Please keep these to listening type tests as my equipment is limited and others have more knowledge in that area.
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Old 5th March 2011, 05:23 PM   #13
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Try doing blind listening. Short or long term, your choice. It's not hard to set up and there are a lot of possible formats. If you want to do so, shoot me an email.
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Old 5th March 2011, 06:13 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cal Weldon View Post
I am still interested in knowing if any of you have suggestions as to other tests I may conduct that might shed some light on these devices. Please keep these to listening type tests as my equipment is limited and others have more knowledge in that area.
What I would like to know is, if the "Bybee Filters" change the the electrical propagation characteristics of the cables/wires due to increases in capacitance or inductance. Similar to what happens when you clamp on a ferrite over a cable.
A small change in reactance as opposed to resistance would be audible, not necessarily for better or worse, just different.
 
Old 5th March 2011, 09:34 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Cal Weldon View Post
I am still interested in knowing if any of you have suggestions as to other tests I may conduct that might shed some light on these devices. Please keep these to listening type tests as my equipment is limited and others have more knowledge in that area.
Use your favorite speakers, put one in the tweeter on one side, play mono and listen for a few hours, then switch which side it is in. If it takes long term listening that may do it.

But at the very least you should be sure all your gear has the AC plugs flipped correctly, the audio interconnects are clean and broken in, the electronics are mechanically isolated and the beer cold. Yes I am serious a single beer does actually measurably improve listening ability for some folks.
 
Old 5th March 2011, 10:03 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by simon7000 View Post
Yes I am serious a single beer does actually measurably improve listening ability for some folks.
No one here is going to challenge that.

I will be running them on a sine sweep 20 - 20 for a few days before I do further testing. Thanks for your ideas.
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Old 6th March 2011, 05:28 PM   #17
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Hi Cal,
Now there is a very balanced and truthful report. Most people do not have the patience to test as many drivers as you have. Kudos sir!

I'm going to second Simon7000's advice. Use your best stuff - the stuff you personally prefer and not what anyone else feels is the best. Just install the Bybee devices on both tweeters, or mid - high channels if you're setup is actively crossed over. Then, simply listen for a couple weeks. After that, remove the devices and listen for another few days to a week. If they affect the sound in any way at all, you will notice.

I'd suggest listening to some of your music that has some delicate high frequency material. Female vocals (well, most anyway) will also tend to show differences. Nothing is a rush here, and beer simply makes you more susceptible to suggestion.

If anyone has a really good LCR meter, technical properties can be measured relatively easily. I use an HP (Agilent now) 4263A, and I very commonly use it to show me differences in capacitor quality. The dissipation reading is the most indicative of component quality. It's easy to sort good silver mica capacitors from the not-as-good ones. Same for resistors and inductances. The readings on the meter agree with what I think I hear from listening tests conducted before the measurements. Anyone who is close to you can conduct these tests for you. They don't have to listen to them.

My own system has 4 ohm rated speakers that use Al dome tweeters (I think they are aluminum). I find they will reveal any slight problems with the electronics, and being 4 ohm, more sensitive to changes in impedance between the amplifier and them. However, I doubt I can lend any useful information through listening over what you can.

See if anyone close to you has better equipment (LCR meter for example). I also have an audio network analyzer (HP 35665A). I don;t expect it to reveal anything beyond what the LCR will tell me.

-Chris
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Old 7th March 2011, 02:03 AM   #18
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John Curl,

Do you think the frequency sweep should be done from 20 - 20K and should be done straight as in 8 days or is it ok to do it at 8 hrs a day for 24 days? Either way is fine but seems excessive. I wish to give the device some validity and would appreciate your input.

Others, please steer clear unless you have some positive burn-in ideas.
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Old 7th March 2011, 02:23 AM   #19
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Hi Cal,
Experience from others I have talked to seem to center on random noise to break in the entire audio system. That's the safest way since a straight tone will concentrate too much energy in one spot, so it doesn't sound as loud as it really is until you hit midrange and it hurts.

Two things to watch out for no matter what method you use. First, make sure your amp(s) never even get close to clipping. Secondly, make sure you never allow more than a single watt in the tweeter's band of operation. Mids can take more, but not anywhere near what a woofer will absorb without damage. Some better tweeters may take more than a couple watts without damage, but without knowing exactly what you are using and specifics of the crossover, it's best to err on the safe side.

I hope you view those as positive burn-in ideas (or cautions).

John's advice seems pretty clear to me, not unless you are looking for his strong preference, or the way he actually does a burn-in. I would think that a continuous burn-in might be what he's looking for, but I'm no expert there. I don't even know if dummy loads would suffice, or if you need to burn in your speakers with the devices. Keep in mind that the work SY did may qualify for some burn-in time. Maybe DC tests would create the need for longer burn-in time? It would be good for John Curl to drop in with the finer points of burning a system in (rather than out).

-Chris
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Old 7th March 2011, 03:01 AM   #20
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Cal, why don't you ask Brian Cheney like I asked you to do? Then you will have first hand knowledge. However, I suspect that this 'break-in' will not satisfy you, because you do not appear to have a reference listening standard that you know well, and can compare to. A single Bybee is subtle, not overwhelming, and usually sounds lousier when first plugged in, without break-in, BUT it does make a serious change in many systems. I have been there and heard it myself, when the sound actually got worse (over-damped sounding) and we had to remove them immediately. No soldering was required in Jack's demo, 15 years ago. I was just there for lunch and to visit the hi fi store.
 

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