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Old 6th September 2010, 08:21 PM   #461
SY is offline SY  United States
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Yes, it does look very much like he's taken a cheap COTS part and painted it up. And copperweld would be pretty standard on a cheap part like that, same as is used in the 50 cent resistor I got from Mouser to use as a reference.
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Old 6th September 2010, 08:31 PM   #462
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It would be nice to send these to Kenpeter for X-rays when SY has finished.
 
Old 6th September 2010, 08:33 PM   #463
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Default Testing methodology

Hi to all. I have not heard the Bybee treatments, but i would sure like to see how they perform when subjected to tests such as Nordost did on their cables and supply combo.

In short, they showed a new way of measuring which came up with significant differences and pretty much prove that YES they do perform better than zip cord. Please investigate this issue, it could be of similar application with the Bybee stuff.

This info is found at:
1) nordost.com/downloads.asp

2) find New Approaches To Audio Measurement.pdf

Nordost presents an ACTUAL TESTING PROCEDURE using new forms of measurement, for some of the factors that have previously been held to be not measurable or audible.... and which to my eyes look like solid evidence that indeed, some cables, connectors, power conditioners etc. actually DO present significant differences which closely track perceived improvement.

It would be great to see how Bybee performs when tested as shown in the Nordost paper.

My apologies if any one has already brought this up but I haven't been able to read through the whole thread. If this is new information, I hope it helps in your studies.

All the Best.
 
Old 6th September 2010, 08:49 PM   #464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john curl View Post
Apparently, it does not effect the 'performance' however, the military often does mandate this, rather than pure copper.
He's not making it for the military that often mandates the use of bailing wire for resistor leads.

He's making it for audiophiles who don't.

Furthermore, selling them claiming the leads to be copper is fraud.

se
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Old 6th September 2010, 08:51 PM   #465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordost
Traditional audio measurement approaches are based in the frequency domain, using FFT technology and the steady state test tones it relies on.
This does not fill me with confidence that they know what they're talking about.
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Old 6th September 2010, 08:59 PM   #466
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This does not fill me with confidence that they know what they're talking about.
Me either. And of course it's possible they know what they're talking about but are simply blowing smoke up the reader's ***.

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Old 6th September 2010, 09:34 PM   #467
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marketing, what else to expect
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Old 6th September 2010, 09:40 PM   #468
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After reading those articles, I'm pretty sure it's a marketing ploy. No wonder people get confused reading this stuff.

Audio tests have included "chirps" and other extremely dynamic (and repeatable) signals. In addition, they are pretty good at controlling all the various situations that can affect the outcome of a test.

Bottom line from the two articles (I read both)? Spend more on cables, like up to 50% of your total budget! Also, clean AC power is paramount. Seems to me that the job of your power supply (normally included when you buy the equipment ) is to isolate the circuits from the garbage on the line.

People, if your equipment has a properly designed power supply, nothing done to the incoming AC power will have an audible effect, short of disconnecting the power that is. Having said that, most devices I see do not have a properly designed power supply.

-Chris
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Old 6th September 2010, 09:47 PM   #469
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Default confidence in measurements

No confidence in Nordost? So?

I'm not talking about their marketing hype, I'm talking about the MEASUREMENTS and the METHODOLOGY referred to in my previous post.

the measurements referred to in the Nordost presentation appear to have been done by people who indeed DO seem to know what they're doing.

They also appear quite valid to me. (Yes. I know nothing, but I also have a BSEE. Still ignorant though. Only difference is with enough education it became clearer to me just how much I don't know, which is a lot.)

HEY!
The fact that the Nordost marketing people don't seem to know how to word the info properly in some of their publications should not detract from the validity of the test method, nor of the tests themselves.
It could be useful to not throw out the good with the bad before we've had a good look at what people are doing or judging them for stupid marketing prose.

Otherwise we might be missing the central point..(Hello, Sy?)... which is:

LOOK AT THE METHODOLOGY described on that paper, it might be useful for this specific testing of the Bybee and/or other forms of what suspect to be magic dust.

After all, until they thoroughly read the Nordost paper, and ponder its implications, many of my fellow engineers will probably still "know for sure" that there is no difference in cables.... BUT...
Now that someone has devised a meaningful test procedure that shows significant differences, repeatedly and reliably, under controlled circumstances months apart, well, I wonder if suddenly these same engineers will suddenly be able to hear the difference? (Power of suggestion works in reverse too!)

As for Nordost, I have heard it and it sounded pretty freakin' good when compared to several other cables. Can't buy em yet, too expensive for me.
And I wonder just how much of a change the Bybees make, but will probably never know because it looks like too much expenditure.

That we may not be able to measure a difference with our EXISTING tests, doesn't mean we won't be able to with other methodologies.

And just for the record, my guess is that the Bybees are snake oil, but I am not willing to state that as a truth....'cause I don't know if it is!... and... because in a year or so, there might be some test that shows they are indeed helpful. And I don't like cleaning rotten egg off my face, much less getting it on there in the first place.
 
Old 6th September 2010, 09:51 PM   #470
SY is offline SY  United States
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Actually, the data presented in the Nordost deal didn't really indicate that there was a difference beyond test repeatability. Hard to say because the graphs are so low res, you can't read the scales and they presented no data showing run to run repeatability. Some of the graphs looked like there was binning and windowing error- maybe deliberate, maybe incompetence, I have no idea. This was clearly written for marketing purposes and clearly by either someone who didn't know what he was doing or someone who does but assumes his audience doesn't.
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