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Old 20th January 2010, 12:03 PM   #1
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Default Interconnect-screen to earth?

Hi

Im making some interconnect cables (with mundorf silver/gold waire and eichmann bullets).

Normal way of screening:
You connect the metalwoven screen to ground, at one end. (Thereby getting star-connection). However ... it means, that you get all the EMI noise introduced into the signalpath!

My idea
I just got a copper earth grounding spear at my house, for hifi.
Why dont i also make an extra metalwoven sleeve - on the outside of the cable (or any interconnect cable for that instance) - and connect it to my new earth?

so the construction is:

1 signal wire (+)
2 insulation
3 screen (zero)
4 insulation
5 screen (earth)

or

1 signal wire (+)
2 insulation
3 signal wire (zero)
4 insulation
5 screen (connected to zero at one end)
6 insulation
7 screen (earth)



Peter
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Old 20th January 2010, 12:20 PM   #2
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
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an earthing rod separated from the mains distribution board earth is potentially very dangerous.

Search for information on the risks you are taking and for the measures required to reduce these risks.

This is not as simple as you think.

I do not recommend a home built earthing rod be connected to any household equipment. It is too dangerous if something is not as expected.
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Old 20th January 2010, 01:18 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewT View Post
an earthing rod separated from the mains distribution board earth is potentially very dangerous.

Search for information on the risks you are taking and for the measures required to reduce these risks.

This is not as simple as you think.

I do not recommend a home built earthing rod be connected to any household equipment. It is too dangerous if something is not as expected.
Its not homebuild. An electrician made it ...
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Old 20th January 2010, 02:28 PM   #4
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pedefede View Post
Its not homebuild. An electrician made it ...
how did the electrician check that the homemade earthing rod was performing as expected?
How often does he come back to check that the homemade earthing rod is still performing up to specification?
How does he measure that it continues to meet specification?
What happens when lightning strikes nearby?
What is the voltage difference between the distribution board earth and the homemade earthing rod?
Is this voltage consistent during various weather conditions?

These are only some of the questions that researching of the risks would prompt.

I am no expert. I know my limitations. I do that by informing myself about what I don't know and know when not to poke my finger in. I cannot advise you on how to do a homemade earthing rod properly nor safely.
With electricity one does not get nine lives.
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Old 20th January 2010, 03:29 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewT View Post
how did the electrician check that the homemade earthing rod was performing as expected?
It isn't homemade. HE made it!

Quote:
How often does he come back to check that the homemade earthing rod is still performing up to specification?
How does he measure that it continues to meet specification?
What happens when lightning strikes nearby?
What is the voltage difference between the distribution board earth and the homemade earthing rod?
Is this voltage consistent during various weather conditions?

These are only some of the questions that researching of the risks would prompt.
Nice questions .. ill measure them soon.

He did say though, that there was (supposed to be?) earthening on the mains close to the house as well. So as long as both connections was propor (and i think he did his job well), there shouldnt be any relevant voltage difference - or safety risk. (I did ask him the question when he installed it.)
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Old 20th January 2010, 04:59 PM   #6
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Store bought or home made a earthing rod (ground rod over here) should only connect to the AC power system (and then to your A/V system) at one common point and that point is the main entry of your AC power. If lightning strikes nearby the ground current from the strikes may develop hundreds or thousands of volts between non-connected earthing rods.
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Old 20th January 2010, 05:16 PM   #7
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If I understand you correctly, this excerpt from IEEE 1100 "Recommended Practice for Powering and Grounding Sensitive Electronic Equipment" is most pertinent:

9.10.12.2 Special Forms of Earth Grounding Electrodes. The use of any separate, isolated, insulated, dedicated, clean, quiet, signal, computer, electronic, or other such improper form of earth grouding electrodes for use as a point of connection of the IG EGC is not recommended. These improper IG grounding schemes do not meet code requirements for effective grounding. The generally perceived need for an isolated earth grounding electrode scheme in relation to the IG method is not based on good engineering practice. Isolated earth grounding electrode designs have no means for limiting the potential developed across the intervening impedance in the commonly shared grounding medium (e.g., earth) when a current is caused to flow through it. As a result, lightning may create conditions of several thousands to tens of thousands of volts between two (or more) such earth grounding electrodes. AC system ground faults may create similar problems in relation to the ac system's nominal line-to-ground voltage and the fault-current magnitude.

In short, your electrician doesn't know his code (at least in the US) and your idea is not recommended. Nowhere in this IEEE standard are grounding systems not solidly bonded together (in one place, typically). You may have a surge protection grid, equipment grid, signal grid, etc., but in the end these systems all get bonded together SOLIDLY. Best insurance against EMI, along with an underground room at the North Pole.

Perhaps you could start at the beginning, and describe your EMI concerns / problems, and those could be resolved with more traditional solutions.
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Old 20th January 2010, 07:47 PM   #8
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
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why does it take my inept and amateurish prodding to get your attention to the fact that some guy is getting ready to kill himself and/or his family and/or his visitors?
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Old 20th January 2010, 07:55 PM   #9
SY is offline SY  United States
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What they said. Having a separate ground like that is potentially deadly!
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Old 20th January 2010, 10:24 PM   #10
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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There should be only one ground on mains, and one only
To have a second seperate grounding fore your hifi is ILLEGAL
You might not even be ensured if you do so

I know, because I asked the expert who did the new wireing on my old house, if I could do such a thing fore my hifi

And its dangerous not only to your health, but also to all your electrical devices
Nothing may happen if you are lucky, but should some malfunction occur, it will all go to hell
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