I Still Say "Experience And Constructive Comments Only".
Ooops..... Sorry guys....
Ok, so far is ....
Members who have actually heard QP = Nil
Members who are open to the subject = 5 - Frank, Thylantyr, Peter, Al and I.
Members who still dissenting = 4 - Sy, Ultrachrome, Stokessd, Pjotr.
It seems like some of you still cannot read the first post.
Eric.
Ooops..... Sorry guys....
Ok, so far is ....
Members who have actually heard QP = Nil
Members who are open to the subject = 5 - Frank, Thylantyr, Peter, Al and I.
Members who still dissenting = 4 - Sy, Ultrachrome, Stokessd, Pjotr.
It seems like some of you still cannot read the first post.
Eric.
Is this thread an investigation about forum members Eric?
I did dig through:
http://www.bybeetech.com./
Sorry Eric,
I am afraid we on this forum cannot be of much help. I would say try a BQP your self. Curious about your findings.
I did dig through:
http://www.bybeetech.com./
Sorry Eric,
I am afraid we on this forum cannot be of much help. I would say try a BQP your self. Curious about your findings.
For what it is worth.
A customer of mine that I built some rather high end speakers for tried them and loved them. He was freaked out about what a difference they made mounting them to the drivers in his speakers.
After a couple of months of goading (maybe three or four months) I finally tried them myself.
I was skeptical about them and believed and still do that much of the BS on the Bybee site is false and misleading.
However, mounting them to the positive binding post on the back of the speaker (clipped on) did make an obvious difference on my system.
It did lower the noise floor, made the highs clearer and more defined.
It was not huge or dramatic, but was not hard to hear.
I used my wife as a test subject and had her listen. She could tell a difference 100% of the time with them in or out of the circuit, and she is no audiophile.
The guys from Dodd Audio (Gary Dodd and Mark Nash) came over and they also clearly heard a difference and they really liked the effect of them in the circuit.
I could not see a lot of my customers buying these because of the cost of them and the fact that most of our customers purchase very inexpensive kits from us and in some cases the cost of 4 Bybee filters exceeded the cost of some of our kits.
But we also have some really high end customers as well and for them to spend a few hundred dollars to make an improvement in their system (systems well into the five figure range) it's a no brainer. I am more in that camp as well.
So I decided to become a dealer for the Bybee filters. Several other well respected people in this industry have also become dealers.
The discussion then came up on the Mad board and I started sending out pairs of them, free of charge, to be evaluated by the Nay sayers there.
Four of them tried them just as I had initially and they heard no difference.
They did confirm that no inductance, no capacitance, and no real measurable resistance could be found.
The last guy (Dave) heard no difference on his full range Jordans, but then tried them in his pre-amp and said this about them;
"There was no comparison as to the results. The musical product was more transparent with fewer artifacts, especially in the HF. Music flowed with no discernable hash in the treble. There was a definite "Ahhhhhhhh" factor at work. It went away when I removed the BQP from the circuits. Dimension of the soundstage was enhanced as well as apparent size in the soundfield. "
How these things work? I have no idea.
Some, including some that have tried them claim they do not work at all.
I believe there are reasons why they make clear and easy to hear changes on some systems and nothing on others. What they are I have no idea.
I think the jury is still out in making a conclusion that everyone can accept.
My advise is this:
If you have never tried them yourself you have little useful feedback, so don't throw flames (the Mad board is already on fire).
If you want to try them yourself there are certainly avenues by which you can.
A customer of mine that I built some rather high end speakers for tried them and loved them. He was freaked out about what a difference they made mounting them to the drivers in his speakers.
After a couple of months of goading (maybe three or four months) I finally tried them myself.
I was skeptical about them and believed and still do that much of the BS on the Bybee site is false and misleading.
However, mounting them to the positive binding post on the back of the speaker (clipped on) did make an obvious difference on my system.
It did lower the noise floor, made the highs clearer and more defined.
It was not huge or dramatic, but was not hard to hear.
I used my wife as a test subject and had her listen. She could tell a difference 100% of the time with them in or out of the circuit, and she is no audiophile.
The guys from Dodd Audio (Gary Dodd and Mark Nash) came over and they also clearly heard a difference and they really liked the effect of them in the circuit.
I could not see a lot of my customers buying these because of the cost of them and the fact that most of our customers purchase very inexpensive kits from us and in some cases the cost of 4 Bybee filters exceeded the cost of some of our kits.
But we also have some really high end customers as well and for them to spend a few hundred dollars to make an improvement in their system (systems well into the five figure range) it's a no brainer. I am more in that camp as well.
So I decided to become a dealer for the Bybee filters. Several other well respected people in this industry have also become dealers.
The discussion then came up on the Mad board and I started sending out pairs of them, free of charge, to be evaluated by the Nay sayers there.
Four of them tried them just as I had initially and they heard no difference.
They did confirm that no inductance, no capacitance, and no real measurable resistance could be found.
The last guy (Dave) heard no difference on his full range Jordans, but then tried them in his pre-amp and said this about them;
"There was no comparison as to the results. The musical product was more transparent with fewer artifacts, especially in the HF. Music flowed with no discernable hash in the treble. There was a definite "Ahhhhhhhh" factor at work. It went away when I removed the BQP from the circuits. Dimension of the soundstage was enhanced as well as apparent size in the soundfield. "
How these things work? I have no idea.
Some, including some that have tried them claim they do not work at all.
I believe there are reasons why they make clear and easy to hear changes on some systems and nothing on others. What they are I have no idea.
I think the jury is still out in making a conclusion that everyone can accept.
My advise is this:
If you have never tried them yourself you have little useful feedback, so don't throw flames (the Mad board is already on fire).
If you want to try them yourself there are certainly avenues by which you can.
At $80 each, that's 5 new CD's per channel, and that's just for a single application. Even if that charlatan who sells them could tell you how to use them, and how many you need, that's a bare minimum of 10 new albums rather than something that is a dubious improvement at best. I'm with you thylantyr, I'll take boobies in the face or new music over them any day.
Sheldon
Sheldon
As was mentioned before, I'm firmly in the nay-sayer camp. Mainly because there is no physics to back up the claims. As soon as the manufacturer provides something tangible (A patent application for example) to show that there is some actual physics there, then I'll start taking them seriously and may even consider listening to them. Until then, I'd rather stick to items that follow known rules.
Provide beef, and I'll shut up.
Sheldon
Provide beef, and I'll shut up.
Sheldon
I've been following the thread VERY closely
Now 3 or more guys who's hearing I respect have said they hear nothing when these blobs are attached to loudspeaker wires in any position.
dBe has said he 'thinks' he hears a difference when attached at line level, that's good enough for me..
seems these blobs may be very similar to ferrite beads, which are used extensively on computer leads, so one would assume that they do have some effect on cleaning up RF from very low level signals.
if they were say $5 each, maybe i would consider that they might actually DO something, but at $80 each,......... ?????
Now 3 or more guys who's hearing I respect have said they hear nothing when these blobs are attached to loudspeaker wires in any position.
dBe has said he 'thinks' he hears a difference when attached at line level, that's good enough for me..
seems these blobs may be very similar to ferrite beads, which are used extensively on computer leads, so one would assume that they do have some effect on cleaning up RF from very low level signals.
if they were say $5 each, maybe i would consider that they might actually DO something, but at $80 each,......... ?????
Sheldon, I've gotten patents and I've gotten mammaries in my face and I can affirm that the latter is preferable.
But you shouldn't be satisfied with a patent application (a USPTO search confirmed that Bybee had none) or even an issued patent. The USPTO is passing all sorts of garbage now, like superluminal transmitting systems. It would only confirm what you already know: they're making outlandish claims that have no relationship to physics, but cloak themselves in physics buzzwords.
I'd be a lot more impressed with independent data and valid listening tests; NRC's facility is available, if I'm not mistaken. The mechanism can be examined once the efficiacy is proved- that isn't likely, but one must keep the mind open just a crack.
But you shouldn't be satisfied with a patent application (a USPTO search confirmed that Bybee had none) or even an issued patent. The USPTO is passing all sorts of garbage now, like superluminal transmitting systems. It would only confirm what you already know: they're making outlandish claims that have no relationship to physics, but cloak themselves in physics buzzwords.
I'd be a lot more impressed with independent data and valid listening tests; NRC's facility is available, if I'm not mistaken. The mechanism can be examined once the efficiacy is proved- that isn't likely, but one must keep the mind open just a crack.
>Members who still dissenting = 4 - Sy, Ultrachrome, Stokessd, Pjotr.
>
>It seems like some of you still cannot read the first post.
Did I actually dissent? I am "still" dissenting because...why? I don't go buy one and listen to it?
I think you have gotten a wealth of information about this product if you just read between the lines and ask yourself, why do these people respond this way?
Are they secret agents for the department of low fidelity? Who doesn't want to improve their system? I think it's because this product has so many red flags, from its "testimonials" page to the fact that there are "NO RETURNS" at least on the ModWright site. On the other two US websites listed on Bybee's web page, I could not find the prodcut available for purchase.
I haven't read all the posts, but I think in general the dissenters are really trying to help in their own way.
>
>It seems like some of you still cannot read the first post.
Did I actually dissent? I am "still" dissenting because...why? I don't go buy one and listen to it?
I think you have gotten a wealth of information about this product if you just read between the lines and ask yourself, why do these people respond this way?
Are they secret agents for the department of low fidelity? Who doesn't want to improve their system? I think it's because this product has so many red flags, from its "testimonials" page to the fact that there are "NO RETURNS" at least on the ModWright site. On the other two US websites listed on Bybee's web page, I could not find the prodcut available for purchase.
I haven't read all the posts, but I think in general the dissenters are really trying to help in their own way.
BYGONES & MC BEAL....
Hi,
Question is, have any of the dissenters actually tried this or are they just dismissing it because they don't understand how it could possibly make a difference?
If I had some samples I'd certainly listen to them in my reference system, not only try to measure them in an already prejudiced state.
This afternoon I had the chance to listen to a friend's system that uses pure gold wired I/Cs even as a CDP to DAC I/C (my own design) and for once I could listen to CD for prolonged time without getting bored...mind you his analogue system sounded better still by quite a margin.
And no I won't reveal the total cost of that system because to me and you that should be irrelevant other than that I could achieve the same results at a fraction of the cost...but that's an other story, isn't it?
And should I tell my friend that???
Never dismiss anything out of hand folks,
Hi,
Question is, have any of the dissenters actually tried this or are they just dismissing it because they don't understand how it could possibly make a difference?
If I had some samples I'd certainly listen to them in my reference system, not only try to measure them in an already prejudiced state.
This afternoon I had the chance to listen to a friend's system that uses pure gold wired I/Cs even as a CDP to DAC I/C (my own design) and for once I could listen to CD for prolonged time without getting bored...mind you his analogue system sounded better still by quite a margin.
And no I won't reveal the total cost of that system because to me and you that should be irrelevant other than that I could achieve the same results at a fraction of the cost...but that's an other story, isn't it?
And should I tell my friend that???
Never dismiss anything out of hand folks,
From my point of view......
There are 5 or 6 people who have tried them on the Mad board. I only take credence of their reports !!
So far the count is 1 for, the rest against. Danny is the prosective distributor and also the 1 for. But I trust Danny and ...well... he says he can here a difference. But on the other side, I also trust the hearing of other guys, Jeff B etc and maybe John K. We all hear and interpret sound differently !!
But the real clincher for me was when dBe said he could hear no difference when they were attached at speaker level signals. If anyone would pick up a difference, I think it would be Dave. And he is ALWAYS completely straight and says exactly what he means, no-one else influences him !!
I myself can only go on this evidence, but will not ridicule the product since I have not listened myself.
There are 5 or 6 people who have tried them on the Mad board. I only take credence of their reports !!
So far the count is 1 for, the rest against. Danny is the prosective distributor and also the 1 for. But I trust Danny and ...well... he says he can here a difference. But on the other side, I also trust the hearing of other guys, Jeff B etc and maybe John K. We all hear and interpret sound differently !!
But the real clincher for me was when dBe said he could hear no difference when they were attached at speaker level signals. If anyone would pick up a difference, I think it would be Dave. And he is ALWAYS completely straight and says exactly what he means, no-one else influences him !!
I myself can only go on this evidence, but will not ridicule the product since I have not listened myself.
Re: BYGONES & MC BEAL....
I'm curious. Have you tried this?
Take two photographs of yourself. One taken when you were a child and another when you were an adult. Place each individually into a clear plastic bag and place the two photos in the freezer compartment of your refrigerator.
This is not a joke. Others have reported that this results in significant improvements in the sound of your audio system.
If you haven't already tried it, I'd be interested in seeing your results.
se
fdegrove said:Question is, have any of the dissenters actually tried this or are they just dismissing it because they don't understand how it could possibly make a difference?
...
Never dismiss anything out of hand folks,
I'm curious. Have you tried this?
Take two photographs of yourself. One taken when you were a child and another when you were an adult. Place each individually into a clear plastic bag and place the two photos in the freezer compartment of your refrigerator.
This is not a joke. Others have reported that this results in significant improvements in the sound of your audio system.
If you haven't already tried it, I'd be interested in seeing your results.
se
your wish....
Lirpa Labs Turntable
fdegrove said:Hi,
Please enligthen us, what are these products?
Cheers,
Lirpa Labs Turntable
I think the dissenters have made it clear whether they have listened to the devices or not.
I don't think I'm necessarily dismissing them out of hand. If someone put them in my hand or offered a satsifaction guarantee like many other manufacturers, I would listen to them. But who would argue that any device can be added to the speaker input and be detectable by ear?
I remember reading about kleenex over Yamaha studio monitor tweeters. Turns out they made them sound better by causing comb filtering. Undoubtedly, they corrected flaws while introducting their own. But everyone seemed to agree they sounded better.
The fact is, $160 is more money than I wish to part with for a device that is described as near super-conductive phonon filter.
I don't believe (in fact I refuse on principle) that high fidelity is all that difficult to achieve and can be explained with public domain knowledge.
Isn't that the spirit of this site? Mr. Pass shares tons of information and along with other notable designer/manufacturer/artists. Bybee, as far as I can tell, is not part of that culture. They list no patent numbers, they describe their product in vague terms and provide testimonials that are frankly too easily fabricated.
But based on your posts, I believe the Bybee filter is aimed directly at your demographic. I don't wish to show you any disrespect but you are looking for a miracle device which I fear does not exist. You seem to really want this device to live up to its claims and you dismiss those who try to provide logical, if somewhat excited, input.
Or maybe the Bybee folks are just bad at marketing their product.
I don't think I'm necessarily dismissing them out of hand. If someone put them in my hand or offered a satsifaction guarantee like many other manufacturers, I would listen to them. But who would argue that any device can be added to the speaker input and be detectable by ear?
I remember reading about kleenex over Yamaha studio monitor tweeters. Turns out they made them sound better by causing comb filtering. Undoubtedly, they corrected flaws while introducting their own. But everyone seemed to agree they sounded better.
The fact is, $160 is more money than I wish to part with for a device that is described as near super-conductive phonon filter.
I don't believe (in fact I refuse on principle) that high fidelity is all that difficult to achieve and can be explained with public domain knowledge.
Isn't that the spirit of this site? Mr. Pass shares tons of information and along with other notable designer/manufacturer/artists. Bybee, as far as I can tell, is not part of that culture. They list no patent numbers, they describe their product in vague terms and provide testimonials that are frankly too easily fabricated.
But based on your posts, I believe the Bybee filter is aimed directly at your demographic. I don't wish to show you any disrespect but you are looking for a miracle device which I fear does not exist. You seem to really want this device to live up to its claims and you dismiss those who try to provide logical, if somewhat excited, input.
Or maybe the Bybee folks are just bad at marketing their product.
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