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Old 9th April 2008, 02:36 AM   #1
tade is offline tade  United States
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Default Zamboni dry pile.

I just read about the Oxford bell experiment which is an implementation of an electrostatically driven pendulum powered by a pair of high voltage dry piles which has been operating continuously since 1840...
And I WANT one! : )
The most difficult task will be building the piles which may contain as many as 2000 individual cells. I would like to source the cell materials as finished as possible to avoid work. I need disks of aluminum foil backed paper like what they use to wrap chocolate. I'll settle for disks of paper only but using scissors to cut out that many would be arduous!
Do any of you know where to find that stuff?

Oxford Bell
http://physics.kenyon.edu/EarlyAppar...es/Miss13a.JPG
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Old 9th April 2008, 06:56 AM   #2
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Sounds like an interesting project...A Google search of "paper discs" turned up a list of companies that can make discs of just about anything you want.I imagine that the setup charges for a run of just a few thousand discs would be cost prohibitive,but would be worth checking on to find out.

If you want to make your own,an arch punch would work.

http://campbell-bosworth.com/catalog...sort/3a/page/2
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Old 9th April 2008, 05:04 PM   #3
tade is offline tade  United States
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Good find with those punches. I wouldn't mind doing that myself a little at a time. I mean, and evening project that migh last a hundred years? pretty freakin cool.

I am gonna look for bulk filter paper. If its cheap enough and comes in say, one inch disks, it might be perfect.
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Old 10th April 2008, 01:26 AM   #4
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Make sure the paper is sulfur free or it won't last more than a couple years. You want "archival" paper that you can find at artist supply shops.

I_F
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Old 10th April 2008, 01:30 AM   #5
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Old 10th April 2008, 02:42 AM   #6
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If it were me, my first stop would be the (small) company that makes our adhesive labels... the kind that come on a roll. The cutting dyes and set-up fees can be less than you might think. Foil on paper is an available stock.

Of course, we always buy adhesive labels with adhesive on them...

Just a thought.

Looney
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Old 10th April 2008, 03:23 PM   #7
tade is offline tade  United States
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I have found a source for foil backed candy paper;
http://foilman.com/store/index.php?m...&products_id=1

I'll have to see if there is a plastic coating (doubt it), or whether the adhesive used to bond the foil is permeable.
The sheets are cheap though!

Also, small hand held paper die cutter might work:
http://www.save-on-crafts.com/punchtool.html
Hopefully I wont wear it out too quickly...

And I want to use graphite for the second electrode; probably buy some electric motor stators and rub down the back of the paper before I punch.

Even though PVC pipe is cliche I think it will do the job. Or I might paint epoxy on the outside of the pile.

So it is the small amount of impurities found in the paper and atmospheric humidity which allows this pile to function? will graphite and aluminum work? I think I did read that on some website but I have not been able to find it again. I found some mention of manganese dioxide but overall the design is not perfectly clear to me. Do any of you have a better idea?

Is there any way to tell whether the paper in the foil paper will be suitable?

Oh here is a great example;
http://www.uibk.ac.at/exphys/museum/...r/zamboni.html
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Old 15th February 2011, 03:58 AM   #8
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Default New way of cutting discs.

Saw a yuo tube vid who uses Square discs.. easier to cut 1000's - an automatic BIG paper cutter! At any printer newpaper shop.
Measure out exact 1" or bigger squares!!! make 1000's in seconds.
ROUND ones are NOT necessisary, UNLESS you are looking to make Museum retro look-a-likes. ROSS
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Old 15th February 2011, 04:07 AM   #9
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Default Question of paper To Use?

I collect antique books! Well, the best way to make sure you use the right paper for cutting (and it not be acidic and rot over time) is buy an old cheap book printed in 1800. The paper is pure RAG paper with no modern chemicals. That is why they are still extant, while modern books are turning brown and rotting - decaying. And then do your cutting punching..... lolol I don't think the INK will make much difference?
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Old 15th February 2011, 04:19 AM   #10
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Default Question as to what laterials to use? Copper or Silver?

I know from BOATS that salt water and Zinc boat devices... the zinc deteriates fast over months years. Salt and zinc seem to be bad? OK, so zinc without salt watered paper discs. We stay as dry and clean as possible but for the humidity in the air while making the device. Toos up as to use copper or silver? Copper also corrodeds faster than silver and turns green. I THINK the 150 year device uses SILVER and ZINC and NOT salted paper discs. Just pure distilled air humidity. IT would be interesting to find out the climate that Mr. Zamboni lived in - maybe a less salty air than what I live in. I live on the coast where the air is a bit more salty than inland folk. As to the cyclindars used, we have a Zamboni in the museum that is sealed in brass? cylindars?... heavens, my spelling.? They can be easily tapped and screwed and RETROS made ... we are in process of doing this to sell them.
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