Oh, I'm 110% with you on this one, the biggest hurdle is just not to be scared off by them, once you start to use them its they are so intuitive you never look back.
Again I completely agree, I only have the frequency references calibrated on the scopes when the units first arrive (such as the 7D15 or Tek11302).
I have two primary Cesium Frequency References as lab standards, but more recently I just use a GPS frequency standard, no need to worry about the Cesium tubes life!
That's the case with the TEK11302, but the only issue I've had is blown attenuators on the plugins, which can happen to any scope. Plugins are cheap and plentiful so its worth keeping a few for spares... I snap them up when I see them for US$50 or so, whats to loose!
I just bought a working 7S12, S6, S52 + the hard to find "hardline" between the S6 & S52 for GBP180!!!! how can you go wrong? Thats an 11.5GHz TDR system for GBP180!!!!!! Fastest calibrated sweep speed 20pS Div!!! with 2pS Div with x10!
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This topic is not about equipment which belong to national museum, dinosaur's section.
But definably today it makes sense the saying show me your workbench so others to be able to identify the weight of your opinion.
Attachments
In those frontiers between true life and internet participation, there is a huge gap.
If your habit is to be an analyst of faces and character of other people by just reading their text over the internet, you do have an huge problem with the way that you grasp things, and definably I do look as arrogant.
My skills at using English language are limited at sharing facts, diplomacy or sweet talk so to look to others as likeable, is something which I do not have.
The OP asked for scope recommendations - and based upon experience I made my personal recommendations. As I said, I prefer to buy second hand Premium equipment thats the best of the best no matter what age, then purchase new budget level equipment.
I'm a professional, I design semiconductors and also products so I have a different requirement to Diy'ers, but when it comes to scopes the TEK 7K can be had for peanuts and IMO are still the very best if your prepared to give them some loving
I've nothing to hide, I've only recently built myself a small lab here in Czech Rep. its not yet completed its still work in progress.
Most of the lab is still stacked up in our Basement, loft, living room and even our bedroom
since we moved back from Asia 3 years ago or so....Here's my latest development which is more of a 3 year research project!!!
:-https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/86116171/MDAC2 PCB.JPG
Some of the Equipment setup to qualify and debug the PCB:-
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/86116171/Lab Bench.JPG
The test rack I use to verify the designs digital Interface Jitter, PLL design etc:-
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/86116171/Jitter test Rack.JPG
The Phase noise test system - this complex system is required just to measure the ultra low Phase noise of the clocks used in my DAC and ADC designs.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/86116171/Phase Noise test system Rack.JPG
The burn-in rack, I plan to test customer units I might have in for repair so I can leave them testing for a day or two... since I'm semi-retried I still support and repair my legacy designs without charge.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/86116171/Burnin Rack.JPG
Plenty of empty space, waiting for the lab to be completed before I can setup proper....
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/86116171/lab mess.JPG
Hopefully this settles some of your rather odd concerns....
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Hey, Guys,
Once again, thank you all for your input. I will be digging into researching the older Teks. Any good links for me to look through would be appreciated.
And, yes, I have already developed an auto filter for our greek friend. I find his disdainful input to be far less than professional. So, that filter is set and running.
Once again, thank you all for your input. I will be digging into researching the older Teks. Any good links for me to look through would be appreciated.
And, yes, I have already developed an auto filter for our greek friend. I find his disdainful input to be far less than professional. So, that filter is set and running.
Heres a TEK Wiki with plenty of links and reading
7000-series scopes - TekWiki
7000-series plug-ins - TekWiki
If your really lucky then you might be able to pickup a cheap Tek 11302A!!!
Tektronix 11302 500MHz Analog Oscilloscope Main Frame
7000-series scopes - TekWiki
7000-series plug-ins - TekWiki
If your really lucky then you might be able to pickup a cheap Tek 11302A!!!
Tektronix 11302 500MHz Analog Oscilloscope Main Frame
I do agree in a celebration fiesta with retirees there is no room for others, this is a close group.
But in every attempt of any retirees to dis-form reality, and misinform younger people regarding acceptable test and measurement correct practices, which those should be used in applications of our times, I will always engage so to restore the truth.
My first attempt purchasing one O-scope dinosaur at 100$ lasted two days, I did return it back to it retiree owner.
Among with the O-scope he gave me a paper note with instructions, of where to set the timebase, according the input frequency which I would suspect that the incoming signal will be at.
In conclusion, modern Oscilloscopes and especially the ones coming from vendors with tradition at monitoring latest needs regarding applications, those equipment are sources of knowledge and they do helping fresh Oscilloscope users to easily measure and understand the waveform and see at least eight electrical parameters (measurements) at the same time.
Key word = productivity
I am shocked, SHOCKED, that the repeated recommendation from someone selling new equipment is for you to only buy new equipment.
Yes, the Tek 7000 series is wonderful. It's pretty easy and inexpensive to find them, and they're easy to bring up to spec with some simple restoration and calibration. If you have that, a good sound card and interface, and decent voltage measuring equipment, you have just about everything you need to do serious audio work. Other lab bench bits (LCR bridge, curve tracers...) will make life easier and are worthwhile as you get more serious, but you can get all their functions with a bit of jig-making and manual measurement.
Yes, the Tek 7000 series is wonderful. It's pretty easy and inexpensive to find them, and they're easy to bring up to spec with some simple restoration and calibration. If you have that, a good sound card and interface, and decent voltage measuring equipment, you have just about everything you need to do serious audio work. Other lab bench bits (LCR bridge, curve tracers...) will make life easier and are worthwhile as you get more serious, but you can get all their functions with a bit of jig-making and manual measurement.
As promised, My Owon VDS20221 USB scope showed up from Amazon.
In-box documentation and installation instructions were very, very skimpy.
I eventually found the windows 7.1 driver installation instructions in the
c:\Program Files (x86)\OWON\VDS_C2\docs\VDS_C2\en\help\VDS_C2_Help_en.chm
Help file that was installed by the SETUP program that they provided.
Right, you install the scope software off the disc that comes with it, end up with a non-operational piece of hardware and software because the USB driver doesn't load, and then you figure out how to force-feed the installation of the driver from a help file you didn't know that you installed when you ran the setup program.
Once I did that, I fired it up and tested it with the calibration source on the front panel. This worked pretty straight forwardly.
I then tried to use the scope to look at a 1 KHz tone coming out of the headphone jack of the PC I had installed it on. The resulting signal was very noisy and impossible to get stable synch on, until I discovered the Home, Sampling menu and set the scope for Sampling Mode with Averaging=16.
This seems to to get me a fairly usable 'scope that I will now attempt to soldier on with.
I bought a used Tek 2215 20mHZ analog scope back in 1985 for $700 since the guy who owned it took very good care of it, and had it updated and re-calibrated. It's been great but I wish it had a BW limit function and 100mHZ bandwidth so I could see audio circuit oscillations that could exist above 20mHZ.
More recently I got a Tek 2236 100mHZ analog scope at the Tek surplus outlet for $50 because the built in DMM is broke. Since I don't need the built in DMM (I've got 3 others), I don't care, so I got a great deal. It has BW limit too (useful when looking at audio frequency noise performence).
My first job out of school in 1978 was troubleshooting and calibrating the Tek 475A 250mHZ scopes (and several variations). They are very impressive machines, but many are so old now that parts could fail. As was mentioned, many of the parts are custom and not available anymore. Same thing with the Tek 7K series. Tek scopes from the 80's or newer might be a wiser choice.
The newest scopes all seem to be digital, which may be good, I don't really know. It depends on the quality of the software engineer behind it. Perhaps one of the more important things is to have a very good service shop check the calibration and functions, so you know you can trust what it tells you. Get two probes so you can set one channel to Invert, add the two, and do "floating" differential measurements. This is nice when you don't want to have either connection be ground.
More recently I got a Tek 2236 100mHZ analog scope at the Tek surplus outlet for $50 because the built in DMM is broke. Since I don't need the built in DMM (I've got 3 others), I don't care, so I got a great deal. It has BW limit too (useful when looking at audio frequency noise performence).
My first job out of school in 1978 was troubleshooting and calibrating the Tek 475A 250mHZ scopes (and several variations). They are very impressive machines, but many are so old now that parts could fail. As was mentioned, many of the parts are custom and not available anymore. Same thing with the Tek 7K series. Tek scopes from the 80's or newer might be a wiser choice.
The newest scopes all seem to be digital, which may be good, I don't really know. It depends on the quality of the software engineer behind it. Perhaps one of the more important things is to have a very good service shop check the calibration and functions, so you know you can trust what it tells you. Get two probes so you can set one channel to Invert, add the two, and do "floating" differential measurements. This is nice when you don't want to have either connection be ground.
Yes agreed, thats why I recommend the later designed 7K mainframes:-
7104/3
7104 - TekWiki
R7103 - TekWiki
7904A (must be the later A version)
7904 - TekWiki
7934
File:Tek-7934.jpg - TekWiki
Theses are all late build versions.
The 7904A is the best general purpose mainframe.
The 7104 is the fastest / highest performance analogue scope ever made - 1GHz BW with image intensified tube to observe LF events on High frequency signals.
The 7934 is a storage tube based scope, its based on the later design - but I never really found its storage modes useful for audio applications although they where often used in high speed / fast pulse Laser and Radar research type applications.
The later TEK 11302 / 11302A are an even better find if you can find one at a good price, I snap every "decent" condition unit I can find. These are my everyday scopes - if you ever are lucky enough to find one, be aware they are touch screen operated, this caught me out like an idiot the first time I used one as I was not expecting a Touch screen on an analogue scope
Rated to 500MHz, but I use mine above 1GHz with the 11A71/72 plugins with no problem.
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Wow, tons of Tek resources! Thanks, guys. I will dive into the reading. Mind if I post any questions here in this thread for you Tek experts? I am sure I will have MANY.
Ok, silly question.... for the Rigol 'scope, where to buy? I am perfectly ok with web based purchasing. However, I have no idea who are the more reputable folks online. And, yes, lowest prices would be nice.
Ok, silly question.... for the Rigol 'scope, where to buy? I am perfectly ok with web based purchasing. However, I have no idea who are the more reputable folks online. And, yes, lowest prices would be nice.
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My post a page back I gave you a series of links. One was to Tequipment.net. If you also look at the link to EEVBlog forum that I gave you will see a huge discussion thread on the Rigol. That forum also has a discount code for Tequipment if you locate the Tequipment discount thread and request it. Their standard price is $399 incl free shipping. You will get it for less with the code.
They are highly rated as a supplier, and may be the only source with stock available. The scopes have been selling so fast that people have at times had to wait for stock.
And just in case anyone wonders, I have no connection whatsoever with Tequipment.net. I'm just a satisfied customer.
They are highly rated as a supplier, and may be the only source with stock available. The scopes have been selling so fast that people have at times had to wait for stock.
And just in case anyone wonders, I have no connection whatsoever with Tequipment.net. I'm just a satisfied customer.
Technically, any unauthorized modification will void the warranty but in general there is no way for them to know. FOr the DS1054, you don't have to open the case (only the MSO versions need a JTAG dump).
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