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Old 6th January 2014, 06:17 PM   #11
davada is offline davada  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Salas View Post
What about trying it on Asio4all free drivers? It may lose a few dB of performance, but maybe a solution.
Unfortunately the driver is also the config and control app all in one.
Don't know if the Asio4Free would work.
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Old 6th January 2014, 06:21 PM   #12
davada is offline davada  Canada
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Originally Posted by 1audio View Post
Wimp!
I refuse to be defeated by simple computer stuff. Although the fixes may be worse than the problem. Its not my main computer at all so I won't be too concerned if it crashes every few days. However if Linux support is good I may switch.
He's right though. Things should just work.
I didn't have any crashes running under XP. It was all the blocking that bothered me and the noise performance poor. Never seen so much grass. Too bad because it such a nice ADC.
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Old 6th January 2014, 06:27 PM   #13
1audio is offline 1audio  United States
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ASIOforall is a hack to bridge from windows to ASIO. What is needed is better hardware drivers and those would be very hardware specific. The problem is the DSP stuff on the card. Even if its completely disabled it needs to be loaded or the card won't work.

I will be trying it on a clean installation with a fast simplified system to see if it can be stable.

I am getting very good results. Swapping the opamps may get the 3rd harmonic down a bunch. The LME49720's are cheap and worth a try.
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Old 6th January 2014, 07:39 PM   #14
Salas is online now Salas  Greece
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Asio4all works for my EMU Tracker Pre, but loses performance vs. WDM. Pictures are on XP. Alas, Win7 is a problem for any original Tracker's drivers.
So A4all comes to the rescue. Can you explain why it loses SNR performance on A4ALL by not supporting 48k? Skips some hardware bits maybe? Any better settings to propose on A4all for SNR?

I like the Tracker bcs very portable and I can use it with any measurement software. I think I can't do that with a QA400 which I would get for backup or just to have it installed ready for use on the bench when the EMU could be in the tools case. But it only runs on custom SW, right?
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File Type: png SNR_WIth_WDM.png (50.6 KB, 278 views)
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Old 6th January 2014, 09:21 PM   #15
RNMarsh is offline RNMarsh  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1audio View Post
Wimp!
I refuse to be defeated by simple computer stuff. Although the fixes may be worse than the problem. Its not my main computer at all so I won't be too concerned if it crashes every few days. However if Linux support is good I may switch.
Yes, I will admit it. I have wimped out. I spent years screwing around with computer hardware/software/interfaces for work projects and experiments. My frustration level and tolerance for software issues is now very, very small.

But, happy that you want to do it. I'll just do what ever is found to work best and use that. [I still have a emu 0404 in the closet. Any hope of that being useable?]


Thx-RNMarsh
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Old 7th January 2014, 12:14 AM   #16
1audio is offline 1audio  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Salas View Post
Asio4all works for my EMU Tracker Pre, but loses performance vs. WDM. Pictures are on XP. Alas, Win7 is a problem for any original Tracker's drivers.
So A4all comes to the rescue. Can you explain why it loses SNR performance on A4ALL by not supporting 48k? Skips some hardware bits maybe? Any better settings to propose on A4all for SNR?

I like the Tracker bcs very portable and I can use it with any measurement software. I think I can't do that with a QA400 which I would get for backup or just to have it installed ready for use on the bench when the EMU could be in the tools case. But it only runs on custom SW, right?
The noise may be some resampling in the background. I have a Tracker pre and a 0404. I have been able to make some complex acoustical measurements with them. Its the usual 1 day of prep and debug and 30 seconds for the measurement (ground plane frequency response of a speaker).


The QA400 is designed around a special USB protocol. Its Matt's way of working around the USB audio limitations on Windows. Either 96K and not necessarly full duplex or 192K and licensing/building a Windows driver to support. Essentially he uses bulk transfer and retries when it gets hammered which is why it doesn't work with normal stuff. Its also why you may see the error flash, that might indicate USB bus contention. What is needed for the QA400 is more test functions. We need to lure a programmer into building some more enhanced test scripts for it. There are examples and it would not be difficult to list the most useful scripts for various electronic measurements. Its not for acoustic measurements. My interface project is to make it more useful for electronic measurements.
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Old 7th January 2014, 02:20 AM   #17
RNMarsh is offline RNMarsh  United States
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BTW -- the QA400 works flawlessly with my new computer and its' WIN 8.1 OS.

-RM
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Old 7th January 2014, 05:46 AM   #18
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I have a 1212M and an 1820M, they both work OK under Windows 7 and Windows 8 actually. I used to have some occasional weirdness in Windows 7 but it's gone in Windows 8.

The automatic sample rate switching between 44.1 and 48 does not work in Windows 8 though, it did work in Windows 7. You always had to manually load a session for 96 or 192k.

I would not use XP if someone paid me.
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Old 7th January 2014, 05:57 AM   #19
mkc is offline mkc  Denmark
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Originally Posted by 1audio View Post
We need to lure a programmer into building some more enhanced test scripts for it. There are examples and it would not be difficult to list the most useful scripts.
Hi Demian,

Since I have a QA400. What scripts would you like?

Btw. Tracked down a very cheap 1212m, which I might as well grap. If not anything else, I can perhaps tab onto the lines and connect my USB interface to the ADC.

Best regards,
Mogens
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Old 16th January 2014, 02:34 AM   #20
RNMarsh is offline RNMarsh  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1audio View Post
I just got an EMU 1212M for measurement purposes because it uses the AK5394A ADC. Here are some essential as received measurements.

They are all made in balanced mode at +4 level setting.

The performance is quite good but not as good as I get from the demo board.

The Third harmonic is exceptionally high. That is also high on the DAC as well. My guess is the odd JRC2058 opamps. They look like they are from an earlier technology node (to use the IC industry jargon).

Next step (after CES) will be to replace the JRC opamps with LME49720's to match what I'm using on the demo board. I'll document the process.

The drivers seem problematic. The Win XP system was really stable before I installed the card and has been locking up intermittently ever since. For my purposes the DSP manager interface is also very much in the way. Learning curve ahead.
How accurate is the data near and below -100dB?? Same question to Salas, Chris.... and others with sound cards et al.
Here is ref. AP-2722

Source+analyzer residual.jpg

Thx-RNMarsh

Last edited by RNMarsh; 16th January 2014 at 02:40 AM.
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