I am currently usind Billiton CW cored solder wire 1mm - which specifies a flux type RS4/1/127. I don't know how active this type of flux is.
I was thinking about moving to Kester 44 63/37 solder. Will this solder be more active (the flux)? Is there any potential "danger"? I use an old Weller WECP-20 soldering station.
Also, what is meant by "no-clean" solder?
I was thinking about moving to Kester 44 63/37 solder. Will this solder be more active (the flux)? Is there any potential "danger"? I use an old Weller WECP-20 soldering station.
Also, what is meant by "no-clean" solder?
Expand this to include other types of solder for SMD, etc.
We need help in picking the right solder for the right job. I have seen solder
with copper, silver, etc. What solder is best for SMD? What about lead free?
We also need best brands and types. Come on "experts", let us know
what is right or wrong with each type of solder.
We need help in picking the right solder for the right job. I have seen solder
with copper, silver, etc. What solder is best for SMD? What about lead free?
We also need best brands and types. Come on "experts", let us know
what is right or wrong with each type of solder.
Hi all,
I am currently using Stannol 0,7mm leaded, Kristall 511
Vaasan Elektroniikkakeskus Oy / Vasa Elektronikcenter Ab
I have been very happy with it, even if price is about 80€ per kilo.
I have only used about 2kg so far so no big deal.
They say cleaning of the PCB is recommended after soldering and also that the flux is halogenated.
For more demanding applications I've used another Stannol type, with silver.
Vaasan Elektroniikkakeskus Oy / Vasa Elektronikcenter Ab
It is a bit more expensive, but works very very well.
They say it needs no cleaning afterwards and it smells quite nice too.
I am thinking about moving to this one with silver for most applications.
Also I was just about to buy a 1kg roll of Billiton CW, as I would get it very cheap, around 30€.
I am hoping it would be adequate for e.g. banana plugs and car amps, inverters.
It could save me a few bucks and minutes (it is 1mm thick) when used where a lot of solder is required.
Brand wise Stannol / Multicore has been very good.
All the leadfree ones have been bad, one I got for free (some chinese) was absolute crap.
I have a 25g roll of leadfree just in case I must use it.
Leadfree solder fumes are also said to be very bad for your health, but I do not have any references.
I do have some flux cleaning spray, some limonene based.
Cost was like 15euros for a big can, works relatively well.
I can check the brand.
Sorry for the links being in Finnish, but you see the photo and there are also links on the page.
Then again if I solder a lot I wear thin gloves.
Frequent hand washing is bad for the skin and you should definitely wash your hands after handling lead.
As far as I have understood lead cannot be absorbed through skin and also it will not evaporate when soldering with, say, 300-400deg.C temperature.
I am currently using Stannol 0,7mm leaded, Kristall 511
Vaasan Elektroniikkakeskus Oy / Vasa Elektronikcenter Ab
I have been very happy with it, even if price is about 80€ per kilo.
I have only used about 2kg so far so no big deal.
They say cleaning of the PCB is recommended after soldering and also that the flux is halogenated.
For more demanding applications I've used another Stannol type, with silver.
Vaasan Elektroniikkakeskus Oy / Vasa Elektronikcenter Ab
It is a bit more expensive, but works very very well.
They say it needs no cleaning afterwards and it smells quite nice too.
I am thinking about moving to this one with silver for most applications.
Also I was just about to buy a 1kg roll of Billiton CW, as I would get it very cheap, around 30€.
I am hoping it would be adequate for e.g. banana plugs and car amps, inverters.
It could save me a few bucks and minutes (it is 1mm thick) when used where a lot of solder is required.
Brand wise Stannol / Multicore has been very good.
All the leadfree ones have been bad, one I got for free (some chinese) was absolute crap.
I have a 25g roll of leadfree just in case I must use it.
Leadfree solder fumes are also said to be very bad for your health, but I do not have any references.
I do have some flux cleaning spray, some limonene based.
Cost was like 15euros for a big can, works relatively well.
I can check the brand.
Sorry for the links being in Finnish, but you see the photo and there are also links on the page.
Then again if I solder a lot I wear thin gloves.
Frequent hand washing is bad for the skin and you should definitely wash your hands after handling lead.
As far as I have understood lead cannot be absorbed through skin and also it will not evaporate when soldering with, say, 300-400deg.C temperature.
If one uses leaded solder on SMD components, leaching occurs and the tin is removed from the component, making the SMD more un-reliable and in the worst case changing the components value.
Lead is absorbed by inhaling and through the pores in the skin.
'Wurth' brake cleaner is plentiful and cheap. It does a great job cleaning PCBoards after rework.
Lead is absorbed by inhaling and through the pores in the skin.
'Wurth' brake cleaner is plentiful and cheap. It does a great job cleaning PCBoards after rework.
I've not experienced that. In fact, I actually required lead tin for all the boards we had build by outside houses because we required very good reliability. 5 years ago, everybody had yet to learn how to get reliable lead free boards through production into the field. And yet, 70 percent of all SMD components were tin plated.
If you rework using tin/lead with the soldering tip set to tin/silver temperatures, you will find that you scavenge metals faster, but that's a process problem, not an alloy one.
If one is experiencing a reliability problem, other issues are more likely to be the cause. I find flux type and activation temperatures to have bigger impact on soldering quality. Type of activator within the flux is second, as chemical activation of the oxidized surfaces can vary depending on the basis metal, as in copper, silver, nickel, aluminum, or stainless.
Lead can be absorbed by inhaling, however the act of soldering does not typically cause lead to be inhaled, it is not airborne in the flux fumes.. The flux is however, very nasty if inhaled constantly.
Lead is not absorbed in the pores of the skin in general. Certain compounds, such as tetraethyl lead can however. I've attached the information from osha.
https://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=STANDARDS&p_id=10031
jn
Jon, Thanks for that. I've got half a can in the garage somewhere so I'll give it a go.
Thanks jneutron for the rather "industrial" info.
And yes, led compounds are of course absorbed through the skin. Lead metal not.
Also inhaled led is very much absorbed, but not an issue when doing low temp soldering.
Are there actually reliable lead free boards nowadays?
In my non-spare-time I work with rather industrial stuff and we have not had reliability problems related to bad soldering.
Then again home electronics are full or solder problems. Mostly big chips getting bad contact in my experience.
What temperatures are you guys using?
I seem to select temp quite randomly.
350deg.C default, a bit more for big components and about 420 for e.g. banana plugs.
Luckily I do not solder SMD too often, but every now and then.
Last night a friend brought me two Lexus LS430 amps for repair.
That will be a pain in the sitting organ, some components are really small.
And yes, led compounds are of course absorbed through the skin. Lead metal not.
Also inhaled led is very much absorbed, but not an issue when doing low temp soldering.
Are there actually reliable lead free boards nowadays?
In my non-spare-time I work with rather industrial stuff and we have not had reliability problems related to bad soldering.
Then again home electronics are full or solder problems. Mostly big chips getting bad contact in my experience.
What temperatures are you guys using?
I seem to select temp quite randomly.
350deg.C default, a bit more for big components and about 420 for e.g. banana plugs.
Luckily I do not solder SMD too often, but every now and then.
Last night a friend brought me two Lexus LS430 amps for repair.
That will be a pain in the sitting organ, some components are really small.
Some great info again jn.
Do you know what is in the "halidated" or whatever flux?
If it is halogenated organics it may be pretty bad health wise.
If it is the addition of some halide salt, then it probably isn't that bad.
I'm just thinking that the lead free solder smells so different and quite strong.
Plain rosin smells like wood or similar
And if it is natural then it must be good for you, like tobacco or belladonna or....no maybe not
Do you know what is in the "halidated" or whatever flux?
If it is halogenated organics it may be pretty bad health wise.
If it is the addition of some halide salt, then it probably isn't that bad.
I'm just thinking that the lead free solder smells so different and quite strong.
Plain rosin smells like wood or similar
And if it is natural then it must be good for you, like tobacco or belladonna or....no maybe not
Some great info again jn.
Do you know what is in the "halidated" or whatever flux?
If it is halogenated organics it may be pretty bad health wise.
If it is the addition of some halide salt, then it probably isn't that bad.
I'm just thinking that the lead free solder smells so different and quite strong.
Plain rosin smells like wood or similar
And if it is natural then it must be good for you, like tobacco or belladonna or....no maybe not
Flux is in 3 basic flavors.R type flux, called rosin, RMA or Rosin mildly activated, and RA, rosin activated.
The purpose of the flux is to remove the oxides on the surface so that the solder can form a metallurgical bond. No flux, the solder balls up and rolls off the surface.
The flux has to break down the oxide just before the solder liquefies. If it burns before that temperature, then the surface will go bad and the solder will again, roll off.
To chemically strip the oxide (sy can correct me on this chemistry stuff I get incorrect), you need a cover liquid to coat the surface, and then when it gets hot enough, the chemical inside strips the oxide, while the cover liquid keeps air out. The molten solder grabs hold of the cleaned surface, and forms the meatallurgical bond.
The ingredient typically used to activate the flux is called a halide, due to it containing fluorine, bromine, chlorine, or iodine. Most use zinc chloride. When it's heated up, it can produce hydrogen chloride, which is rather corrosive. That's why RMA and RA fluxes are not very good choices for electronics, as no matter how hard you try, you really can't clean all the stuff away.
Hydrogen chloride gas is not very nice to breath, as it likes water and produces very bad results.
jn
Crap, I should stop using Kristall 511.
Though chlorides are not very toxic I still guess they are bad for the pcb and for the breathing organs.
I would guess the reaction is something like mO + ZnCl2 --> Cl2 + ZnO + m
The soldered surface is reduced, i.e. looses its oxygen.
Luckily the amount of oxide and chlorine will probably be minimal, unless your PCB has been standing in rain for years
My guess would bee that when soldering normal temps the ZnCl2 will not decompose just from heat. From oxidation it will. ZnCl2 is somewhat corrosive in itself.
Also I need to get a fume extractor.
At work we have some Weller (looks like a bucket) but it costs over 2000€.
Any suggestions what I should get for my workshop at home?
A poor mans idea was to take an old vacuum cleaner and run it at low speed with the dust bag filled with some filtering material
HCl in swimming pools? Have not heard, but I know it is used for many pH control things, so why not.
Stuff mostly added to pools is calcium hypochlorite, which dissociates to hypochloric acid. I think the chlorine (smell) comes from hypochloric acid being reduced by organic material in the water.
This thread turned out to be very useful
Though chlorides are not very toxic I still guess they are bad for the pcb and for the breathing organs.
I would guess the reaction is something like mO + ZnCl2 --> Cl2 + ZnO + m
The soldered surface is reduced, i.e. looses its oxygen.
Luckily the amount of oxide and chlorine will probably be minimal, unless your PCB has been standing in rain for years
My guess would bee that when soldering normal temps the ZnCl2 will not decompose just from heat. From oxidation it will. ZnCl2 is somewhat corrosive in itself.
Also I need to get a fume extractor.
At work we have some Weller (looks like a bucket) but it costs over 2000€.
Any suggestions what I should get for my workshop at home?
A poor mans idea was to take an old vacuum cleaner and run it at low speed with the dust bag filled with some filtering material
HCl in swimming pools? Have not heard, but I know it is used for many pH control things, so why not.
Stuff mostly added to pools is calcium hypochlorite, which dissociates to hypochloric acid. I think the chlorine (smell) comes from hypochloric acid being reduced by organic material in the water.
This thread turned out to be very useful
Just a comment. It is the removal of lead that causes "unreliable" operation. Solders with tin (most lead free are in this category) have an issue with tim whiskers (dendrites) growing and causing short circuits. There are a number of factors which seem to lead to more whisker growth, such as envioronment, humidity, contaniments and mostly mechanical stresses. The whiskers can take hours or years to grow. One well known case involved a comm satellite that failed due to tin whiskers. Most hi-rel systems require lead-tin to this day.
Paul
Paul
Some more interesting, in-depth reading for those interested:
http://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-kostic-pb-free.pdf
paul
http://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-kostic-pb-free.pdf
paul
A common problem I often see referred to here, is typically the result of using too small irons, - often referred are 20--30W irons, which may be fine for tiny components, but just too small in my opinion, for common medium sized and larger stuff. The heat reserve just is not enough.
Some years ago, I switched to the newer 80W Wellers, even for SMDs, and it is just a breeze. Good temp control for smaller stuff, and enough heat for larger gizmos...
Some years ago, I switched to the newer 80W Wellers, even for SMDs, and it is just a breeze. Good temp control for smaller stuff, and enough heat for larger gizmos...
Even with flux cored solder I keep liquid flux handy, especially for reflow soldering. With most SMD devices I dip the part's solder pads in flux before placing and soldering.
If you really want a challenge try high temperature solder. It is 95% lead and flows almost not at all. Best results are achieved by keeping the board at 125c or so with a hotplate. Try working over that all day.
For fume extraction I use a cheap 25cm desk fan to which I've taped a piece of carbon filter material I got from Amazon. A sheet 40cm X 120cm cost about 5 USD.
If you really want a challenge try high temperature solder. It is 95% lead and flows almost not at all. Best results are achieved by keeping the board at 125c or so with a hotplate. Try working over that all day.
For fume extraction I use a cheap 25cm desk fan to which I've taped a piece of carbon filter material I got from Amazon. A sheet 40cm X 120cm cost about 5 USD.
Thank you, an excellent link.
Note the Toyota unintended acceleration stuff on page 57 on.
jn
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