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Old 2nd November 2006, 08:46 AM   #11
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Quote:
I refitted on the pcb the original clock soldering the caps.
So, to get this straight, you removed the caps from the player and fitted them to the clock PCB?
You should remove the caps from the player, but only fit the crystal in the clock module (unless the caps were 39pF and 68pF, as in the schematic - I don't know what would happen otherwise).
Not sure if that is what you have actually done. Can you confirm?

Cheers,
Phil
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Old 2nd November 2006, 11:38 AM   #12
falter is offline falter  Italy
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No, absolutly, I fiitted on pcb player the caps before removed to afford the working of player with his own clock.
Thanks
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Old 2nd November 2006, 01:21 PM   #13
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Sorry, I'm slowly running out of ideas.
Maybe you should check the voltages around the circuit.
Be sure that you're getting +/- 5V at the correct pins of the comparator, maybe check the oscillator circuit has 5v.
You should also be able to check the output pin has a DC voltage of a volt or two as it is oscillating.
If something is missing, it might suggest a fault somewhere.
Do you have access to a scope? If so, you could look for actual signals present.
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Old 2nd November 2006, 09:42 PM   #14
falter is offline falter  Italy
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Hi phil,
I joined the v in + of elso clock to the input of 7805 regulator and the v in- to the input of regulator negative 7906. Maybe a mistake ?
Thanks
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Old 3rd November 2006, 09:10 AM   #15
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Hi Falter,

Well, I assume that the inputs to those regulators are greater than +/-5V, probably no less than +7 and -8 (you need at least 2V overhead to regulate properly).
The Kwak clock also needs this overhead too, I think the schematic specifies 9V-15V or something.
What you should really use is the +/- 12->15v that it used to power the opamps on the analogue output to guarantee the right voltage range to drive the Kwak clock. Perhaps not the best voltage rail to use for quality reasons, but a good enough voltage to be confident about.

I think you'd be able to prove this by taking a voltmeter and checking the voltages on the comparator power pins. You should clearly see +5v on (I think pin 1) and -5v on pin 4 (better double check those pins on the datasheet, or schematic). If you don't have those voltages, there is the problem.

Cheers,
Phil
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Old 3rd November 2006, 08:05 PM   #16
falter is offline falter  Italy
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Hi Phil,
I checked the voltage only on some points of clock pcb and on the regulator ( 7805 replaced with lm340 and 7905ct ). The votage on lm 340 between input and gnd is 8.61 and on 7906 is 8.56. To get to the bottom of question, this are insufficient to power Elso clock so I would join the clock to 7815 and 7915. Isn't it ?
And this is the fault of crazly spinning of player ?
The measurement of comparator voltage ( pin 1 and pin 4 ) must been maked between pin and gnd ? Thanks and regards
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Old 6th November 2006, 09:46 AM   #17
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Not sure myself if this is high enough, so the best thing to do is check the voltage on the comparator pins (you're right, compare each pin to ground).

If your comparator doesn't have a high enough power voltage, it won't output a clock signal (there is a minimum voltage that it will work with). If there is no clock signal going into the CD player, it is likely that the CD will spin quickly.

I think you should use the outputs of the 7815 and 7915 because you'll benefit from double regulation, and it will definitely be a big enough voltage for the 431s on the Kwak clock to create +/-5v for the rest of the clock circuit.
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Old 11th November 2006, 01:00 PM   #18
falter is offline falter  Italy
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I sent the clock to Elso in repair. As soon as he'll send again to me, I'll check to join to 15 v regulators. In time: what regulators can be utilize instead of 7815 and 7915 ? Thanks
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Old 11th November 2006, 07:24 PM   #19
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Sorry we couldn't get it fixed. Never mind. It will be working soon.

I am slowly learning that there is a huge world out wrt to regulation.

The set up Elso used is based on using 78xx and 79xx as a pre-regulation stage, the second stage being a transistor bypassed lm431, with a pi filter in between. Its pretty good as it is.
You could improve the regulation stage on the player if you like, maybe find a drop in replacement for the 78/9/xx (lm317/337 etc would require extra components and would not help too much as its preregulator).

My latest clock is a variant of Elso's. Its single power rail, and is using a just a 7805 and its own transformer. Before anyone baulks at the 7805 - it is deliberate as it should force me to investigate regulators more so I can replace it).
Perhaps it could of used dual rails, but I was trying to make it smaller.
However, it does work quite well.

Anyway, good luck when its fixed.

Cheers,
Phil
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Old 19th November 2006, 02:53 PM   #20
falter is offline falter  Italy
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Hi guys,
I received in this days the Elso clock adjusted; I connected it to caps according instructions Elso. Now the player work very well !! The sound changed a lot. I don't ear nevea sound so beatiful. I advice to mount it at once. Thanks Elso
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