How do I use computer CDR's in my CD recorder?

[Gretsch6136]

Hi,

I own a Harmon Kardon CDR20 CD recorder. It only works with CDR blanks that are made specifically for use with CD recorders.

The problem I have is that the availability of such blanks is fast drying up. I would like to use the freely available CDR blanks that work with computers if this is possible.

I assume that the recorder has some software that makes it reject the computer blanks. Does anyone know how to achieve the desired outcome?

Many thanks,

Mark

 

[Extreme_Boky]

CD recorder reads the CDR bookmark. If the royalties are payed, the software will accept it as a valid CDR for Audio.

You can try searching the web for bookmaking, or change the bookmark. I assume that the same process is required as with changing the bookmark from DVD -R to DVD +R. I am not sure if there’s software which allows CDR to CDR for Audio bookmark change, but I can’t see why not….

Good luck,

Boky

 

[peufeu]

I assume that the recorder has some software that makes it reject the computer blanks.

Correct. This is an early form of DRM.

Audio blanks are not more expensive because they cost more to produce, or are higher quality than computer blanks ; it's simply that the "audio" recorders were designed to only accept "audio" blanks, which can then be sold at a higher price, so the consumer is properly exploited.

I'd suggest buying an "audio" CD-RW and record to it using your recorder, then just copy it to a normal CD-rom with a computer.

Or directly record to the computer, using your cd-burner as an analog to digital converter and a spdif cable to the digital input in your computer.

 

[clem_o]

On the first gen Philips recorder, there was a little trick that could be used - something about putting in an audio blank, aloowing the machine to register it, then manually forcing the tray to open then inserting a computer cd-r blank. But I think they solved that 'bug' in the next iteration..

Cheers

 

[es44]

On the first gen Philips recorder, there was a little trick that could be used - something about putting in an audio blank, aloowing the machine to register it, then manually forcing the tray to open then inserting a computer cd-r blank. But I think they solved that 'bug' in the next iteration..

Cheers

And it worked fine. But i got tired of this and found a chip from:

http://www.modchip.it/shop/net-shop.asp?lng=EN&px=idcategoria&dx=NCD

and now my cdr 870 works like a charm. I use 4X cd-rw's for it now, hi-speed one's won't be recognized.

Maybe something similar can be found for the HK. It took me a looong time to find this chip, searching Google with various combinations of search-words.

Happy hunting
Cheers
Ebbe

 

[Gretsch6136]

Hi there people,

Thanks for the tips. I tried the chip mod place you suggested. Unfortunately they only have chips for Philips players.

Now, I wouldn't mind trying the "force the draw open" trick, but how exactly do you force a draw without breaking it?

If that doesn't work, it looks like I may have some difficulty sourcing CDR audio media in the future.

Cheers,

Mark

 

[clem_o]

Is there any reason you don't wish to just use a computer and a CD writer to do the task? I doubt if a DA-AD process will be any better than a 'direct digital' copy, particularly if done with a good reader and software...

Cheers!

 

[es44]

Is there any reason you don't wish to just use a computer and a CD writer to do the task? I doubt if a DA-AD process will be any better than a 'direct digital' copy, particularly if done with a good reader and software...

Cheers!

I can only speak for my self, but i use it for recording certain things from the local radio in my area. There are sometimes things i'd like to conserve for the future

And for Gretsch6136: Yes i know that the Italian site is for Philips drives, but i thought maybe it was possible to find something similar.
But i must admit, that after searching a bit for your specific model it is quite dissapointing, at least i couldn't find anything

Maybe you can find a local "hacker" to read the firmware and alter it ?

Best of luck to you

 

[Gretsch6136]

Hi Clemo,

A computer is inconvenient for archiving vinyl and other analog sources.

Also, with a CD recorder there is no file compression or file format conversion to alter the sound of the original. Also the original info is not saved to a hard disk and then re-read to be burned. It is simply a direct copy of the digital data, therefore I believe it to be a superior method, avoiding the chance of jitter and errors being introduced.

I will look into the availability of a local hacker!

Cheers,

Mark

 

[clem_o]

Hi Mark,

I don't think I can agree that a recorder will not introduce jitter - the transport alone needs to extract the data off the disk, and the writer does have to modulate the laser to write onto the blank. All very iffy, in my opinion.

But, I guess from that viewpoint extraction to the HDD and writing it out is pretty much the same process. I will be the first to admit that there is always a bit of degradation in either process, something that can in fact be heard comparing original cd to that of the copy (and uh-oh, I hope I don't get a deludge of flames from people saying 'nay'!!)

I certainly hope you can find someone to get the job done - cd-audio blanks are indeed getting to be hard to find...

Cheers,

Clem


ps: if you do copy an audio cd to the HDD, as long as you save it as a WAV it should be pretty much the same bit stream as the CD - not unless your software has 'automatic features' enabled - such as silence removal, etc - things that you can turn off.

 

[seoman]

ps: if you do copy an audio cd to the HDD, as long as you save it as a WAV it should be pretty much the same bit stream as the CD - not unless your software has 'automatic features' enabled - such as silence removal, etc - things that you can turn off.

What about a ripping an image of the disc. That way all bits (should) stay at the same location.

I definitly prefer recording onto the hdd.
You never run out of media.
You can easily edit the recording.
placing track marks
When it comes to crappy sources like radio i can store them into a compressed format.

Regards, Simon

 

[peufeu]

Jitter on the CD doesn't matter as long as your DAC properly reclocks with a low-jitter master clock. If you use standard SPDIF with a low jitter rejection PLL like in the standard CS841X receivers, of course you will hear the jitter effects. It is not a problem in the source ; it is just the result of incorrect implementation in the DAC. It is a tragedy that 99.99 etc % of the DACs in use work this way...

About ripping to the computer :

Ripping an image file extracts the entire contents of the CD including the errors and error correction codes, headers, and a whole lot of other information you don't really need. I think it is better to rip to WAV, or even better to a lossless codec like FLAC, because :

- It will use less space, but you still get everything interesting (ie. the music)
- Most audio players read FLAC ; few read ISOs
- Error correction will be performed on reading (if you use properly configured EAC or Plextools)

The last point is important : when ripping a CD to ISO, only one pass is made ; if there are read errors because of scratches, etc. they will get through. On the other hand, a specialized audio ripper like EAC or Plextools will understand audio and find read errors, then re-read until it gets the bits right. It will also tell you if uncorrectable errors occured so that you can polish your disk with a suitable product and recover your music.

Also, when copying a CD, if you go CD -> Wav -> CD-R, the errors are corrected on reading. If you copy by ISO or direct stream copy, the scratches are copied also.

I find Plextools better than EAC (it's faster and as accurate), but of course it only works with Plextor drives.