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Old 28th January 2013, 10:35 AM   #261
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abraxalito View Post
As my system has gotten better I've also invested much more in software than in hardware
When I listen to my "software" I don't want to think of 'tails' or anything else. I want to be hooked. I want my fix, OK?

Cheers, Joe R.
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Old 28th January 2013, 01:57 PM   #262
lalaina is offline lalaina  Madagascar
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I have tried some little tweak on my oppo105
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Old 28th January 2013, 03:32 PM   #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric Schultz View Post

End of Sermon. Please deposit "yesterdays audio parts" in the coffer for distribution to the unenlightened masses. Please sing along as you leave: "Who want yesterdays resistors, who wants yesterdays capacitors?....nobody in the world"

Are we having fun?
Was this DIYA?

For a second I thought I was listening to Mr James Brown my brothers and sisters

James Brown performs Live 8, Edinburgh, 2005 - YouTube

Get on up !

Z

Last edited by zenelectro; 28th January 2013 at 03:38 PM.
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Old 29th January 2013, 02:53 AM   #264
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I have been in touch with Epson Toyocom in Singapore, spoke to a nice Anne there and since been in contact via emails. Her latest email:

Hi Joe,

We are still waiting for factory’s advice as of current status, probably will get confirmation over the next few days.

I will get back to you as soon as factory gives their confirmation. Thanks and have a nice day.

Warmest Regards,
Anne


So we may have some 54MHz SAW Oscillators available. I suspect they are doing one thousand - I have suggested to them, if the price is right, I will take a hundred.

So I hope this will work out. Keep in mind that these can be used on other players - 27MHz is the most common frequency in multi-players. Even Yamaha dedicated CD/SACD players use 27MHz (they use Mediatek DSP chip, just not all the functions in the chip). It can also be used on the Oppo 103 single-clock players.

Cheers, Joe R.
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Old 29th January 2013, 09:40 AM   #265
Coris is offline Coris  Norway
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If is a issue for Epson to make the price publicly, then can you please PM it me? Thanks.
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Old 29th January 2013, 10:39 AM   #266
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Originally Posted by Coris View Post
If is a issue for Epson to make the price publicly, then can you please PM it me? Thanks.
OK on that. As soon as I hear something definite from them.
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Old 29th January 2013, 10:05 PM   #267
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Originally Posted by Joe Rasmussen View Post
OK on that. As soon as I hear something definite from them.
Joe,

IME, at 100 off, they generally will be more than happy to supply complete
phase noise and Allan Variance plots for a few.

They would also most likely be happy to do these measurements with / WO
your low noise supply.

WRT our phone conversation, here is a good chance to learn some more
about SAW performance.

T
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Old 29th January 2013, 10:47 PM   #268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zenelectro View Post
Joe,

IME, at 100 off, they generally will be more than happy to supply complete
phase noise and Allan Variance plots for a few.

They would also most likely be happy to do these measurements with / WO
your low noise supply.

WRT our phone conversation, here is a good chance to learn some more
about SAW performance.

T
I mentioned that, and got no response... they just want to sell them, probably at about $3 each - and make them like the 50MHz version I am already using in the '95.

So a hundred off, it is not a pittance, but I can use them in so many other multi-players, so I doubt I will be taken much of a risk.

Could there be some aspect of the fundamental operation of a SAW oscillator, that makes it potentially have superior PSRR - because, on reflecting, the improvement heard does sound like that.

I have made a few suggestions elsewhere about trying the SAW 100MHz in Sabre DACs, the reaction has been wide to the EXTREME. Some very positive and "I'll give it a go" to others just want to ridicule you for making a suggestion and "it's only a cheap oscillator" - so an open mind is still influenced by known dogmatism and that old bug-bear, price.

But it remains the question - is there something inherent in SAW oscillators that we are not yet fully aware of? Nobody who even makes these things are thinking audio.

Example: If I found a new kind of industrial non-audio capacitor made using a different technique, material or whatever, and is cheaper because it is has no 'label' - and I try it and I go "whoa, this is really different" and me thinks "what is going one here" - then I am saying that my reaction is pretty healthy.

I just say, try them - ain't gonna hurt.

Cheers, Joe
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Old 30th January 2013, 01:25 AM   #269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Rasmussen View Post
I mentioned that, and got no response... they just want to sell them, probably at about $3 each - and make them like the 50MHz version I am already using in the '95.

So a hundred off, it is not a pittance, but I can use them in so many other multi-players, so I doubt I will be taken much of a risk.

Could there be some aspect of the fundamental operation of a SAW oscillator, that makes it potentially have superior PSRR - because, on reflecting, the improvement heard does sound like that.
They all have PS dependance to some degree but it's all to see in the phase
noise plot and Allen Variance measurements.

Quote:

I have made a few suggestions elsewhere about trying the SAW 100MHz in Sabre DACs, the reaction has been wide to the EXTREME. Some very positive and "I'll give it a go" to others just want to ridicule you for making a suggestion and "it's only a cheap oscillator" - so an open mind is still influenced by known dogmatism and that old bug-bear, price.

But it remains the question - is there something inherent in SAW oscillators that we are not yet fully aware of?
I don't think so. As I have alluded to here and discussed with you, I know
users who hated Tent / Terra Firma / other low jitter clocks and built their
own clocks using various different power supplies.

I was pretty much convinced they were just playing with adding various
jitter spectra to tune their systems.

That's why I built my zenclock super low jitter OCXO based clock and had
designed a jitter addition circuit for it in specific adjustable frequency areas.

I was convinced that was required. As it turns out I didn't have to use
the jitter addition circuit. But that's another story.
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Old 30th January 2013, 03:27 AM   #270
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You know that I never said to ignore specs. I am not that way inclined.

But then again, I don't ignore my ears.

I think that I am much more objective that Steve and Mario... pretty sure about that.

And when I get "corrected" for pointing out measurements to some "subjective" purists, I still put on a fair argument that one cannot be so sweeping and that it is counter-productive and often an over-reaction. Most measurements can be validated, yet there are the exceptions. Those are usually opportunities to learn.

Re TF, wouldn't you take a 99% success rate any day or time of the year? Those two letters have made me many friends - whatever it does, I get the "it sounds much less digital" and "I hear things I never heard before" and "it seems to sound less obvious detailed". The irony is that 'digital' sound can be connected to analogue noise. It takes analogue thinking to improve digital sound.

Cheers, Joe
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