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Old 22nd December 2012, 12:24 PM   #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric Schultz View Post
The new Crystek oscillators are the new industry standard low jitter clocks....many, many companies are using these on their digital input boards. I use them with great results. I have not played with any see SAWs. Of course, I want the SAWs to win....they are much cheaper!
The measured performance of Crystek XO's is a lot better than these SAW's,
especially at low frequencies.

If the SAW oscillator actually does sounds better, all else being equal, then
a few theories need to be re evaluated. Or maybe better = 'nicer' but
not necessarily more accurate.
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Old 22nd December 2012, 09:41 PM   #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zenelectro View Post
If the SAW oscillator actually does sounds better, all else being equal, then
a few theories need to be re evaluated. Or maybe better = 'nicer' but
not necessarily more accurate.
Absolutely agree on the first point, but I will say categorically that the SAW oscillator we have heard, pretty sure this includes what Coris is hearing, is actually less euphonic and I wouldn't describe it as nicer, but more real and honest. Maybe ruthless at times as well - and hence fascinating too. I can hear certain mixing effects in the music exposed quite dramatically, things like tape noise on classic rexorcings are oh so more analog and realistic sounding. That word "realism' continuously comes to mind. Also, euphoric comes with a level of bloat at cert kind of frequencies, lower, midrange and mid-bass - yet I hear significantly tightened up. I also hear bass textures much more clearly. Deep bass is very authoritative but no exaggeration. But air around instruments, the separation of that air against the actual size of the instruments or voice, where they merged into one, they now can easily separated by the ear. And PRAT, oh boy.

I don't anybody who tries them will call the euphonic. Pretty confident about that.

But as more will try them, the more feedback we get, thisn I believe will al be settled by consensus.

Cheers, Joe R.
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Old 23rd December 2012, 06:28 AM   #183
Coris is offline Coris  Norway
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I really do not know why people are sceptic to try something else. In this field of DIY one may not be at all conservator... or hanging on an "good old principle". Is the base of experimenting to try new things.
Maybe one or another are or may be euphoric about self experiments and its results. That because is a very big point that another ones (many) try the same and come out with them observations. This only push things further.
In this field of oscillators there is quite easy to replace an good old Crystek with an SAW one. SAW is cheap and quite easy to be found (in quite limited ranges of frequencies, but anyway...).
Replace the oscillator in your DAC/Buffalo and hear the results. Satisfied or not, share your observations, and in the last will be a conclusion. A negative conclusion about SAW, then we will go back to Crystek or try another things... It may not be easier than this...
Everybody will have something to gain out of such "procedure"...
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Old 23rd December 2012, 06:35 AM   #184
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coris View Post
Everybody will have something to gain out of such "procedure"...
Basically, you've got nothing to loose other than the cost of a cup of coffee at the local Cafe'.
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Old 23rd December 2012, 10:38 AM   #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coris View Post
I really do not know why people are sceptic to try something else. In this field of DIY one may not be at all conservator... or hanging on an "good old principle". Is the base of experimenting to try new things.
Maybe one or another are or may be euphoric about self experiments and its results. That because is a very big point that another ones (many) try the same and come out with them observations. This only push things further.
In this field of oscillators there is quite easy to replace an good old Crystek with an SAW one. SAW is cheap and quite easy to be found (in quite limited ranges of frequencies, but anyway...).
Replace the oscillator in your DAC/Buffalo and hear the results. Satisfied or not, share your observations, and in the last will be a conclusion. A negative conclusion about SAW, then we will go back to Crystek or try another things... It may not be easier than this...
Everybody will have something to gain out of such "procedure"...
Coris,

Don't worry I'll be trying them at some stage, I have a Sabre running on
100MHz kicking around here.

Generally from a diy'ers perspective it's all good and a free lunch You get
to try new parts and get great results. That's what is good about this place.

From technical perspective it's also good because we have something new
to investigate.

So these SAW oscillators apparently sound better than a conventional
oscillator but as far as I can see measure worse.
Have we missed something? I'm interested to find out.

Joe, maybe you could get a phase noise plot done from 1Hz -> 10kHz
on one of your SAW / Terrafirma oscillators?


cheers

T
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Old 23rd December 2012, 08:17 PM   #186
Coris is offline Coris  Norway
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No mater SAW or not, just Marry Christmas everybody!
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Old 30th December 2012, 10:04 PM   #187
Coris is offline Coris  Norway
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... and Happy new year!
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Old 30th December 2012, 10:51 PM   #188
Coris is offline Coris  Norway
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I succeed at least to power up my new BDP105...
Well very few and quick personal impressions about this new Oppo player (as it is out of the box):
I have to say/recognize that this machine is an step forward, comparing to the former model (unmodified) 95. The picture is just exceptional. I used for test only static HD pictures. I had no time yet to put on it an video/movie. The conversion 2D - 3D is quite poor. If the picture has an whatsoever background, then the 3D effect is a little bit there... But this is not so important anyway.
How it sounds (in my opinion)? Well it sounds good. Much better than (untouched) 95 model. I could hear many details, a quite deep and well defined bass, and for sure more fidelity than from 95. But is something wrong with the sound stage of this new player... No any sound stage, I mean...
I have an record on SACD which can give me a quite wide sound stage (on stereo out) when I hear it on my modified 95. But on 105 the instruments are all together just in between the two speakers (in the middle of the stage) on this my DSD recording. I played Erick Clapton unplugged (CD). This (old) recording is very good, the sound stage is wide and very well defined. The sound out of my 105 come (on this CD) well enough from the directions of the respective speakers, but nothing in between... The sound stage on my 105 device is wrong and very poor!
I haven`t tested yet how it sounds on USB in. I will do it in the next days...

It could be nice if somebody else (Joe, or somebody else who have had this player already) can come here with some impressions about this new model of Oppo as it is, out of the box (unmod). Is good to have something to compare: before and after modifications...
I can not wait to jump in to this player to fix what is to be fixed out...
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Old 31st December 2012, 04:18 PM   #189
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Hi Coris there there is a review of the 105 in this months HIFI News its quite positive of the audio side giving 85 out of 100, the test results on on their web site.
Geoff
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Old 31st December 2012, 06:36 PM   #190
Coris is offline Coris  Norway
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I will not say that 105 is a bad player. I said already that it sounds better than 95 (out of the box). In the same time, I have my personal observations (in the earlier) post . And follows here.
I`ve plaid an UltraHD CD (DXD recorded). It sounds very well indead, detailed and the sound stage is there (not very well defined...). I only miss a little bit more dynamic in the sound...
I`ve tested the USB in with the files I`m used to play on my mod 95. I can say that this stage of the player sounds much better than the transport one. It could be a little bit more dynamic too... For me it works much better on KS than ASIO (i use Foobar/win7).
I was not very impressed by the headphone out (Sennheiser IE 80), but it sounds well. I could register a quite big background white noise on this output. Well audible when no audio signal is present. This noise have the same level at increasing volume, and it hears as an chip generated noise or an induced one from somewhere. I did not measured anything. Is just what I can hear out from this player now... I use my headphones most on my Note II, and I can definitely not hear out of my phone that white noise in silent passages, as I can hear it out from 105...
I may say that I will not pretend those my first impressions as a well qualified review of BDP105. Not at all...

Thanks gwmorgan for information. I`m still waiting for own observations from owners of this player, they who have hear it and have or not critics about one or another aspects in audio stage first. I think almost all users may agree that the picture (video stage) of this machine is just impressive...

Last edited by Coris; 31st December 2012 at 06:48 PM.
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