Need HELP with my Naim CDS1 player.......... - diyAudio
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Old 28th December 2011, 01:59 AM   #1
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Default Need HELP with my Naim CDS1 player..........

Hello.... I have a Naim CDS1 (with CDSPS power supply) that no longer can play cds (I get error messages). I've been told by a local dealer that I need a new Philips CDM-4/25 transport mechanism. Only recently, I had similar issues and replaced the Philips TDA1541A S-1 chip (found after much searching on eBay) which briefly cleared up the problems. Here's a good view of this cd player (sans Lampization mod):

NAIM CDS-1

I'm having NO luck through my usual Naim sources/repair shop finding another Philips transport mechanism or even getting my question answered as to whether it even needs a new Philips mechanism or dac chip. I'm trying to think outside the box, hence I'm hoping you folks here can help. I live in Seattle and am open to any suggestions, including alternative electronic repair shops that might help me find a solution.

I've even wondered if it would be possible to mod this with an different external transport if no original replacement (new or used) can be found.

Any ideas of how to approach this without throwing away a wonderful nearly 15 year old machine that works absolute magic with music?
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Old 28th December 2011, 02:29 AM   #2
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You don't say what your symptom is/are. If it is a "no read" problem, or pretty much any fault that makes a tech suspect "bad laser", it is NOT. As you'll read on other threads about the CDM-4, pretty much the ONLY problem units with these mechs have is the failure of one single 33uf axial electrolytic capacitor on the servo board. Extremely easy fix. If you walked into my shop(Tucson), and that was all the work needed, I'd have a hard time even asking for my general service minimum of $90. It would only be the shipping effort that would make me feel ok charging that much.
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Old 28th December 2011, 03:34 AM   #3
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Thanks for the reply..... you've given me more information than I've gotten from my local Naim dealer to date. I'm fire-walled from the technician who actually works on it so I only get second hand information, at best.

The problem I'm having with the CDS1 is that when I put in a CD, I get an "error" on the screen. This got progressively worse, until now I can't play any CD's at all. I believe the CD's do spin until the "error" appears. The player is in the shop, so I can't check this. Until only recently, I could get some discs to play after repeatedly hitting the play button.

A side note: I was having this same problem a couple of years ago. The same local Naim dealer said (at the time) that it was a bad Philips TDA1541A S-1 chip. I dredged up a few on eBay (supposedly only 1 of the 3 were good) and they replaced it. When I got the player back it did work better, but looking back now, it wasn't completely resolved. It still seemed finicky.

I am open to sending this unit out if you think you'd have good chance of fixing it. My next step was to contact Naim, but my understanding is that these Philips transports are long gone and I'm not even sure if they'd work on it.

If I were to send you this unit, and it turned out that it isn't the electrolytic capacitor, would you have other options for a fix? I know that a few other (cheaper) players use the same transport, but it seems like a long shot finding one to raid for parts.
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Old 28th December 2011, 03:54 AM   #4
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I just remembered...... the original problem I had leading up to replacing the Philips TDA1541A S-1 chip was horrible static from one channel. This was fixed with the dac chip replacement, but the error message, finicky thing has just kept getting worse until it's current state of non-functionality.
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Old 28th December 2011, 05:36 AM   #5
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That's good. Your first fault was properly cured and has nothing at all to do with the current fault. You describe the failure pattern of that 33uf cap on the servo board perfectly.
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Old 28th December 2011, 07:03 PM   #6
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Can I get your phone number? I am open to shipping this to you if you think you could fix it. I'm still confused as to why both my local Naim dealer and the Naim service department both say "sucks to be you" and don't have the ability to actually repair the unit rather than just replace the whole transport.

Also.... if I were to send you this unit and replacing the capacitor doesn't do the trick would it be possible to repair it with parts from a different Philips transport such as the CDM-4/19? Here's an example I found of this more common transport on eBay:

philips CDM-4 CDM4 laser lens & Mechanical device | eBay

The plastic base looks different than my CDM-4/27 but the laser and spindle with nextel ring look identical.
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Old 28th December 2011, 07:54 PM   #7
johnm is offline johnm  United Kingdom
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Does this Naim use the 'top hat' style puck? If so the rubber circle on the area you place the cd onto might have worn which creates an error message as the disc isnt rotating accurately and is vibrating.

For a quick fix/test, try out a Naim cd5i puck first... Worked perfectly on my Naim CDI. Much smoother disc reading, and better sound quality to my ears. Of course some Naim die-hards will disagree

I was told by Naim the whole mechanism needed replacing in my CDI, at great cost. When the fault was the crappy 'top hat' style puck system! Using the CD5i puck cured it instantly. Worth a try, and it might save you a LOT of money

Good luck.

John

Last edited by johnm; 28th December 2011 at 07:57 PM.
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Old 29th December 2011, 12:37 AM   #8
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I've tried new top hat pucks, both single and double "0" rings, to no avail. The actual nextel ring on the transport is in mint shape and I keep that clean.

I've tried the CD5i style puck years ago and to my ears, I didn't like it as well as the single top hat style. Both the double "0" ring top hat and the CD5i puck seemed to kill some of the "air" around the notes, if that makes sense.

Yours is a good idea though and I'll pick one of those pucks up when I retrieve the player from the shop. Losing a bit of the fidelity is a better choice than having an old Naim CD player for a doorstop.
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Old 29th December 2011, 01:54 AM   #9
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My contact/shipping info is at Talking Dog Transducer Company.

In the extraordinarily unlikely event that the cdm needs replacement, yes, should be not a big problem to transfer laser or motor as needed from that cdm4/19.

It's very odd that Naim & it's dealer don't know how to properly service the unit. I can almost understand about Naim's own service department, as they may not have many owners sending in gear to them that's more than a few years old, and may simply be unfamiliar with the problems that take a decade or more to show up, but any experienced audio service tech in a dealer situation ought to know about issues like this one, which is common to such a large number of makers' players.
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Old 29th December 2011, 02:26 PM   #10
johnm is offline johnm  United Kingdom
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I just remembered I have a ZIP file full of instructions/pictures about transferring the laser mech from a CDM4/19 to the Naim CDI. If you fancy that please PM me. It annoys me that Naim insist on throwing out perfectly good transports instead of replacing JUST what needs replacing in many instances.

Afraid I don't believe in the superioroity of the Top Hat style puck. They were applying analogue techniques (i.e. as little touching the disc/transferring noise as possible) to a digital transport. That revolving disc needs to be as stable as possible to ensure accurate data retreival. If you look at the disc side on using the top hat puck you'd see it's free to vibrate. That's why it makes a rattling noise sometimes when searching for tracks. It works OK for a few years, then performance decreases quite quickly. The CD5i puck allows a stable reading of the disc (check out how noiselessly you can change tracks compared with the Top Hat). Plus it allows a constant level of performance. But that's just all my opinion of course

Either way these are SUPERB machines!

- John
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