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Old 24th September 2012, 11:19 AM   #1231
needsp is offline needsp  United Kingdom
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Hi Patrick

Quote:
you meant you prefer a side-by-side arrangement and not DAC above SEN ??
After all, you cannot make it to buzz with side-by-side, right ?
Yes. Though I can't that all side by side implementations would be problem free, mine is at the moment. Personally given the problems I've had with stacked arrangement, and the (now) obvious (theoretical) greater susceptibility of that layout to rf problems, I'll be sticking with the side by side arrangement in future.

Paul
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Old 24th September 2012, 01:07 PM   #1232
EUVL is offline EUVL  Europe
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> and the (now) obvious (theoretical) greater susceptibility of the stacked layout to rf problems ....

Is it not that this has now been proven by at least one experimental set up, rather than just "prejudice" as quoted in post #1209 ?




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Old 25th September 2012, 08:20 AM   #1233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bemused View Post

Click the image to open in full size.
OMG, thst must be a part of project on Electronic warfare ? How many watts does it emits?
No wonder opamps work bad in these conditions.

Last edited by steel monkey; 25th September 2012 at 08:47 AM.
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Old 25th September 2012, 08:52 AM   #1234
EUVL is offline EUVL  Europe
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> How many watts does it emits?

Nothing compared to a Class A power amp.

> No wonder opamps work bad in these conditions.

Why not just use DSD to drive digital-input switching power amps direct ?
Nothing can beat that by energy efficiency.
I am sure they can also sound fantastic.


Patrick
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Old 25th September 2012, 09:44 AM   #1235
Bemused is offline Bemused  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steel monkey View Post
OMG, thst must be a part of project on Electronic warfare ? How many watts does it emits?
No wonder opamps work bad in these conditions.
Its just a pair of Buffalo, Arduino and eighten regulators four of which are hungry shunts as most Buffalo builds have the remainder are linier so harly any more power than a standard build, looks messy because most regulators are hard against the Buffalos with short wiring.
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Old 25th September 2012, 03:34 PM   #1236
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Well, maybe I used wrong term. Mayby "radiates" suites here better. But, anyway, with such layout your dac will radiate and recieve tons of RF garbage. DAC contains very high speed clock signals, with rise times orders if 5 nsec, it tends to spred upon any wire it "sees" around. Things are especially scary because you are using sabre, which has very righ output current - around 10 mA. Output current contains EM spectrum up to GHz range. Any power amp will not be happy to see it on its input .
Another problem is separate i/u and dac boards, one of the worst things you can do to delta-sigma converter because abovementioned HF modulation. The worther might be only using one output in a couple. By design, delta-sigma dac might be considered high-speed digital chip, with lots of digital logic: digital filer, ASRC in case of Sabre, DS modulator. All this logic emits RF noise, but it is common to I+ and I-. To remove it, stage for a substraction should be used.
Personally I ended few times with layout like that. Every time I tried to compare them with my Dell laptom build in sound, and it was better, especyally after some filtering. Of course, I can not extrapolate anything anywhere
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Old 25th September 2012, 03:42 PM   #1237
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Here you can see optimised layout for DS dac Google Translate
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Old 25th September 2012, 05:10 PM   #1238
Bemused is offline Bemused  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steel monkey View Post
All this logic emits RF noise, but it is common to I+ and I-. To remove it, stage for a substraction should be used.
Waiting for Xcen
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Old 25th September 2012, 05:38 PM   #1239
EUVL is offline EUVL  Europe
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Currently undergoing Beta tests by various people.


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Old 25th September 2012, 07:07 PM   #1240
Bemused is offline Bemused  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EUVL View Post
Currently undergoing Beta tests by various people.


Patrick
Thanks, have been watching your activity
Looking forward to the release
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