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Old 5th July 2011, 10:32 PM   #11
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Hello

There is another little detail, normally there is a 1K ohm .047 uf filter to be connect to pin 20 of the CS8412, but in your schematic they connected it to pin 19, so it it should be connect to pin 20 like in the image I include.

Bye

Gaetan
Attached Images
File Type: gif CS8412 filter.gif (2.7 KB, 316 views)
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Old 6th July 2011, 01:53 AM   #12
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if u look at the real board the filter pin is connected right.

does anybody know of a really good discrete i/v converter to try?
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Old 6th July 2011, 02:15 AM   #13
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Are there any other 3-terminal regulators that improve the sonics more than the lm317.
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Old 6th July 2011, 03:52 AM   #14
gabdx is offline gabdx  Canada
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I wonder if there is benefit from feeding the tda output with a voltage ?
Right now I feed it with the power rails throught a trimpot until it reads out 0mv on the output.
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Old 6th July 2011, 06:17 PM   #15
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Default NOISE ON POWER RAILS & DAC DATA

I bought a couple of old Philips TDA1541 based players off Ebay. A cd471 & cd373.

The attached screenshots from the 471 are of the + 5v and -5v power rails at the 1541 pins.
The +5v rail is only 4.8v and has about .25v of noise on it and the -5v rail is close to -5.6v and also has about .5v of noise on it.

The other screenshots are of the data, before and after the 7220 - ie before and after over sampling.

I don't intend to do anything about the noise as I only bought them as cheap transports with I2S signals for my dual differential dac with I/V transformer experiments.
When I get hold of an analogue scope I will look at the clocks as well (my Pico scope is only good for about 100kHz square wave capture).
I

PS
will upload the +5v screenshot later.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 471-5v.jpg (15.2 KB, 296 views)
File Type: jpg 7220inputdata.jpg (17.4 KB, 294 views)
File Type: jpg 7220outputdata.jpg (18.0 KB, 252 views)
File Type: jpg 471neg5v.jpg (15.4 KB, 250 views)

Last edited by batteryman; 6th July 2011 at 06:21 PM. Reason: added +5v shot
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Old 6th July 2011, 06:29 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
if u look at the real board the filter pin is connected right.

does anybody know of a really good discrete i/v converter to try?
Try here:

http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/Z-IV.pdf

Its needs to have low input impedance such as common base or common gate.
You should be able to clean up any power supply noise with an LCR filter between the psu and dac.
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Old 6th July 2011, 08:38 PM   #17
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After reading some posts on this form some people say that the TDA1541 sucks some people say that it sounds really good, how does it compare to the AK4396, PCM19**, and other modern DAC's I'm did not know that building a DAC had so many hard choices to make.

All of the music that I listen to is on my computer in 16-Bit Lossless on my Mac Pro, My Amp is a clone of the DX Precision I, and my speakers are a copy of these The Seas ER18DXT ported two way
I really don't have anything to compare the sound to because I don't have any vinyl of the recordings. and the only other "DAC" like thing i have is a budget Yamaha Receiver with a Pre-Out. What i'm saying is how will I know it sounds "good" if I never heard it without the music passing through something that is "Hi-Fi"
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Old 6th July 2011, 09:42 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
After reading some posts on this form some people say that the TDA1541 sucks some people say that it sounds really good, how does it compare to the AK4396, PCM19**, and other modern DAC's I'm did not know that building a DAC had so many hard choices to make. "
That's the $64000 question and there is no answer. Only you know what you like so there's no point in asking others because you may not like what they do.

In many cases newer chips replace older ones not because they sound better but because they offer more features - eg multiple sample rate capability, multiple inputs etc. I believe the manufacturers are more intent on trying to keep abreast of competitors than offering us better sound quality.

In comparing the 1987 Philips CD471 with my benchmark Musical Fidelty Xray and Xdac, I was bemused to find how the difference between them was not vast and could probably be accounted for by improved design and better quality components rather than a major breakthrough in dac design.

This is why I am pressing ahead with my own dual differential 1541 design.
I will compare it with the Xdac and Audio Note Dac 1 (AD1865 dac) and also try the I/V transformers on the AD1865.

So unless you can experiment, you will never really know what you are missing!
I
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Old 7th July 2011, 01:16 AM   #19
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First I want to try it with oversampling on to see the difference in SQ I have the SAA7220 can you just place in without the clock and 74HC04 and to put it back in NOS just place the 3 wire links.

I will try OpAmps first than tubes (does anyone have any good tube I/V stages)

Do I need a preamp after the i/v stage or can that plug right into the amp (10K volume-10K impedance amp)?

what is the best way to have a subwoofer output with a 100Hz crossover?

in NOS mode will there be hi-freq rolloff or excessive noise?
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Old 7th July 2011, 02:28 AM   #20
erin is offline erin  Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
in NOS mode will there be hi-freq rolloff or excessive noise?
There will be a little HF rolloff, but most people dont care or dont notice. Only you can see for yourself if it matters or is noticeable to you.

If you leave the filter caps installed, you will be unlikely to percieve any aliasing noise. If you remove them, you might, or might not sometimes notice some strange effects in the mid and highs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
After reading some posts on this form some people say that the TDA1541 sucks some people say that it sounds really good, how does it compare to the AK4396, PCM19**, and other modern DAC's I'm did not know that building a DAC had so many hard choices to make.
The TDA1541A compares very well to modern DAC chips, fear not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
Would a output stage using the OPA633 have better sound than a tube output stage
Unlikely to sound better


Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
does anybody know of a really good discrete i/v converter to try?
Yes, a class A valve output stage, using 6DJ8 or equivilent

Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
What are the benefits of NOS the 1541
IMO, to put it simply, non oversamling avoids the use of the SAA7220 upsampling filter chip in the signal path, which for various reasons, results in "bad" sound.
When this chip is bypassed most people notice an improvement in the sound.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benproiii View Post
First I want to try it with oversampling on to see the difference in SQ I have the SAA7220 can you just place in without the clock and 74HC04 and to put it back in NOS just place the 3 wire links.
?
Not quite, with this kit, the CS8412 reciever is wired up in slave mode so it takes its clock signals from the Crystal on the board. You have put the CS8412 into Master mode so the clocks are generated internally, so you have to lift one leg of the CS8412 and connect another leg to either ground or +5V (I cant remember now - I will look later tonight and let you know)

Last edited by erin; 7th July 2011 at 02:52 AM.
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