Go Back   Home > Forums > Source & Line > Digital Source

Digital Source Digital Players and Recorders: CD , SACD , Tape, Memory Card, etc.

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 4th May 2011, 07:07 AM   #1
diyAudio Member
 
tiefbassuebertr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: D-55629 Schwarzerden
Default NAD C525BEE - "No Disc" Trouble Shooting Advice wanted

This compact disc player from NAD uses the SONY mechanism KSM213CCM with laser pickup KSS-213C. The compact disc turns on, two times in CD/CDR mode and two times in CD/RW mode. RF signal is normal while the "read-in" try. But TOC wasn't detected.
A new mechanism doesn't change the situation and the old mechanism so as the old flex connector from C525BEE works fine in an other compact disc player device.
BTW - the model C525BEE haven't no longer agjustment devices for tracking and focus gain/offset. Soldering is already PBfree (lead free).
What failure is most likely on the PCB? Perhaps certainly electrolytics?
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 07:27 AM   #2
Mooly is offline Mooly  United Kingdom
diyAudio Moderator
 
Mooly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
PLL adjustment maybe ?
__________________
-------------------------------------------------------
A simulation free zone. Design it, build it, test it.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 08:09 AM   #3
singa is offline singa  Singapore
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: near
Send a message via AIM to singa Send a message via MSN to singa Send a message via Yahoo to singa
Hi, Did you remove the anti static short at the laser module?
Did the laser turn on and the spindle spin when trying to read?
Did the laser go to home position near the inner part or starting
part of cd?

It is possible the laser forcusing IC is bad or the laser driver IC
too.You need the service manual for this.Could also be a bad spindle
motor ,the resistance should be about 12 ohms. Good luck.Also check
for solder joint breaks.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 08:48 AM   #4
diyAudio Member
 
tiefbassuebertr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: D-55629 Schwarzerden
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooly View Post
PLL adjustment maybe ?
No. Adjustment present only for APC (laser unit, on board) and display illumination brightness (R709, main PCB - btw: the brighter, the louder the unwanted mechanical sine wave pip from display).

Follow chips are in use:
U201: BA6392FP, 4-channel BTL driver for CD players (Rohm)
BA6392FP Datasheet pdf - Optical Disc LSIs > Motor/Actuator driver > CD/CD-ROM driver(4ch) - ROHM
U301: CXD3017, CD Digital Signal Processor with Built-in Digital Servo and DAC (Sony)
http://www.datasheetcatalog.org/data...y/e6801333.pdf
U302: PCM1710U, DAC
U101: 620P57 Photo diode signal processor (for me unknown type - could be also other because very hard to read from chip surface)
U401: operating MCU in QFP outline without type number, firmware version according sticker on it: c521/525 05262006
If there are breaks or GND short in the connections for data exchange between U301 and U401 (PCB wires or internal bonding of both chips itself, P1-P9 page 116 datasheet CXD3017Q), the fixing of exactly error reason is probably hard to realize.

Quote:
Originally Posted by singa View Post
Hi, Did you remove the anti static short at the laser module?
Did the laser turn on and the spindle spin when trying to read?
Did the laser go to home position near the inner part or starting
part of cd?
Yes for all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by singa View Post
It is possible the laser forcusing IC is bad or the laser driver IC
too.Could also be a bad spindle
motor ,the resistance should be about 12 ohms.
unlikely; mechanism include spindle motor works fine by other cd player model
Quote:
Originally Posted by singa View Post
Hi, You need the service manual for this.
Yes, but not from NAD (not well troubleshooting descriptions) but from a Sony cd player model, where the same CXD3017Q PCM decoder is in use. Who knows such a model?
BTW - The NAD C521BEE could be use the same topology in that aera, from where comes that error - go to
http://noresin.com/files/NAD%20C521BEE.pdf
U101 here is CXA2581
http://www.datasheetcatalog.org/data.../199475_DS.pdf
and U401 follow: Mitsubishi M38223 E4HP4
http://www.datasheetcatalog.org/data.../1022028_1.pdf
http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/data...M38223M4.shtml

Last edited by tiefbassuebertr; 4th May 2011 at 09:13 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 09:44 AM   #5
diyAudio Member
 
tiefbassuebertr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: D-55629 Schwarzerden
Default Differences between NAD 521 and 525

NAD C 525 BEE - audio - Magnus.de
http://www.superfi.co.uk/index.cfm/p...roduct_ID/3090
http://audiojunkies.com/forum/cd-pla...-c525-bee.html
http://hifigoteborg.se/nad_manuals_self/C521BEE.pdf (complete manual)

Last edited by tiefbassuebertr; 4th May 2011 at 09:51 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 11:08 AM   #6
Mooly is offline Mooly  United Kingdom
diyAudio Moderator
 
Mooly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Hard to say. Does the pickup return to its rest position if you manually move it outward and then power up?

You say the RF is OK ? Does the disc appear to run at correct speed while trying to read TOC.

Are all supplies correct and clean as measured at their destintions ?
Is the tracking coil drive to the pickup working OK ?

You now the mech is OK. If the RF is good and reaching its destination cleanly then it does sound like the servos/data processor are not synced. Spillage ?
__________________
-------------------------------------------------------
A simulation free zone. Design it, build it, test it.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 04:50 PM   #7
diyAudio Member
 
tiefbassuebertr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: D-55629 Schwarzerden
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooly View Post
Hard to say. Does the pickup return to its rest position if you manually move it outward and then power up?

You say the RF is OK ? Does the disc appear to run at correct speed while trying to read TOC.

Are all supplies correct and clean as measured at their destintions ?
Is the tracking coil drive to the pickup working OK ?

You now the mech is OK. If the RF is good and reaching its destination cleanly then it does sound like the servos/data processor are not synced. Spillage ?
The last is most likely the case. Also the not correct tracking coil drive could be the reason, but if I cut the Tracking signal-PCB wire, the behaviour is other (disc speed goes higher and higher).
About
Videohifi Forum
I note, that Sony's last generation cd player (XE-series) uses not the last generation decoder chips - in use is the CXD2545Q and CXD2585Q.
In the Sony car hifi changer model CDX-602/21 and CDX-602/17 the CXD3017Q is in use (together with LA6576L, LB1930M and BA8272), as to read about
http://lamson.dnsdojo.com/DATALIST/A-Z-PDF/06079.txt
but this model uses also the CXD3017
http://elbase.ru/app/webroot/files/t...X1/HCDCPX1.pdf

Last edited by tiefbassuebertr; 4th May 2011 at 05:05 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 05:02 PM   #8
Mooly is offline Mooly  United Kingdom
diyAudio Moderator
 
Mooly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
I can't think of anything else to try... maybe it is spillage. If the disc speed increases with the tracking disconnected it sounds like that part is working OK.

The old engineers trick (well one of mine ) of using damp fingers to try and "pull" any oscillator etc ... just to see if you can get it to lock comes to mind.

Dunno... would need it hooked up on the bench to investigate further.
__________________
-------------------------------------------------------
A simulation free zone. Design it, build it, test it.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 08:50 PM   #9
guytou is offline guytou  France
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: marseille
do you have a push-pull of transistors on focus/tracking ? A repetitive default on these players was bad solder on these transistors or weak/dead transistors . The plant was aware of this default , they print a note about this
__________________
"celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver pas grand chose ,n'a de merci dire personne "-Pierre Dac
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th May 2011, 10:36 PM   #10
diyAudio Member
 
tiefbassuebertr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: D-55629 Schwarzerden
Quote:
Originally Posted by guytou View Post
do you have a push-pull of transistors on focus/tracking ? A repetitive default on these players was bad solder on these transistors or weak/dead transistors . The plant was aware of this default , they print a note about this
Indeed - that was the first error of this compact disc player: Not present lens driving for goes up and down and therefore no FOK signal and no turn on the disc. After resolder this transistors the above descripted is to observe
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooly View Post
The old engineers trick (well one of mine ) of using damp fingers to try and "pull" any oscillator etc ... just to see if you can get it to lock comes to mind.
Such things sometime CD devices may bring back to life - unfortunately not in this case. My estimate is the MCU U401 itself or shortings arround this; I note extremly bad leadfree solder work arround this 80pin LQFP-MCU (12✕12mm plastic body).
P.S.
I don't understand this term:
.........maybe it is spillage

Last edited by tiefbassuebertr; 4th May 2011 at 10:50 PM.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Grundig CD 8400 MKII "DISC" ATRAC3 Digital Source 1 4th June 2011 08:36 PM
Marantz CD6002 "No Disc" Error dnice1 Digital Source 4 19th June 2010 01:18 PM
31 Band Equalizer "the t.eq" "TQ-60" schematic wanted tiefbassuebertr Solid State 2 29th March 2010 03:45 PM
Wanted to Buy: Pairs of 5-1/2";6-1/2";8";10" Seas Aluminum Woofers dtm1962 Swap Meet 0 15th January 2010 04:38 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 03:17 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2