The Ultimate Sound Improving for Compact Disc's through Patent-Pend.CD Sound Improver - Page 11 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Source & Line > Digital Source

Digital Source Digital Players and Recorders: CD , SACD , Tape, Memory Card, etc.

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 29th January 2010, 06:38 AM   #101
cbdb is offline cbdb  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Vancouver
Its all about the error correction. Theres always a percentage of pit misreads off any optical disc, but the data can come off perfect every time (or not at all). When was the last time you pulled a word document off a CD and a few words changed? If you convert your music to wave files and store them on CD, they will come back bit perfect (even spinning 48x or vibrating the computer). The error correction on audio CDs isnt as good as data CDs but as I understand it the only time bits are "lost" is when there are C2 errors. Does anyone know how often these occur in a average CD player?
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 06:42 AM   #102
frugal-phile(tm)
diyAudio Moderator
 
planet10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Victoria, BC, NA, Sol III
Blog Entries: 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbdb View Post
When was the last time you pulled a word document off a CD and a few words changed?
I avoid Word as much as possible. It is a terrible piece of software.

But i get what you mean. You do have to get it off the audio CD to start with thou.

dave
__________________
community sites t-linespeakers.org, frugal-horn.com, frugal-phile.com ........ commercial site planet10-HiFi
p10-hifi forum here at diyA
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 06:48 AM   #103
cbdb is offline cbdb  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Vancouver
Sure and there is software that tells you how many errors you got when you ripped the CD. I seem to recall there werent that many C2 errors, the hard part was burning audio CDs without lots of C2s
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 07:03 AM   #104
Mooly is online now Mooly  United Kingdom
diyAudio Moderator
 
Mooly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Chris deserves a big thank you for taking the time and trouble to help explain the actual processes at work here... and to keep reminding folk that we are dealing with what is an analogue signal off the disc. Discs don't have 1' and 0's, pits and lands are not directly representing 1's and 0's. The change from 1 to 0 and vice versa occurs whenever there is a transistion from pit to land and vice versa. This is also intimately related to the wavelength of the laser "light"... the difference in "height" between a "pit" and a "land" is the difference between "light is reflected back" or "no light is reflected back". That microscopic difference in "distance" the light travels allows for "cancellation" or not of the reflected signal.
CDR's... any recordable disc is fundamentally "different" here as there are no pit's and lands, just reflective material, or non reflective (where the state has been altered by burning). The "edge" definition of these transistions is far less well defined than a pressed disc.

As an aside to this, and I know Chris will have found this many times when looking at RF patterns, that if you just lightly "hold" the leads to a pickup the RF deteriorates so badly with noise/jitter... you name it, yet the player goes on regardless.

I think I read in there "you hear what you want to hear" or something along those lines.
I think that sums up most "tweaky" arguments here, not just this thread but cables, burn in of IC's etc etc.

Good on you Chris
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 09:34 AM   #105
SY is offline SY  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
SY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Chicagoland
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Its like saying demagnetizing my camera lens has improved my pictures. Would you believe that, if so I have products to sell you.
Quote:
When was the last time you pulled a word document off a CD and a few words changed?
Excellent analogies, may I steal them sometime?

Quote:
Does anyone know how often these occur in a average CD player?
As Scott and I posted a few pages back, hardly ever (I used my old cheap 1988-vintage Magnavox for that test).

And Chris, a terrific job of explanation. My deepest thanks to you.
__________________
The more you pay for it, the less inclined you are to doubt it.- George Smiley
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 09:58 AM   #106
diyAudio Moderator Emeritus
 
Bas Horneman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: The Netherlands
Blog Entries: 18
Quote:
I remember Peter van Willenswaard doing this measurement for a variety of CD snake oil treatments and finding... zero difference.
I also remember reading that Peter van Willenswaard thinks the green pen on the edges of a CD improves the sound of a CD.

I have never heard a difference. But then again I never did any serious comparison/did not have a good enough hifi system/good enough ears.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 10:01 AM   #107
Magura is offline Magura  Denmark
diyAudio Member
 
Magura's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Denmark, Viborg
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bas Horneman View Post
I also remember reading that Peter van Willenswaard thinks the green pen on the edges of a CD improves the sound of a CD.

I have never heard a difference. But then again I never did any serious comparison/did not have a good enough hifi system/good enough ears.
Sorry to bring you bad news Bas, but you're just plain deaf, like the rest of us whom can't hear the difference

Which would lead to the conclusion, that SY is stone deaf!


Magura
__________________
Everything is possible....to do the impossible just takes a little while longer.
www.class-a-labs.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 10:40 AM   #108
godfrey is offline godfrey  South Africa
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Cape Town
Quote:
Originally Posted by malcontent View Post
AFAIK PC clocks are dithered to reduce RF emission, so that can't be good. Not sure if the card attempts to re-clock or not. But, that is jitter, not data.
The good news is there's often a BIOS setting that allows you to switch that off.

IIRC the magic word is "spread spectrum" (for my Gigabyte motherboard anyway). Turn that off to get a constant clock speed.

I found out about that in context of the effect it might have on system stability when overclocking.

It didn't occur to me till now that it could also jitter the audio. Duh!
Thanks for the heads-up.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 10:49 AM   #109
diyAudio Member
 
tiefbassuebertr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: D-55629 Schwarzerden
2500 access numbers within 3 days (and also some very interesting URL's and attachements), and such intensive discussion - I never expected this in this matter.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2010, 10:51 AM   #110
SY is offline SY  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
SY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Chicagoland
Blog Entries: 1
Religion and faith are always controversial.
__________________
The more you pay for it, the less inclined you are to doubt it.- George Smiley
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ultra Compact Sound System jonkun227 Everything Else 4 28th July 2008 04:44 PM
Improving Sound Quality of a car amp coki Car Audio 0 25th June 2007 04:50 PM
Further improving the sound of my fostex BLH wboyd Full Range 8 1st February 2006 05:23 PM
Improving sound card digital section - beginner questions halcyon Digital Source 3 21st November 2005 12:39 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 06:26 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2