Compresed files.
http://vicol-audio.ro/img/shiga/case.7z
Regards,
Tibi
PS. An IT advice. Use Firefox or Chrome, are faster and safer.
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I've been reading through the last several pages as I've been getting ready to put my own unit together (BTW, got the package last week, Tibi - so far things look fine but I wanted to bring home some ESD bags from work before I start handling the boards). The problems discussed about mounting the transport mechanism got me thinking...
If it looks like using one bolt is not ideal, and using multiple bolts raises the concern of torsion or stress on the drive, would it be possible to create a semi-rigid or decoupled mount for the drive? Maybe a multi-point mount (multiple bolts) but the drive either spring loaded or bushing mounted on those bolts?
If it looks like using one bolt is not ideal, and using multiple bolts raises the concern of torsion or stress on the drive, would it be possible to create a semi-rigid or decoupled mount for the drive? Maybe a multi-point mount (multiple bolts) but the drive either spring loaded or bushing mounted on those bolts?
Tony, the mounting as such is not a problem at all. You can mount it any way you like, or just leave it lying on the floor, and it will work fine. The problem is in that the mounting has a strong, and not yet fully understood influence on the sound.
Mounting with one bolt would probably cause the mech to bend under its own weight, so is certainly not recommended. So far, the optimal (sonic-wise) solution is to attach the mech rigidly, with two bolts, to a rigid, heavy structure, that conducts vibration well, but does not ring very much - preferably a slab of copper or bronze. Mounting the mech non-rigidly results in muddiness and loss of detail. Using more than two bolts also results in degraded performance.
So far the best mounting, in my opinion, has been proposed by Tony X: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-source/120229-finally-affordable-cd-transport-shigaclone-story-131.html#post3323372 - the idea of using spacers is certainly a very good one.
Mounting with one bolt would probably cause the mech to bend under its own weight, so is certainly not recommended. So far, the optimal (sonic-wise) solution is to attach the mech rigidly, with two bolts, to a rigid, heavy structure, that conducts vibration well, but does not ring very much - preferably a slab of copper or bronze. Mounting the mech non-rigidly results in muddiness and loss of detail. Using more than two bolts also results in degraded performance.
So far the best mounting, in my opinion, has been proposed by Tony X: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-source/120229-finally-affordable-cd-transport-shigaclone-story-131.html#post3323372 - the idea of using spacers is certainly a very good one.
Hi uncle_leon,
I have try mounting with 4, 3 and 2 bolt2 and confirmed that 2 bolts is the best may be because it is easier to balance the laser with 2 bolts and putting less stress on the metal frame. I will need to find a copper slab to replace the current 3mm aluminium plate and mount it with M8 bolts.
The Sanyo laser is very selective on cd-rom, try burning cd's using various software and blank cd-rom but haven't had a consistent result yet. Only 1 out of 4 can be played with Sanyo but no problem with my oppo at all.
I have try mounting with 4, 3 and 2 bolt2 and confirmed that 2 bolts is the best may be because it is easier to balance the laser with 2 bolts and putting less stress on the metal frame. I will need to find a copper slab to replace the current 3mm aluminium plate and mount it with M8 bolts.
The Sanyo laser is very selective on cd-rom, try burning cd's using various software and blank cd-rom but haven't had a consistent result yet. Only 1 out of 4 can be played with Sanyo but no problem with my oppo at all.
To write CD's I'm using a PlexWritter Premium unit.
Best medium for blank cd-rom is Taiyo-Yuden. Sony and TDK are also OK.
Under Windows use EAC for CD ripping.
Under Linux use cdparanoya or Asunder and write with cdrecord by Jörg Schilling
Regards,
Tibi
Thanks uncle_leon. I was looking at that but wondered about the precision needed for the spacer rods. I don't have access to any kind of precision machining tools. I wonder if we could find a place online that sells precision cut hardened hollow metal rods that could be slipped over the moutning bolts?
Oh, and BTW, I got as a second kit from Tibi one with just the SMDs installed. That leaves me open to consider your custom devices for a supercharged model. Please PM me with info on your latest recommended devices.
How about this for the transport?
McMaster-Carr (look at the Male-Female Threaded Hex Standoffs)
Length accuracy seems to be pretty good (±0.005").
McMaster-Carr (look at the Male-Female Threaded Hex Standoffs)
Length accuracy seems to be pretty good (±0.005").
Transport Mounting
Regarding the standoff length repeatability, the Transport sheet metal stamping is anything BUT flat, with easily +/- .010" to .015" of run out using a dial indicator to check flatness. That said, use standoffs that are of uniform length and you have done pretty much all you can do.
Uncle_leon is correct...whatever you can do to reduce ringing and vibration in the stamping from the motors, etc, is likely to improve the sound and resolution of the transport, such as rigid mounting it via the 2 recommended standoffs to sink vibration to a base material that damps and kills vibration that he mentioned.
Has anyone mounted the Transport with the standoff using a damping washer arrangement to kill vibration at the sheet metal stamping?
Or applying damping material directly to the sheet metal stamping to kill vibration at the source?
I suppose another option is maybe mounting it on springs, but that does not deal with killing the vibration in the sheet metal stamping, or conducting it away via rigid mounting of the standoffs to the sheet metal stamping.
Regarding the standoff length repeatability, the Transport sheet metal stamping is anything BUT flat, with easily +/- .010" to .015" of run out using a dial indicator to check flatness. That said, use standoffs that are of uniform length and you have done pretty much all you can do.
Uncle_leon is correct...whatever you can do to reduce ringing and vibration in the stamping from the motors, etc, is likely to improve the sound and resolution of the transport, such as rigid mounting it via the 2 recommended standoffs to sink vibration to a base material that damps and kills vibration that he mentioned.
Has anyone mounted the Transport with the standoff using a damping washer arrangement to kill vibration at the sheet metal stamping?
Or applying damping material directly to the sheet metal stamping to kill vibration at the source?
I suppose another option is maybe mounting it on springs, but that does not deal with killing the vibration in the sheet metal stamping, or conducting it away via rigid mounting of the standoffs to the sheet metal stamping.
I seem to remember (and a quick but admittedly incomplete search indicates) a difference of opinion between a soft/sprung interface to the transport frame and a rigid mount, even if only through one bolt. I think Peter Daniel eventually settled on something of a sprung mount, but there are so many broken image links back in the early part of the thread that I can't say for certain that's true. I do seem to recall him indicating that a rigid mount across the entire frame resulted in a very uninteresting sound.
Since I have several Transports, I think I will try damping material, such as Dynamat, on one of the stamped sheet metal frames to do some back to back comparisons. That testing needs to include rigid mounting at 2 points and compliant mounting using E-A-R isolation mounts on the metal frame at 2 points.
One could go nuts on what base material is best to use to mount the standoffs on, but mass that does not ring would seem best.
One could go nuts on what base material is best to use to mount the standoffs on, but mass that does not ring would seem best.
Hi uncle Leon,
I read the last 100 pages or so and became interested in your 300 and 100 finest handmade resistors and your 0.01 cap.(c906)
I have a good gutfeeling about them and would love to experiment ( I have also the nudes Vishay).
Can I buy them from your site or....please advise...pm is also okay but I post this here out of sheer respect that you pick those things up.
I read the last 100 pages or so and became interested in your 300 and 100 finest handmade resistors and your 0.01 cap.(c906)
I have a good gutfeeling about them and would love to experiment ( I have also the nudes Vishay).
Can I buy them from your site or....please advise...pm is also okay but I post this here out of sheer respect that you pick those things up.
Hi Tony, I put all of my latest recommendations in my Compiled Shigaclone Guide. Of course, not everything is covered (yet!), so please feel free to ask about any particular positions.
As for my advice on supercharging the Shiga - apart from installing the best caps / resistors you can afford, separate power supplies and good mounting, I found great improvements from these unorthodox mods:
- wood modding electrolytic caps (all the PSU caps, C916 / C43 etc.). How much more natural they sound after the mod is hard to describe.
- the "spider mod". Ok, it is crazy, but it is cheap and honestly one of the best mods I have done to my Shiga. The start of the story is here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-source/120229-finally-affordable-cd-transport-shigaclone-story-126.html#post3159700
- getting rid of all the ceramic bypasses (see this section of my guide). This may be controversial with some of the more engineer-minded folks, as it is considered "good practise" to put bypasses across all electrolytic caps. However, listening tests were ruthless, the sound is much better without them, sweeter and much less "digital".
Naturally, I am happy to help you with implementing any of those.
Hi uncle Leon,
I read the last 100 pages or so and became interested in your 300 and 100 finest handmade resistors and your 0.01 cap.(c906)
I have a good gutfeeling about them and would love to experiment ( I have also the nudes Vishay).
Can I buy them from your site or....please advise...pm is also okay but I post this here out of sheer respect that you pick those things up.
Thank you Erik
I can send you my hand-made 300/100 resistor pair for testing, so you can compare them with your resistors on equal terms - please pm me your address. As an ultimate solution however, I definitely recommend a 75-Ohm Pi-pad configuration instead.Regarding my capacitors, I am happy to send you a sample as well - just keep in mind these caps are physically very big (10cm long, excluding leads), so please check first if you have enough space for them.
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Thanks uncle for all the information, but as far as this goes, are you offering a Pi-pad solution or do we follow the recommendation from where that was discussed in this thread a while back?
Hi,
i have a strange problem with motor.. when its powered on its trying to go on the rail and and doesn't stop..
i take this video to a better explanation..
2013 02 03 14 58 34 732 - YouTube
what can be the problem? what should i do?
thanks..
i have a strange problem with motor.. when its powered on its trying to go on the rail and and doesn't stop..
i take this video to a better explanation..
2013 02 03 14 58 34 732 - YouTube
what can be the problem? what should i do?
thanks..
CD Sled Limit Switch
endia...On power up, the CD Sled should move to toward the CD Turntable, where a tap on the bottom of the CD Sled contacts and closes a limit switch to "home" the CD Sled and then start reading the disc.
Check that the contacts are actually closing with a meter at the Transport Motor connector pins and likewise at the "Motor" connection pins on the processor board. IF you have a closed contact signal to that point, then the problem is in the processor board, but I am betting it is the cable or poor pin contact at one end or the other of the cable connectors.
endia...On power up, the CD Sled should move to toward the CD Turntable, where a tap on the bottom of the CD Sled contacts and closes a limit switch to "home" the CD Sled and then start reading the disc.
Check that the contacts are actually closing with a meter at the Transport Motor connector pins and likewise at the "Motor" connection pins on the processor board. IF you have a closed contact signal to that point, then the problem is in the processor board, but I am betting it is the cable or poor pin contact at one end or the other of the cable connectors.
Hi Tony, I recommend a 75-Ohm Pi-pad, which requires one 125R resistor and two 140R resistors. All of these are available from me, in both the cheaper and the "extreme" variety.
Another option is to have a manufacturer make a batch of resistors to order, although this typically requires a group buy for prices to become feasible. The diy-ers from the Polish forum audiostereo.pl are pursuing this approach, following my suggestion. I am convinced that in all but the most extreme cases a Pi-pad made with inferior resistors will outperform an L-pad made with good audio-grade resistors.
Endia,
You have twisted the 16 pin flat cable. Mount the cable in such way is not tension
and leave the mechanics to operate free.
Regards,
Tibi