Finally, an affordable CD Transport: the Shigaclone story - Page 405 - diyAudio
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Old 12th May 2010, 01:04 PM   #4041
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So far I have tried the original 0,1 uF (fine, but a bit harsh), a copperfoil Obbligato-Cap 0,047 uF (beautiful heights, but muddy bass, fine mids, a lot of space, less detailed than the original) and now I am listening to a little, cheap Russian paper in Oil Sangamo 0,01uF (very balanced sound, but quite grainy. Heights and bass are fine. Less defined details than the original. It is playing now for two days, so I will wait another week after wich it will be burned in). A Black Gate 0,1 uF is on its way, and a Mundorf Silver 0,22 will also be tested soon!

I am also very curious about the homemade cap! And mybe changing the alu or coppermantle for a wooden one is also interesting: || DHTRob - Impressies: Een Elna condensator in een houten behuizing... ||
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Old 13th May 2010, 10:01 PM   #4042
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I have a feeling that this 0.1uF is so important, because of the exact VALUE of the cap, not the type, as such. I think the laser adjustment is made at the factory and this cap has a part to play in this. When you install another 0.1uF cap the tolerance might be different enough to change some performance parameters perhaps?

Certainly most people prefer the sound of the original 0.1uF in place. If using a different type of cap, try to keep the value exactly the same as the original electrolytic (not just readin the value 0.1uf, but measuring the caps).

All guess work but might be useful
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Old 13th May 2010, 10:21 PM   #4043
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My experience so far is that the value of the capacitor is less important than the type of capacitor. Today I replaced the 0,01 uF Sangamo (of American origin, not Russian) with a Mundorf m-cap supreme Silver oil 0,22uF 1200V (which has all been burned in) and the results are really promising: much more and better defined bass than the original, beautifull heights, but some lesser space than the original. Very natural and much more detailed than the Sangamo oip. Next week I will try the Black Gate 0,1. If the Mundorf will be the best, it is worth trying a 0,1 uF, maybe the silver/gold in oil version.

It sounds a bit odd to me that in the factory a laser-adjustment has been made, minding the costs of the transport. 5 dollar? Is it really necessery to adjust the laser? 0,22 uF or 0,01 uF: the transport runs and I don't think the differences we hear between these values are audible in the original RC EZ51 and would have influences the selling targets. Anyone knowing what capacitor has been used in theis place in the original Shigaraki ?
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Old 14th May 2010, 10:36 AM   #4044
johnm is offline johnm  United Kingdom
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If you look at the transport closely you will see a trim pot on the bottom right of the PCB attached to the laser. Perhaps this is adjusted with the 0,1uF playing a role in the final measurement/outcome. This is all guesswork of course, but might explain the importance of this cap. This would account for why 95% people who have built shigaclone eventually go back to using the original 0.1uF cap. I believe even Peter Daniel went back to it in the end.

I tried Auricap, Jensen copper foil, ERO cap, and a few others which I cannot remember now. The sound just gelled with the original cap, for me.

Perhaps if someone could find out how to adjust this pot then we'd have better luck with using different cap types (and values?) for this position.

Last edited by johnm; 14th May 2010 at 10:39 AM.
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Old 14th May 2010, 11:56 AM   #4045
massimo is offline massimo  Italy
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Those trim pots ofter seen on laser pick ups are quite tricky. Don't touch it unless you know exctctly how to do.
Generally they serve to improve the waveform shape of the RF signal.
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Old 14th May 2010, 08:24 PM   #4046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dijke308 View Post
My experience so far is that the value of the capacitor is less important than the type of capacitor. Today I replaced the 0,01 uF Sangamo (of American origin, not Russian) with a Mundorf m-cap supreme Silver oil 0,22uF 1200V (which has all been burned in) and the results are really promising: much more and better defined bass than the original, beautifull heights, but some lesser space than the original. Very natural and much more detailed than the Sangamo oip. Next week I will try the Black Gate 0,1. If the Mundorf will be the best, it is worth trying a 0,1 uF, maybe the silver/gold in oil version.
Yes, I agree that the value of capacitor is less important than the type.

For one cap type, I have tried many values from 0.01uF to 0.22uF, and the differences among them are very minor. What I can say is that the less the capacitance, the sound slightly leads to fast, bright, and active. On the other end, the more the capacitance, the sound is a bit more slow, smooth, and warm. All in all the original value 0.1uF is indeed most balanced in my experience.

Compared to the value, the differences among the capacitor types are rather significant. I have tried more than 10 types of capacitors including MultiCap, RelCap, Black Gate, WIMA, Rifa, Audio Note Tin/Mylar, Mundorf etc. The one I currently prefer is MultiCap PPFXS (0.1uF, of course). The Black Gate NX and PK are also not bad at all. WIMA FKP is good but it's value is limited to 0.01uF. All the MKP and the Mylar are no good at my system.
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Old 14th May 2010, 08:29 PM   #4047
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Originally Posted by johnm View Post
Perhaps if someone could find out how to adjust this pot then we'd have better luck with using different cap types (and values?) for this position.
A dealer of the Sanyo laser pickup mechanism told me that the pot is pre-adjusted in the factory and no need to adjust it anymore.
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Old 14th May 2010, 08:50 PM   #4048
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Originally Posted by nemo1968 View Post
If you have some time and patience you can make copper/cotton capacitor of Alpha Core 12 AWG inductor.You must place a sheets of copper and cotton in between two solid nonmetalic blocks and screw them.For 10nF you will need some 2m of foil.My blocks dimensions are 6x9 cm.Look at this white cube on my previous post with photos(third photo, cube under the right side under disc).You will get just natural ,uncolored sound with balanced timbre.I came on this idea after tried polystirene,various MKP from Vima,ERO,Philips etc. and each one got some mistake, to bright ,to soft,to.......So try this.Nice thing is that you have non inductive cap.After that you can make one for s/pdif and you will hear how this transport sings.
Hello nemo1968,

Thanks for your sharing. The homemade cap is truly interesting to me. Do you have a picture show the inside of the two white blocks? I would like to know how the copper and the cotton are structured.
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Old 15th May 2010, 10:10 AM   #4049
johnm is offline johnm  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlowe View Post
A dealer of the Sanyo laser pickup mechanism told me that the pot is pre-adjusted in the factory and no need to adjust it anymore.
No need to adjust it IFFFFF the values of certain caps have NOT been altered..... I think that 0.1uF is important. Is it a coincidence that just about everyone ends up going back to the original? I don't think so
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Old 15th May 2010, 10:49 AM   #4050
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Originally Posted by johnm View Post
No need to adjust it IFFFFF the values of certain caps have NOT been altered..... I think that 0.1uF is important. Is it a coincidence that just about everyone ends up going back to the original? I don't think so
Yes, I also like the value 0.1uF but prefer the other type (MultiCap PPFXS) at this moment. However, what is the reason makes you consider the value or the type of this cap depends on the laser current setting?

The function of C906 for LA9242 is called "tracking gain time constant setting" in the datasheet, and the pot on the pickup is about the laser current setting. Are they related?
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Last edited by Marlowe; 15th May 2010 at 11:13 AM.
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