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Old 9th April 2008, 09:23 PM   #71
mtl777 is offline mtl777  United States
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Default Re: What value caps should I use?

Quote:
Originally posted by Rosewell
I have a question and since it is related to cap locations that are discussed in this thread I thought it would be appropriate to post it here. I purchased a delta 1010 and it worked flawlessly for 11 months. One day I switched my PC on and the light indicating power to the breakout box would no longer light. The breakout box is now no longer functioning. I tried a few different cables from the breakout box to PCI card and I also tested the power supply with a dmm. The power supply tested fine, but just for the hell of it I ordered a new replacement supply and still nothing. I'm fairly busy and I haven't had time to open up the box to take a look until now. In the past I have attended a few basic electricity / electronics courses, but they are fuzzy now and I am certainly no engineer. I haven't tested any of the capacitors yet, but I am fairly certain C14 has gone bad. Upon visual inspection the top of that cap seems to be puffed out a bit. C17 looks fine but since they appear to work as a pair based on what I read I would like to replace both of them, so the question is what type of capacitor should I replace them with? I have three different types at my disposal to choose from. They are as follows: United Chemi-Con 470uF 63V +-20% KZE Series 5000 hour life at 105C, Panasonic-ECG 470uF 63V +-20% EB Series 10000 hour life at 105C, Nichicon 560uF 63V +-20% HE Series 5000 hour life at 105C. I'm not sure that replacing C14 and C17 will bring the box back to life, but based on this text I am hoping someone with the knowledge will give me their opinion. If I seem to be on the right track witch cap out of the above should I go with. The Panasonic is double the life of the Chemi-Con, so should I go with the Panasonic? Is there any advantage gained by using the Nichicon which has a slightly higher capacitance value, or will the larger value kill my box. My 1010 setup never disappointed me, so I don't care about modding anything. I just want my breakout box to function again because another $500 - $600 to replace this is not an option for me right now. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated. Sorry for the long winded possibly misplaced post. Hopefully this makes sense to someone.

First of all, if you do not intend to mod your 1010 but only want to fix it, I would advise that you send it in for warrantly repair. M-Audio has a very liberal warranty policy especially on 1010's because of the many complaints during its early releases related to the capacitor problem which is what you are experiencing. Don't touch anything in your 1010, and don't tell M-Audio that you already opened it. BTW, what's the color of your 1010's PCB? If it's green then it's really old, when the capacitor problem was prevalent. The new ones are blue.

If, however, you intend to mod your 1010 and don't care about losing the warranty, then my advice is to find the lowest ESR, highest ripple current rated caps that will fit on the cramped space. You can replace with higher cap value with a little downside of causing a slight increase in heat. I replaced the C14 and C17 caps in my PSU with Chemi-Con KY series 560uF 63V which has the same specs as their KZE series except that the KY has longer lifetime hours. To be on the safe side, I made some heat sinks and installed them on the +/-15V regulators. Not sure if this was necessary, but better to be safe than sorry.

The thing with the 1010's PSU is that the cramped space severely limits your choice of caps. Of the alternatives available, I found the KY series to be the best choice.

Good luck!
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Old 9th April 2008, 10:26 PM   #72
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My board is blue and is labeled REV. C 1999. Thank you both for your advice and opinions. Knowing very little about power supply design I needed some quick answers. I am going to replace both caps and see what happens. Rather than deal with M-Audio I am willing to take the risk for the potential benefit of a quick fix.
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Old 12th April 2008, 06:54 AM   #73
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Thanks again for the advice. I replaced those to caps (C14 C17) with the 10,000 hour Panasonic caps I have and I'm back in business. I swear this thing sounds fine to me even without any mods, but I think how things sound is always subjective.
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Old 19th May 2008, 08:51 PM   #74
mtl777 is offline mtl777  United States
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I have one final question (hopefully) before this project is done. For the Delta 1010 PSU caps C22 and C60, which are 2200uF 25V pre-regulator caps before the +5V regs, I would like to know which of the following is better to use:

NIC Components NRSY series
- or -
United Chemi-Con KZH series

Based on the KZH having lower impedance and higher ripple current rating, the KZH might be better than the NRSY. However, the KZH is documented as intended for PC motherboard applications whereas the NRSY is touted for switchers and converters, so I'm wondering if the KZH might not be as good as the NRSY for power supply applications, or if there are some specs other than impedance and ripple current that are more important to consider in my PSU application.

Your help is greatly appreciated. Thanks!
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Old 20th May 2008, 01:25 AM   #75
cuibono is offline cuibono  United States
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I would go with whatever one is easiest/cheaper to get - you don't need high ripple handling, and particularly low impedance is not a must either. The circuit application is not very demanding. Personally I buy panasonic fc series.
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Old 20th May 2008, 06:00 AM   #76
mtl777 is offline mtl777  United States
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The thing is, I already have both -- I got them as free samples. So I must choose one or the other. If you had to make a choice, which one would it be?

Thanks!
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Old 20th May 2008, 09:12 PM   #77
cuibono is offline cuibono  United States
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Free samples are good

Choose either one, I doubt it makes any difference - low impedance is a good thing...
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