Hello Eric,
consulting my notes, it's about a batch of 8 boards and not 10 and the boards you bought are WaveIOs and NOT BluWaves so I might add that you're on the wrong thread!
Anyway, I'll PM you with latest Windows driver for your WaveIO (v4.11) and see how your board is reacting to it!
In addition, let's talk over PMs to get more details from you.
This thread is for another board so let's keep it clean, if possible.
Thank you,
L
EDIT: WaveIO's thread is here, please use the link to report back your results!
consulting my notes, it's about a batch of 8 boards and not 10 and the boards you bought are WaveIOs and NOT BluWaves so I might add that you're on the wrong thread!
Anyway, I'll PM you with latest Windows driver for your WaveIO (v4.11) and see how your board is reacting to it!
In addition, let's talk over PMs to get more details from you.
This thread is for another board so let's keep it clean, if possible.
Thank you,
L
EDIT: WaveIO's thread is here, please use the link to report back your results!
Last edited:
Blue wave Working with Linux
Hi Lucian
My bluewave arrived and it is a gorgeous looking pcb, even better I've got it working right away with my Linux based server, fed by an Iso Regen and powered by 5v LT3045 reg externally. Out of the box it sounds really beautiful, rich and smooth with deep soundstage. More later... with some burn in and connected properly
Very happy
Patrick
Hi Lucian
My bluewave arrived and it is a gorgeous looking pcb, even better I've got it working right away with my Linux based server, fed by an Iso Regen and powered by 5v LT3045 reg externally. Out of the box it sounds really beautiful, rich and smooth with deep soundstage. More later... with some burn in and connected properly
Very happy
Patrick
Patrick, thank you very much for your feedback!
I'm glad you like the board despite the long wait...
You are welcome Lucian !
I had another session listening late into the night, the sound with the Bluewave now playing for a few days is spectacular to me. Voices have incredibly realistic nuances and inflections. Soundstage is deeper and wider, leaving the speakers and floating, details are multiplied, with increased air and transparency. Very pure sounding and sweeter... the realism is uncanny.
Hi Lorien
Have you tested if it make any difference in jitter measured between using a USB2.0 or USB3.0 port?
Hi Lorien,
I finally had the Blue Wave pcb installed in my LM-502 Line Magnetic dac and it replaced the unsatisfactory factory fitted unit - it worked straight away - the tech guy was really pleasantly surprised with how well it sounded, not an easy thing to do.
The initial trial here at home was feeding signal via the SOtM sms-200 server (using the Squeezelite program and data off the HDD) and it seems to be functioning perfectly - the LM-502 uses the ESS 9016 chip and it'll accept up to 24b/192k
However, changing to using the music data stored in the Laptop/jRiver and sending it to the sms-200 via the MPD/DNLA program did present some problems but this maybe because of an incorrect setup of the jRiver program after the computer was upgraded to Win 10 and everything needed attention, including the jRiver program.
The music can be fine for one song but the next new song from a different cd will breakup and static a lot - as a computer 'nonce' this is something I'll have to ask about and get an expert to set it up properly, I think.
Lastly, Plugging the laptop computer directly into the BlueWave pcb, and after some stuffing about, it plays perfectly, but only on 'standard' material 16b/44k but it works!! That's a bit of a Victory to this computer challenged person!
This dac hasn't sounded anywhere as good with either AES/EBU, SPdif or Toslink - it has an optional valve buffer on the output that really changes the sound - makes it 'more musical', if you'll pardon the 'jargon'
Again, Thank You for the device
I finally had the Blue Wave pcb installed in my LM-502 Line Magnetic dac and it replaced the unsatisfactory factory fitted unit - it worked straight away - the tech guy was really pleasantly surprised with how well it sounded, not an easy thing to do.
The initial trial here at home was feeding signal via the SOtM sms-200 server (using the Squeezelite program and data off the HDD) and it seems to be functioning perfectly - the LM-502 uses the ESS 9016 chip and it'll accept up to 24b/192k
However, changing to using the music data stored in the Laptop/jRiver and sending it to the sms-200 via the MPD/DNLA program did present some problems but this maybe because of an incorrect setup of the jRiver program after the computer was upgraded to Win 10 and everything needed attention, including the jRiver program.
The music can be fine for one song but the next new song from a different cd will breakup and static a lot - as a computer 'nonce' this is something I'll have to ask about and get an expert to set it up properly, I think.
Lastly, Plugging the laptop computer directly into the BlueWave pcb, and after some stuffing about, it plays perfectly, but only on 'standard' material 16b/44k but it works!! That's a bit of a Victory to this computer challenged person!
This dac hasn't sounded anywhere as good with either AES/EBU, SPdif or Toslink - it has an optional valve buffer on the output that really changes the sound - makes it 'more musical', if you'll pardon the 'jargon'
Again, Thank You for the device
Thanks for the pics Carsten.wit. Great quality soldering!
I wonder how complicated it is to replace clocks like these with mini BNC connectors for external clock input? Anyone know?
Thanks.
@ Kim: well, as you already know, I'm now focused on adding stability of this design when used with all platforms / OSes so measurements had to be done later.
As for jitter on USB3.0 vs USB2.0: the measurement is too subjective in my opinion! Why? Because each motherboard is designed in its own way, with own voltage regulators, PCB layout and parts. Taking them all together, one MoBos might be less noisy than others with better layout than others. I don't own such expensive jitter measurement tools and even if I did, I can only measure the USB ports I have at disposal. This is not objective but a subjective measurement which is mostly good only got me.
At theoretical level (not tested by me so far) the less noise on the USB path (including power and GND reference) => the better. Perhaps this was the reason why GigaByte (and maybe other MoBo manufacturers) decided to implement dedicated USB ports for DACs which - if I recall correctly - are in yellow color at the I/O panel.
Perhaps in the future I'll seek a way to measure "things" and post the result in different configurations. This way you may build up an idea on how USB 2.0 or USB 3.0 will influence the sound.
As for jitter on USB3.0 vs USB2.0: the measurement is too subjective in my opinion! Why? Because each motherboard is designed in its own way, with own voltage regulators, PCB layout and parts. Taking them all together, one MoBos might be less noisy than others with better layout than others. I don't own such expensive jitter measurement tools and even if I did, I can only measure the USB ports I have at disposal. This is not objective but a subjective measurement which is mostly good only got me.
At theoretical level (not tested by me so far) the less noise on the USB path (including power and GND reference) => the better. Perhaps this was the reason why GigaByte (and maybe other MoBo manufacturers) decided to implement dedicated USB ports for DACs which - if I recall correctly - are in yellow color at the I/O panel.
Perhaps in the future I'll seek a way to measure "things" and post the result in different configurations. This way you may build up an idea on how USB 2.0 or USB 3.0 will influence the sound.
@ Kim: well, as you already know, I'm now focused on adding stability of this design when used with all platforms / OSes so measurements had to be done later.
As for jitter on USB3.0 vs USB2.0: the measurement is too subjective in my opinion! Why? Because each motherboard is designed in its own way, with own voltage regulators, PCB layout and parts. Taking them all together, one MoBos might be less noisy than others with better layout than others. I don't own such expensive jitter measurement tools and even if I did, I can only measure the USB ports I have at disposal. This is not objective but a subjective measurement which is mostly good only got me.
At theoretical level (not tested by me so far) the less noise on the USB path (including power and GND reference) => the better. Perhaps this was the reason why GigaByte (and maybe other MoBo manufacturers) decided to implement dedicated USB ports for DACs which - if I recall correctly - are in yellow color at the I/O panel.
Perhaps in the future I'll seek a way to measure "things" and post the result in different configurations. This way you may build up an idea on how USB 2.0 or USB 3.0 will influence the sound.
I asking because and only maybe the number of digital clicks may be reduced when using USB port 3, maybe other have seen that too?
Best regards.
@ James: Despite the issues I encountered with this board so far I do want to confess that I'm extremely happy that I'm on the "right track". My initial goal was to improve the sound quality on BluWave and make it 'better' than WaveIO (SPDIF output). Perhaps some of you will disagree and I do respect all your preferences and opinions but for me it's a rather big step forward.
Yes, I still have to dig into BluWave's problems and solve them but for now I am happy! And you James, along with other BluWave owners, contribute to that!
Thank you very much!
As for that clicking issue I'm thinking to consult Mr. Ross @ XMOS and Mr. Udo @ Thesycon to seek for their knowledge and experience. Perhaps I'm not looking in "the right place".
Kind regards,
L
Yes, I still have to dig into BluWave's problems and solve them but for now I am happy! And you James, along with other BluWave owners, contribute to that!
Thank you very much!
As for that clicking issue I'm thinking to consult Mr. Ross @ XMOS and Mr. Udo @ Thesycon to seek for their knowledge and experience. Perhaps I'm not looking in "the right place".
Kind regards,
L
@ TirNaOg:
Do you like to replace oscillators with U.FL.s on a board made by me or is something different?
L
I did this on a couple of WaveIOs. The lack of proper footprint made my job a bit harder but it worked after all! You'll nee to be careful though, when you'll remove the coax cable from U.FL.s connectors soldered like this to avoid mechanical damage. But it can be done!
Do you like to replace oscillators with U.FL.s on a board made by me or is something different?
L
Thanks Lorien
It would be on other boards and possibly the WaveIO a bit later on. Is it just a matter of replacing the Oscillator with the UFL connectors (for external master clock input) or is there more to it ie additional caps etc?
The main problem I see is soldering your U.FL on those pads without making shotcircuits. Adding caps and other parts to this job is another task. Perhaps you have to add one 49.9R termination resistor in parallel with your U.FL. connector in case the external clock source must be 50R terminated. I don't want to bring sad news but this job is not so easy to implement! The main concern is to solder your U.FL.s in such a way to avoid damaging your PCB when removing the coaxial cable from top of of your U.FL.s! If you gonna try then please do on a board you can afford to damage it!
The main problem I see is soldering your U.FL on those pads without making shotcircuits. Adding caps and other parts to this job is another task. Perhaps you have to add one 49.9R termination resistor in parallel with your U.FL. connector in case the external clock source must be 50R terminated. I don't want to bring sad news but this job is not so easy to implement! The main concern is to solder your U.FL.s in such a way to avoid damaging your PCB when removing the coaxial cable from top of of your U.FL.s! If you gonna try then please do on a board you can afford to damage it!
Thanks Lorien, understand this is a delicate job, but technically it’s just a matter of replacing the clock with the UFL.
I have started to experiment with the way I use the digital system here - you know the old saying about 'learn by doing', yes? [No 'clicking' so far, but give me time ...!]
Well, it also comes with the penalty about making 'stuff ups' but I've found a local guy here that is teaching me some basics about the MPD/DNLA program in the SOtM sms-200 server that apparently produces a better sound than the Squeezelight one but isn't so friendly to use - I have found this true, especially the 'cranky' nature of the MPD!
One problem that the more sensible guys don't do is to change songs in mid stream for another one using a different SR, particularly if stepping up from 44k to 192k - the BlueWave has a bit of a habit of locking up on the 44k and you get a quite distorted signal as a result
- this is the BlueWave board fitted on my Line Magnetic LM-502 dac that uses the ESS 9016 dac chip (still rather impressed with the simple mods so far - better o/p tubes & rectifier tube, Burson V5 ICs, Obbligato o/p capacitors - resistor upgrades still to come)
Now I'm one 'ham-fisted' amateur digital user here so it's just an occupational/learning problem for me and could very well be just how the jRiver setting are adjusted, or maladjusted in my case.
Interestingly, feeding the BlueWave board directly from the Laptop (via the Curious usb cable) doesn't produce any of these problems and the sound is still rather good - it seems to be something to do with the MPD/DNLA setup - curious really, and a bit frustrating in my ignorance.
Well, it also comes with the penalty about making 'stuff ups' but I've found a local guy here that is teaching me some basics about the MPD/DNLA program in the SOtM sms-200 server that apparently produces a better sound than the Squeezelight one but isn't so friendly to use - I have found this true, especially the 'cranky' nature of the MPD!
One problem that the more sensible guys don't do is to change songs in mid stream for another one using a different SR, particularly if stepping up from 44k to 192k - the BlueWave has a bit of a habit of locking up on the 44k and you get a quite distorted signal as a result
- this is the BlueWave board fitted on my Line Magnetic LM-502 dac that uses the ESS 9016 dac chip (still rather impressed with the simple mods so far - better o/p tubes & rectifier tube, Burson V5 ICs, Obbligato o/p capacitors - resistor upgrades still to come)
Now I'm one 'ham-fisted' amateur digital user here so it's just an occupational/learning problem for me and could very well be just how the jRiver setting are adjusted, or maladjusted in my case.
Interestingly, feeding the BlueWave board directly from the Laptop (via the Curious usb cable) doesn't produce any of these problems and the sound is still rather good - it seems to be something to do with the MPD/DNLA setup - curious really, and a bit frustrating in my ignorance.
I'm still digging into the issue as it proves to be quote a stubborn one !
I passed the design schematic and layout to Ross @ XMOS and he (with other guys from there) looked at them and so far they have nothing bad to comment on this design! This board should work but it seems that is not doing properly. Next, I must do the worst nightmare of any designer like me must do in this case: cutting the design into "pieces" and test one "piece" at a time. Until I have a clear clue of what lead to this clicking issue I'm thinking to postpone selling this board.
Seems that changing isolator doesn't help either since, as I saw so far, the problem may be in the USB communication / close to that stage or in between the ULPI and XMOS processor.
Why ITH I even troubled in designing length-matched traces and put there a lot of decoupling caps + star power and other weirdy stuff ...if it act like this... I don't know !!! WaveIO doesn't have all this fancy stuff and is working properly! Damn!
I'll let you know about my progress...
Kind regards,
L
I passed the design schematic and layout to Ross @ XMOS and he (with other guys from there) looked at them and so far they have nothing bad to comment on this design! This board should work but it seems that is not doing properly. Next, I must do the worst nightmare of any designer like me must do in this case: cutting the design into "pieces" and test one "piece" at a time. Until I have a clear clue of what lead to this clicking issue I'm thinking to postpone selling this board.
Seems that changing isolator doesn't help either since, as I saw so far, the problem may be in the USB communication / close to that stage or in between the ULPI and XMOS processor.
Why ITH I even troubled in designing length-matched traces and put there a lot of decoupling caps + star power and other weirdy stuff ...if it act like this... I don't know !!! WaveIO doesn't have all this fancy stuff and is working properly! Damn!
I'll let you know about my progress...
Kind regards,
L
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Hi LorienI'm still digging into the issue as it proves to be quote a stubborn one !
I passed the design schematic and layout to Ross @ XMOS and he (with other guys from there) looked at them and so far they have nothing bad to comment on this design! This board should work but it seems that is not doing properly. Next, I must do the worst nightmare of any designer like me must do in this case: cutting the design into "pieces" and test one "piece" at a time. Until I have a clear clue of what lead to this clicking issue I'm thinking to postpone selling this board.
Seems that changing isolator doesn't help either since, as I saw so far, the problem may be in the USB communication / close to that stage or in between the ULPI and XMOS processor.
Why ITH I even troubled in designing length-matched traces and put there a lot of decoupling caps + star power and other weirdy stuff ...if it act like this... I don't know !!! WaveIO doesn't have all this fancy stuff and is working properly! Damn!
I'll let you know about my progress...
Kind regards,
L
Keep up the good spirit -you have made a fine board with great sound quality so maybe it just time before you nailed it and solve the issue☺
Thx again
All the best.
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