Drive NOS AD1865/62,PCM1704/02/63,TDA1541 from FIFO: Universal I2S-PCM driver board

[merlin el mago]

If WaveI/O use isolated I2S outputs and remember to supply externally the isolator not sharing WaveI/O psu, you can use Audionote psu.

Felipe

 

[vzs]

8x

Hey Ian,

I successfully tested the I2S-PCM board at 8x speed: 352.8Khz & 384Khz with my AD1865 NOS DAC.

I finally finished soldering and adding the isolator adapter and it worked from the first power up.
Also changed my clocks on the dual clock board to a Crystek CCHD-957 for 45.xx Mhz and a Fox Xpresso for the 49.xx Mhz (as 99% of my FLACs are at 44.1Khz or multiple sample rate); I bought a 45.xx Mhz Fox too... will see how it behaves. It's a pity my other Crystek at 22.5792Mhz ended up in the drawer.

The source I'm using is an Amanero Combo384.

For this proof-of-work I simply upsampled by 2x, 4x, 8x manually some files with SoX and played them with Foobar2000 (+ASIO4ALL) into my test audio gear.
No listening tests yet on my main setup as I'm still sorting out how to stream my music: probably Squeezebox LMS with SoX to upsample by 8x and Squeezelite as client on either my SB Touch or something else....

Will come back with pictures and fairy tales when it is fully integrated

Thanks,
Zsolt

 

[iancanada]

Hey Ian,

I successfully tested the I2S-PCM board at 8x speed: 352.8Khz & 384Khz with my AD1865 NOS DAC.

I finally finished soldering and adding the isolator adapter and it worked from the first power up.
Also changed my clocks on the dual clock board to a Crystek CCHD-957 for 45.xx Mhz and a Fox Xpresso for the 49.xx Mhz (as 99% of my FLACs are at 44.1Khz or multiple sample rate); I bought a 45.xx Mhz Fox too... will see how it behaves. It's a pity my other Crystek at 22.5792Mhz ended up in the drawer.

The source I'm using is an Amanero Combo384.

For this proof-of-work I simply upsampled by 2x, 4x, 8x manually some files with SoX and played them with Foobar2000 (+ASIO4ALL) into my test audio gear.
No listening tests yet on my main setup as I'm still sorting out how to stream my music: probably Squeezebox LMS with SoX to upsample by 8x and Squeezelite as client on either my SB Touch or something else....

Will come back with pictures and fairy tales when it is fully integrated

Thanks,
Zsolt

Hi Zsolt,

Glad to know your good news.

We already confirmed the I2S-PCM board works perfect for AD1865 and TDA1541. Now, I’m trying to test it on PCM1704 by myself. Just hope everything is OK.

Thanks Zsolt for your effort to the project, I’m looking forward to your pictures and your next progress.

Cheers,

Ian

 

[tubesguy]

TOTAL 92

TV Man x 2
merlin el mago
rtd
jameshillj
erin x1 (or 2)
Nikola Krivorov x1
Rupor54
vitalica
analog_sa
andrea_mori x 5
dsavitsk
tagheuer
hirez69 x 2
ccliu x 2
BDL
cddumat
regal x 2
zoran
Jogi
Zen(zenelectro) x 2
Buzzforb
SPWON
crobbins5421 X 2
marcus1 x1 (or 2)
casshan x 2
Dweeb99 X 2
jackw X 2
kazap X 2
danzup x 3
Giordano x2
Tony_T
Tubo x1
clivem x2
noizas x4
JoeyDD x2
skullaudio
dinos8746 x2
dvb-projekt
bisesik x2
guglielmope x1
Valeriano x1
mhgawel x1
av-trouvaille x 1 (or 2)
iloveswan x1
dtses
Flyboi X1
Lil' Knight x1 (or 2)
skippyboy x1
acccruz x1 (or 2)
WhiteBull x1
hksidney x 1
vts2006 x 3
JustBuildLspkAS.x3 &1 fifo kit finished for pcm1704 (ihave AD1862 ,pcm63,pcm1704)
54: PET-240 2 * TDA1541
TonyB
damohpi x1
iloveswan x 1
Joseph K x 2
mefistofelez x2 (pcm63P)
JLOP x1 (WaveIO, AD1865 NOS SRPP)
sceglar x1
4me2ctv x 1
tubesguy x 1

 

[ctrange]

TOTAL 93

TV Man x 2
merlin el mago
rtd
jameshillj
erin x1 (or 2)
Nikola Krivorov x1
Rupor54
vitalica
analog_sa
andrea_mori x 5
dsavitsk
tagheuer
hirez69 x 2
ccliu x 2
BDL
cddumat
regal x 2
zoran
Jogi
Zen(zenelectro) x 2
Buzzforb
SPWON
crobbins5421 X 2
marcus1 x1 (or 2)
casshan x 2
Dweeb99 X 2
jackw X 2
kazap X 2
danzup x 3
Giordano x2
Tony_T
Tubo x1
clivem x2
noizas x4
JoeyDD x2
skullaudio
dinos8746 x2
dvb-projekt
bisesik x2
guglielmope x1
Valeriano x1
mhgawel x1
av-trouvaille x 1 (or 2)
iloveswan x1
dtses
Flyboi X1
Lil' Knight x1 (or 2)
skippyboy x1
acccruz x1 (or 2)
WhiteBull x1
hksidney x 1
vts2006 x 3
JustBuildLspkAS.x3 &1 fifo kit finished for pcm1704 (ihave AD1862 ,pcm63,pcm1704)
54: PET-240 2 * TDA1541
TonyB
damohpi x1
iloveswan x 1
Joseph K x 2
mefistofelez x2 (pcm63P)
JLOP x1 (WaveIO, AD1865 NOS SRPP)
sceglar x1
4me2ctv x 1
tubesguy x 1
ctrange x 1

 

[new2hifi]

...............We already confirmed the I2S-PCM board works perfect for AD1865 and TDA1541. Now, I’m trying to test it on PCM1704 by myself................Ian

Hi Ian:

Sorry, if this question has been answered earlier but is it a fully assembled board or one has to do some SMD soldering (which I have never done)?

Thanks!

 

[iancanada]

Hi Ian:

Sorry, if this question has been answered earlier but is it a fully assembled board or one has to do some SMD soldering (which I have never done)?

Thanks!

The I2S to PCM converting daughter board would be a fully assembled and tested board together with some finished cables.

Don't worry about the SMT soldering.

Ian

 

[spm]

TOTAL 94

TV Man x 2
merlin el mago
rtd
jameshillj
erin x1 (or 2)
Nikola Krivorov x1
Rupor54
vitalica
analog_sa
andrea_mori x 5
dsavitsk
tagheuer
hirez69 x 2
ccliu x 2
BDL
cddumat
regal x 2
zoran
Jogi
Zen(zenelectro) x 2
Buzzforb
SPWON
crobbins5421 X 2
marcus1 x1 (or 2)
casshan x 2
Dweeb99 X 2
jackw X 2
kazap X 2
danzup x 3
Giordano x2
Tony_T
Tubo x1
clivem x2
noizas x4
JoeyDD x2
skullaudio
dinos8746 x2
dvb-projekt
bisesik x2
guglielmope x1
Valeriano x1
mhgawel x1
av-trouvaille x 1 (or 2)
iloveswan x1
dtses
Flyboi X1
Lil' Knight x1 (or 2)
skippyboy x1
acccruz x1 (or 2)
WhiteBull x1
hksidney x 1
vts2006 x 3
JustBuildLspkAS.x3 &1 fifo kit finished for pcm1704 (ihave AD1862 ,pcm63,pcm1704)
54: PET-240 2 * TDA1541
TonyB
damohpi x1
iloveswan x 1
Joseph K x 2
mefistofelez x2 (pcm63P)
JLOP x1 (WaveIO, AD1865 NOS SRPP)
sceglar x1
4me2ctv x 1
tubesguy x 1
ctrange x 1
spm x 1

 

[Joonas]

TOTAL 95

TV Man x 2
merlin el mago
rtd
jameshillj
erin x1 (or 2)
Nikola Krivorov x1
Rupor54
vitalica
analog_sa
andrea_mori x 5
dsavitsk
tagheuer
hirez69 x 2
ccliu x 2
BDL
cddumat
regal x 2
zoran
Jogi
Zen(zenelectro) x 2
Buzzforb
SPWON
crobbins5421 X 2
marcus1 x1 (or 2)
casshan x 2
Dweeb99 X 2
jackw X 2
kazap X 2
danzup x 3
Giordano x2
Tony_T
Tubo x1
clivem x2
noizas x4
JoeyDD x2
skullaudio
dinos8746 x2
dvb-projekt
bisesik x2
guglielmope x1
Valeriano x1
mhgawel x1
av-trouvaille x 1 (or 2)
iloveswan x1
dtses
Flyboi X1
Lil' Knight x1 (or 2)
skippyboy x1
acccruz x1 (or 2)
WhiteBull x1
hksidney x 1
vts2006 x 3
JustBuildLspkAS.x3 &1 fifo kit finished for pcm1704 (ihave AD1862 ,pcm63,pcm1704)
54: PET-240 2 * TDA1541
TonyB
damohpi x1
iloveswan x 1
Joseph K x 2
mefistofelez x2 (pcm63P)
JLOP x1 (WaveIO, AD1865 NOS SRPP)
sceglar x1
4me2ctv x 1
tubesguy x 1
ctrange x 1
spm x 1
Joonas x1

 

[iancanada]

PCM1704 Confirmed works perfectly with the PCM daughter board from 44.1 to 192 KHz

I don’t have a PCM1704 DCA to test the PCM daughter board. A friend of mine sent his own BB PCM 1704 fixture to me. Thank you so much. It seems working perfect.

PCM1704 DAC connections:
LLLR to WCLK
CLK to BCLK
DL to DATAL
DR to DATAR

I2S to PCM daughter board configurations:
J24BIT short (24bit format),
JTAIL either short or open
All of other jumpers keep open

Test conditions:
Fs: 44.1KHz, 48KHz, 88.2KHz, 96KHz, 176.4KHz, 192KHz,
MCLK: 22.579, 24.576, 45.158, 49.152 MHz,
Without and with FIFO.
(The daughter board tested working bit perfect up to 384 KHz, but I don’t have a 384 KHz music source to confirm.)

It works very well on all conditions. 192 KHz sounds much better than 44.1 KHz, over all, the daughter board sounds better than the original front end (DIR and digital filter at left half of the BB fixture), impressive. PCM1704 normally works with DF1704 digital filter running at 8x Fs, so, to play 44.1/48 KHz music, software based up-sampling plug-in is highly suggested, otherwise, you need to have very good NOS LPFs.

Some comment:
1, Continuous clock mode (JCONT) is also functional, but is not recommended. Stop clock mode theoretically comes with less noise.
2, JTAIL was specially designed for PCM1704/02. But the actual testing result shows PCM1704 works perfect either with JTAIL short or with it open. So now, JTAIL becomes an optional function, can be decided according to personal preference.
3, To get better signal quality, u.fl coaxial cables are highly recommended for the connections between DAC and the daughter board.
4, PCM1704 was powered at +-5V, the datasheet says the min Vih is 2V. I don’t think there is any problem tolerance with PCM daughter board outputs which are 3.3V LVTTL logic level. Actual test also approved it.
5, If using a FIFO KIT in system,　I am highly suggested place a isolator board between FIFO and clock board.

Now, we already confirmed the daughter board working perfect with AD1865, PCM1704 and TDA1541. Please let me know if you think it’s OK to release.

I already ordered the final version (V2.0) prototype PCB. I will test it very soon. GB board will be based on this version.

Ian

 

[casshan]

Glad to see good news from Ian!

I hope the GB can start ASAP

Ian, could you start another GB for FIFO kit at same time?

 

[Loboone]

TOTAL 95

TV Man x 2
merlin el mago
rtd
jameshillj
erin x1 (or 2)
Nikola Krivorov x1
Rupor54
vitalica
analog_sa
andrea_mori x 5
dsavitsk
tagheuer
hirez69 x 2
ccliu x 2
BDL
cddumat
regal x 2
zoran
Jogi
Zen(zenelectro) x 2
Buzzforb
SPWON
crobbins5421 X 2
marcus1 x1 (or 2)
casshan x 2
Dweeb99 X 2
jackw X 2
kazap X 2
danzup x 3
Giordano x2
Tony_T
Tubo x1
clivem x2
noizas x4
JoeyDD x2
skullaudio
dinos8746 x2
dvb-projekt
bisesik x2
guglielmope x1
Valeriano x1
mhgawel x1
av-trouvaille x 1 (or 2)
iloveswan x1
dtses
Flyboi X1
Lil' Knight x1 (or 2)
skippyboy x1
acccruz x1 (or 2)
WhiteBull x1
hksidney x 1
vts2006 x 3
JustBuildLspkAS.x3 &1 fifo kit finished for pcm1704 (ihave AD1862 ,pcm63,pcm1704)
54: PET-240 2 * TDA1541
TonyB
damohpi x1
iloveswan x 1
Joseph K x 2
mefistofelez x2 (pcm63P)
JLOP x1 (WaveIO, AD1865 NOS SRPP)
sceglar x1
4me2ctv x 1
tubesguy x 1
ctrange x 1
spm x 1
Joonas x1

Loboone x 1

 

[merlin el mago]

@Ian, how many mA is your PSU for the PCM1704? mine is 100mA for two PCM1704 & only reaches 96KHz maybe 100mA isn't enough.

 

[guglielmope]

Hello Jan,
can you include on the I2S to PCM board some extra PCB bare boards that can be used to connect the dac chip?I think about a board with only the dac chip, the filtering caps, and U.FL connectors or a multiple pin connector to the I2S-PCM board.
I think it'd be interesting because we are building old dacs in a new way, not old dacs with old pcb's and old ideas.
Ciao
Guglielmo

 

[iancanada]

Hello Jan,
can you include on the I2S to PCM board some extra PCB bare boards that can be used to connect the dac chip?I think about a board with only the dac chip, the filtering caps, and U.FL connectors or a multiple pin connector to the I2S-PCM board.
I think it'd be interesting because we are building old dacs in a new way, not old dacs with old pcb's and old ideas.
Ciao
Guglielmo

Hi Guglielmo,

Thank you for interesting. There are only 4 signals need to be connected to a DAC, it should be very easy. But I'm sorry, I didn't get what extra PCB you need for your DAC.

Regards,

Ian

 

[Tonyb]

5, If using a FIFO KIT in system,　I am highly suggested place a isolator board between FIFO and clock board.

Now, we already confirmed the daughter board working perfect with AD1865, PCM1704 and TDA1541. Please let me know if you think it’s OK to release.

I already ordered the final version (V2.0) prototype PCB. I will test it very soon. GB board will be based on this version.

Ian

Ian,

For lower noise, would not it be better to have 1704 board on FIFO side,
before isolators?

TonyB

 

[vzs]

Ian,

For lower noise, would not it be better to have 1704 board on FIFO side,
before isolators?

TonyB

Let me try to answer in Ian's place... what you want to isolate from noisy ground is mainly your clock board and what follows (e.g. I2S-PCM and your DAC).

Since the FIFO itself might have some ground noise from its FPGA you want to isolate that too, so option #1 is to insert the isolator between FIFO and Clock board.

If you are not comfortable isolating FIFO from Clock board (but why not?) there is option #2 to use the isolator before the FIFO, thus isolating the I2S source only.

Option #3 is the most orthodox of all: use two isolators, one before FIFO and one after, so basically option #1 + #2

 

[Tonyb]

Let me try to answer in Ian's place... what you want to isolate from noisy ground is mainly your clock board and what follows (e.g. I2S-PCM and your DAC).

I2S-PCM (1704) also has FPGA, a noise generator. That is why I would not have it on the DAC side. I would place it on FIFO side, before isolators and oscillators/DAC.

From what I could see, Ian placed the 1704 board on the DAC side, after isolators.

 

[vzs]

I2S-PCM board uses a simple CPLD not an FPGA and is carefully designed as far as grounding, powering and trace impedances are concerned. I would be happy to say the same about most of the available DAC kits.

All isolators add a fairly large amount of jitter. In Ian's design-stack simply adding an isolator between DAC and I2S-PCM would deceive the whole role of the FIFO which is eliminating jitter.

In order to do what you are suggesting: isolating the I2S-PCM board from the DAC and not shooting yourself in foot with a jittery isolator you would also have to move the clocks and a reclocking stage on the DAC side. Of course these clocks will have to be routed back to the dual-clock board through an isolator. In _my opinion_ this is theoretically possible -even with the current isolator board- but I have high doubts whether you gain anything from it.

 

[Tonyb]

The clocks would have to be on the DAC side after the isolators.