DSP Xover project (part 2)

Hi again! Now I'm trying to run Najda Under Control, but the board isn't recognized by my computer running win xp. When I connect the board, windows is asking for drivers etc and when I press Connect in Najda Under Control there's a message saying "Error while attempting to connect. Pleasee make sure Najda board is connected to your computer and powered on, then try again." Maybe win xp isn't supported? Or are there some drivers that is needed?
 
There is multichannel I2S input capability on Expansion Port 1 with one restriction: all channels must come from the same external device because they all share the same clocks (frame sync and bit clock).

Currently there's no plan for adding multichannel input support in the software. We can discuss this here.

So potentially I could run multi-channel PCM from a DVD player, over the I2S, giving a surround sound preamp.

Saying that, the existing coax/optical inputs will accept a multi-channel signal?
 
So potentially I could run multi-channel PCM from a DVD player, over the I2S, giving a surround sound preamp.

Saying that, the existing coax/optical inputs will accept a multi-channel signal?

Without a (software) input mixer I don't see how the multichannel I2S inputs could be of any use. A single bclk/lclk for all the inputs is fine.
Is there anything we should do to have Najda consider adding this feature?
As a minimum, input mapping could be specified using a simple text config file, no need to implement a sophisticated GUI if programming resources are limited
 
Hi,

while I am waiting for my Najda board to arrive I look at some PSUs

How about
1.) ASTEC DPT52
http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/132/dpt50_ds_1204757471-27209.pdf
External PSU, no switching frequency specified, minmum load 0.1A for +12V

2.) ASTEC NLP65-7608J
http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/132/nlp65_ds_1216436331-8473.pdf
Open Frame, 100Khz Switching Freq., requires minumum load to start up, foootnote 6

3.) ASTEC LPT 42
http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/132/lpt40series_ds_1184686732_ds-35130.pdf
Open Frame, 110KHz Switching Freq., requires minimum load 0.2A for +12V

If possible I would rather use an external PSU. Any opinion if 1) is OK?
I guess the minumum load is requires to not fall out of the specified range.
Nick: Any opinion if Najda would be sensitive to (hopefully only a bit) overvoltage?

Uwe

Hi Uwe,

External PSU is fine, no problem at all.
I think you're right about the minimum load: the power supplies are probably out of specs if the minimum load condition is not satisfied.
Overvoltage on the 5V line is dangerous if you exceed 5.5V. Indeed, the 5V supply powers all digital chips (micro, SPDIF transmitter, glue logic) and most of these chips won't like anything above 5.5V.
Overvoltage on +/- 12V lines is less critical because most of the current drawn here goes through regulators.

Hi again! Now I'm trying to run Najda Under Control, but the board isn't recognized by my computer running win xp. When I connect the board, windows is asking for drivers etc and when I press Connect in Najda Under Control there's a message saying "Error while attempting to connect. Pleasee make sure Najda board is connected to your computer and powered on, then try again." Maybe win xp isn't supported? Or are there some drivers that is needed?

WinXP is supported.
Can you please check the following:
- When you plug the USB cable to Najda and your computer, the 2 SMD leds near the USB receptacle on Najda should briefly light on. That's USB device enumeration. Can you see that?
- Can you check the Device Manager in Windows and see if you find the USB FTDI chip listed there? Please check also the driver status.

Without a (software) input mixer I don't see how the multichannel I2S inputs could be of any use. A single bclk/lclk for all the inputs is fine.
Is there anything we should do to have Najda consider adding this feature?
As a minimum, input mapping could be specified using a simple text config file, no need to implement a sophisticated GUI if programming resources are limited


So potentially I could run multi-channel PCM from a DVD player, over the I2S, giving a surround sound preamp.

Saying that, the existing coax/optical inputs will accept a multi-channel signal?

Potentially we could have multichannel input over I2S. However, this requires that we decide priory what we want to do with it, because Najda is fundamentally a stereo device.

Multichannel over SPDIF is not possible. This would require a Dolby and/or DTS decoder and that's out of the scope for Najda.

The ability to make pairs similar to the spdif outputs (as well) looks like a plan ?

I'm not sure I understand this one. Can you please give a detailed example?

Best,

Nick
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dahlberg
The ability to make pairs similar to the spdif outputs (as well) looks like a plan ?

I'm not sure I understand this one. Can you please give a detailed example?

Best,

Nick

When disscusing the ability to do settings in pairs you said that the obvious
pairs would be 1-5. 2-6, 3-7, 4-8 to get an equal load on both cores.
I belive that it would be nice to have the possibility to make stereopairs
that's the same as the spdif outputs as well. I do have three excellent
dac's so I will be using them. In a three way setup using the spif outputs
you will always get an uneven load anyway. As it seems now I will be using
channel 1-2 for basspanels (h/p, l/p + dipole-eq+delay) channel 5-6 for
tapped horn subs ( l/p) and channel 7-8 for the ribbons (h/p + delay).
All crossovers 4/ord LR.

Edit: No delay for the subs. I have'nt tried it yet so I might change the use
of channels.
 
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No that's not possible. I will be using the built in digital volumecontrol of the dacs
(BuffaloIIIse). They have different buffers/analog outputs, but are identical in all
other aspects. The gainstructure will be rougly tuned using the I/V resistor in the
"Broskie unballancer" buffers. I'm using TP's "IVY III" buffer for the subchannels.
I can control the volume of all three with one 10k-pot and I saw no
reason to exclude the volumechip from the "Najda" it may come in handy some day.
 
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Potentially we could have multichannel input over I2S. However, this requires that we decide priory what we want to do with it, because Najda is fundamentally a stereo device.

When you say a priori, a guess you mean hardwired? If that is the case, I have 4 I2S streams, 7+1 channels coming from a Dolby decoder. I'd like to use two Nadja boards, 2 I2S channels each. Each input audio channel should be mapped to two outputs - as my speakers are two ways.
In theory it should be pretty easy. Is there a way to do it in Najda / can you maybe provide a fixed in/out mapping for this application?
 
No that's not possible. I will be using the built in digital volumecontrol of the dacs
(BuffaloIIIse). They have different buffers/analog outputs, but are identical in all
other aspects. The gainstructure will be rougly tuned using the I/V resistor in the
"Broskie unballancer" buffers. I'm using TP's "IVY III" buffer for the subchannels.
I can control the volume of all three with one 10k-pot and I saw no
reason to exclude the volumechip from the "Najda" it may come in handy some day.

Hmm,so maybe the built in buffert in the volume control vill degree the sound,didn´t think of that..
 
Originally Posted by Alterfalter
Hi,

while I am waiting for my Najda board to arrive I look at some PSUs

How about
1.) ASTEC DPT52
Mouser Electronics - Electronic Components Distributor
External PSU, no switching frequency specified, minmum load 0.1A for +12V

2.) ASTEC NLP65-7608J
Mouser Electronics - Electronic Components Distributor
Open Frame, 100Khz Switching Freq., requires minumum load to start up, foootnote 6

3.) ASTEC LPT 42
Mouser Electronics - Electronic Components Distributor
Open Frame, 110KHz Switching Freq., requires minimum load 0.2A for +12V

If possible I would rather use an external PSU. Any opinion if 1) is OK?
I guess the minumum load is requires to not fall out of the specified range.
Nick: Any opinion if Najda would be sensitive to (hopefully only a bit) overvoltage?

Uwe
Hi Uwe,

External PSU is fine, no problem at all.
I think you're right about the minimum load: the power supplies are probably out of specs if the minimum load condition is not satisfied.
Overvoltage on the 5V line is dangerous if you exceed 5.5V. Indeed, the 5V supply powers all digital chips (micro, SPDIF transmitter, glue logic) and most of these chips won't like anything above 5.5V.
Overvoltage on +/- 12V lines is less critical because most of the current drawn here goes through regulators.

Hi Nick,

thanks for the fast reply. I ordered the Astec DPT52 (external PSU). I will check all voltages with and without load before I connect to Najda.

BTW especially for European builders: All mentioned PSUs are available from German ebay for less than 15 EUR (new, not used).

Uwe
 
When disscusing the ability to do settings in pairs you said that the obvious
pairs would be 1-5. 2-6, 3-7, 4-8 to get an equal load on both cores.
I belive that it would be nice to have the possibility to make stereopairs
that's the same as the spdif outputs as well. I do have three excellent
dac's so I will be using them. In a three way setup using the spif outputs
you will always get an uneven load anyway. As it seems now I will be using
channel 1-2 for basspanels (h/p, l/p + dipole-eq+delay) channel 5-6 for
tapped horn subs ( l/p) and channel 7-8 for the ribbons (h/p + delay).
All crossovers 4/ord LR.

Edit: No delay for the subs. I have'nt tried it yet so I might change the use
of channels.

Now I see, you were talking about linking. I was confused with all the pairs (linking, spdif, DSP load) we have mentioned recently. ;) The linking is still under discussion, and the option I like the most so far is the one Jean-Claude (jcga) has suggested, which would allow setting pairs freely. The only problem now is where to locate the pairing control on the interface...

When you say a priori, a guess you mean hardwired? If that is the case, I have 4 I2S streams, 7+1 channels coming from a Dolby decoder. I'd like to use two Nadja boards, 2 I2S channels each. Each input audio channel should be mapped to two outputs - as my speakers are two ways.
In theory it should be pretty easy. Is there a way to do it in Najda / can you maybe provide a fixed in/out mapping for this application?

I understand. Let's keep this in mind and see if more people come with similar needs. However, taking 2 Najdas for a single multichannel setup is not ideal because you can't daisy-chain 2 units, at least for now.

I ordered the Astec DPT52 (external PSU). I will check all voltages with and without load before I connect to Najda.

BTW especially for European builders: All mentioned PSUs are available from German ebay for less than 15 EUR (new, not used).

That's great Uwe, thanks. Please let us know how it goes.
 
Originally Posted by dahlberg
No that's not possible. I will be using the built in digital volumecontrol of the dacs
(BuffaloIIIse). They have different buffers/analog outputs, but are identical in all
other aspects. The gainstructure will be rougly tuned using the I/V resistor in the
"Broskie unballancer" buffers. I'm using TP's "IVY III" buffer for the subchannels.
I can control the volume of all three with one 10k-pot and I saw no
reason to exclude the volumechip from the "Najda" it may come in handy some day.

Hmm,so maybe the built in buffert in the volume control vill degree the sound,didn´t think of that..

It seems that I have developed a silicon allergi in my old days ;) Actually
there can be many god things done with op-amps and I have heard some I
even liked a lot over the years but I can't help it, I just like the tubes :) .

These op's? I really don't know, I haven't started it yet :eek: The users that has
commented on SQ seems to be satisfied and maybe I'm just doing overkill here.
On the other hand, I'm aiming for fantastic and overkill seems to be working so.........:cool:
 
Now I see, you were talking about linking. I was confused with all the pairs (linking, spdif, DSP load) we have mentioned recently. The linking is still under discussion, and the option I like the most so far is the one Jean-Claude (jcga) has suggested, which would allow setting pairs freely. The only problem now is where to locate the pairing control on the interface...

Thanks :)
 
I understand. Let's keep this in mind and see if more people come with similar needs. However, taking 2 Najdas for a single multichannel setup is not ideal because you can't daisy-chain 2 units, at least for now.
.

Thanks. I don't see the need to daisy-chain 2 units. I can semply feed BCLK, LRCLK + serial data of two I2S channels to one unit, and BCLK,LRCLK+ serial data of the other two I2S channels to the other unit, can't I?
 
It seems that I have developed a silicon allergi in my old days ;) Actually
there can be many god things done with op-amps and I have heard some I
even liked a lot over the years but I can't help it, I just like the tubes :) .

These op's? I really don't know, I haven't started it yet :eek: The users that has
commented on SQ seems to be satisfied and maybe I'm just doing overkill here.
On the other hand, I'm aiming for fantastic and overkill seems to be working so.........:cool:

Unfortunately building a DSP operating in the 100s of MHz might be a bit to much with tubes despite the facts that second generation computers used said tubes (first used relays and other mechanical devices) :)