So to plug into a PMD100 we need a 256fs or 384fs clock (per the datasheet), is it as simple as replacing the 512fs clock that comes with the single clock board with a 11289.6mhz clock in order to use the PMD100, if not why the move to 512fs for the single clock (rbcd version) ?
Actually qusp I concur, just not sure if the FIFO will take the 5V logic the 1543 uses. Hence saying ask Ian. Also agree it can't be all things to all people, but best we find out if it can without a smoke test. Would love to try with my terribledac. Which strangely is pretty good. Go figure!
Such are the joys eh!
Ian can you throw some light here please?
Thankyou linesman, Thankyou ballboys!
Drew.
Such are the joys eh!
Ian can you throw some light here please?
Thankyou linesman, Thankyou ballboys!
Drew.
If you read Ians post carefully, he writes that 512fs is a jumper selectable additional option. You can stick with 256fs. I do not see a problem...
Hi
MCLK does not go through the 74HC so this is one of the reasons why I'm wondering if it will work. I was thinking the MCLK would either be a problem or simply the fifo would not make much difference.
For example, the output of a WM8805 will not work into SRC4192/WM8741 y2 DAC if mclk is connected; only data, bclk, lrclk is necessary. Gnd is already shared through the psu.
I was also thinking that 16 ICs would create issues.
I can't see much point in putting it before the 74HC because I think this would negate much of the benefit.
I hadn't even thought of the logic levels.
Should I even try ?
Thanks for the help,
Tom
Thanks but it looks like the PMD100 has the same 5VTLL requirements, needs 2.4V high min and 0.5 low min for logic input. Looks to be the same issue as the TDA1543
This is where the fun sets in, have a geezer at the 1543 datasheet, see if you can use normal 3.3v logic, if 2.4v is the high minimum, it should be ok, the other though is check the current dac, the 74hc should have a 5v supply. See if it will run with a 3.3v supply. If the dac does and sounds the same on its current config, then the FIFO will be ok I reckon. If not, ask Ian whether the FIFO supports 5v logic out. Going by everything else The Man has done, it wouldn't shock me he has it covered. If not perhaps the FIFO output clock can also run the flip flop for the 5v change?
It "may" be as simple as a reg to the output. That "may" is speculation not fact.
And Tom, you have a pm.
Night night,
Drew.
It "may" be as simple as a reg to the output. That "may" is speculation not fact.
And Tom, you have a pm.
Night night,
Drew.
not sure about the dac side as i'm not really familiar with these old hands, but no, the fifo itself does not and will not support 5v, however Ian is working on this for the level shifting daughterboard, but thats a ways off
any reason why we are covering this ground all over again? (not directed at you specifically)
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No one should lose money doing this work...
Hi Ian,
I don't agree that you should lose money in your effort that will be shared by all that are involved with your group buy. For my part, I cheerfully support any shared increase in the cost of what we buy that will help you recover your costs.
Gary
Hi Ian,
I don't agree that you should lose money in your effort that will be shared by all that are involved with your group buy. For my part, I cheerfully support any shared increase in the cost of what we buy that will help you recover your costs.
Gary
Me, I thought it was pretty obvious he was losing money, even forgetting his time, once I saw the PCB set. PCB's of that quality, with full flying probe checking, impedance controlled layout etc etc dont come cheap; even without parts in small runs will be up to and over $50 each. is it that people still think SMD = cheaper? its complete fallacy. top shelf tight tolerance SMD is NOT cheap. this part of why ive been objecting to all this feature creep. the only problem with that is making sure there is no money being lost means Ian disclosing the cost.
tricky situation.....
also if Ian is happy and obviously getting more out if than money and that not obviously being the motivator, how do we question that? but where does it end? thats what I mean.
for this I was called greedy/selfish....
tricky situation.....
also if Ian is happy and obviously getting more out if than money and that not obviously being the motivator, how do we question that? but where does it end? thats what I mean.
for this I was called greedy/selfish....
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qusp,
Believe me if Ian makes a board that plugs into a stereo pair of PCM1704 allows NOS and 352.8 with fifo crystal level jitter he will have a gold mine, there is little money in integrating these budget S-D chips because there are several other options out there (not quite as good as Ian's but damn close.) No one is calling you selfish you are a valuable member here, but look at the big picture. Do you see people spending 5 figures + on commercial Sabre's? Since the PCM1704 has become short supply with high end DAC makers dropping them, the prices of used totl commercial 1704 dac's have skyrocketed. Have you ever listened to a properly built PCM1704 (I mean no DF1704, top notch power supplies, top notch analog stage)?
The reason we are bringing up the 5V TLL is this second version is supposed to plug into the most popular digital filter ever (PMD100), if the level is an issue better to know now than before customers find out.
I also support increasing the price of the gb boards if needed, this from the start has potential to change the way we think about DIY DAC's.
Priority is simple and not as complex as you think:
1. stereo PCM1704 up to 8xfs
2. TDA1541 RBCD (check done complete)
3. ESS9018 (check done complete)
4. PMD100/SM5842 RBCD (close needs tested)
5. PCM56/AD1865/AD1862 RBCD
That pretty much covers all the high end DAC's made (I put the ESS on there for your impaired hearing
Left off the TDA1543 as this from development was a budget chip, people have done creative things to overcome this but probably will always have to do so. This doesn't have to be a ******* match of my DAC vs yours, just 5 simple priorities that will change the way we DIYers build D/AC's forever.
Believe me if Ian makes a board that plugs into a stereo pair of PCM1704 allows NOS and 352.8 with fifo crystal level jitter he will have a gold mine, there is little money in integrating these budget S-D chips because there are several other options out there (not quite as good as Ian's but damn close.) No one is calling you selfish you are a valuable member here, but look at the big picture. Do you see people spending 5 figures + on commercial Sabre's? Since the PCM1704 has become short supply with high end DAC makers dropping them, the prices of used totl commercial 1704 dac's have skyrocketed. Have you ever listened to a properly built PCM1704 (I mean no DF1704, top notch power supplies, top notch analog stage)?
The reason we are bringing up the 5V TLL is this second version is supposed to plug into the most popular digital filter ever (PMD100), if the level is an issue better to know now than before customers find out.
I also support increasing the price of the gb boards if needed, this from the start has potential to change the way we think about DIY DAC's.
Priority is simple and not as complex as you think:
1. stereo PCM1704 up to 8xfs
2. TDA1541 RBCD (check done complete)
3. ESS9018 (check done complete)
4. PMD100/SM5842 RBCD (close needs tested)
5. PCM56/AD1865/AD1862 RBCD
That pretty much covers all the high end DAC's made (I put the ESS on there for your impaired hearing
Left off the TDA1543 as this from development was a budget chip, people have done creative things to overcome this but probably will always have to do so. This doesn't have to be a ******* match of my DAC vs yours, just 5 simple priorities that will change the way we DIYers build D/AC's forever.
Regal, $30 dac chip is budget is it? how does the ability of a chip and a company's marketing spiel to part a fool with his money count as a metric for good sound for a DIYER? you just hilighted that you still despite the fact you should know better; still equate a pricetag with quality, this fact does not make you or them elite in my eyes. yes i've heard Ernos 1704 and thought it was quite good, but I dont give a stuff about what those people will pay for.
you are still glossing over the fact that you were pushing for functionality that would require a respin of the fifo board, forget the adapter it hadnt been brought up and this after Ian had already said he was making negative money. sorry there is nothing you can say after that. no speaches with snide little childish digs at a dac chip, nothing. how old are you? 5?
would you like me to copy the email, so you can still claim you dont want a ******* match?
you are still glossing over the fact that you were pushing for functionality that would require a respin of the fifo board, forget the adapter it hadnt been brought up and this after Ian had already said he was making negative money. sorry there is nothing you can say after that. no speaches with snide little childish digs at a dac chip, nothing. how old are you? 5?
would you like me to copy the email, so you can still claim you dont want a ******* match?
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Well, it is really sad if you are loosing instead of making money from that GB
That device would add a four figure number to the price of a DAC from any well respected manufacturer that advertises in magazines and we would be able to read at least two pages of marketing BS how this is impossible to be made by others...
Ian, we are very thankful for what you offered at such a great price, not to mention that you are still trying to make it better and make everybody happy. Hadn't seen that attitude in a while...
1704 is still in production as is the 9018 and there are people like me that have both, so I feel kind of happy that I don't have to choose
Thanks guys for those kind words.
Nobody could make money for a SMT production of 25 with reasonable selling price, me too. It's the only problem. That's why I have to order 50 for the GB II. I believe I will get balance from GB II and make money after that. Trust me
. Regards,
Hi KlipshKid,
Sorry for the late reply. FIFO output works for your 1543, it's I2S with 5V logic tolerance. The only problem is you have 16 of them in parallel.I don't think 74HC125 is a good choice for the low jitter application. My suggestion is using dedicated low jitter clock fanout buffers rather than HC125, at least for the word clock and bit clock. You may find some candidates with more than 4 outputs from digikey or mouser. Good luck to your project.
Hi Ian,
Thanks for the reply. My first idea was to use an octal buffer like 74ac541 or 74F244 after the fifo - because the tda are in 8 pairs, each pair would get a driver. But I figured this would also negate some of the benefits of the fifo ?
Then ppl mentioned the logic level problem and I realised there were going to be too many reasons why it wasn't going to work well and I don't have the skills, knowledge or equipment to find and fix the problems.
So I think I'll still wait and see if someone better than me can do it first. However, I am still very interested so I'm just gonna lurk....
Thanks again,
Tom
Thanks for the reply. My first idea was to use an octal buffer like 74ac541 or 74F244 after the fifo - because the tda are in 8 pairs, each pair would get a driver. But I figured this would also negate some of the benefits of the fifo ?
Then ppl mentioned the logic level problem and I realised there were going to be too many reasons why it wasn't going to work well and I don't have the skills, knowledge or equipment to find and fix the problems.
So I think I'll still wait and see if someone better than me can do it first. However, I am still very interested so I'm just gonna lurk....
Thanks again,
Tom
4 dacs at least if we wanna really state of the art. Otherwise i know a couple commercial/kits that fir the bill niceky (i own one of them).
