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Old 16th May 2010, 08:41 AM   #1
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Default Classic Philips CDPs with newer DAC and SRC ICs

Posted this query in another forum but not much response there so I'm posting it here (apologies in advance for members subscribing to both forums). Anyway ...

Some potential for experiment...Here's what I have to work with:

-- Several classic (older: late 1980s) Philips/Magnavox CDPs that use the SAA7210 or 7310 decoders are sitting on my shelf.
-- Several newer SRC ICs (AD1896, CS8421, etc.) and DAC ICs (PCM1792, 1794, 1796, 1798, and CS4398).

Anyone have decent luck incorporating these newer ICs into those old Philips CDPs? By "decent luck" I mean: (a) no issues with getting the old decoders (SAA7210 and 7310) to work with newer SRCs/DACs and, (b)after the fuss of installation, you're getting better SQ than orig. SAA7220/TDA1541 combo?

(Also have several eBay-or used/private-mkt purchased but still-in-storage good DACs/DFs: DF1706, PMD100, AD1862, PCM63, PCM1704. But I'm saving these for a rainy day!).

Thx!
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Old 16th May 2010, 11:36 AM   #2
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I've had great success with an older Magnavox CD2000 and the Chinese DAC with the CS8421 and 4398. The Magnavox is a NOS player with SA7210, the I2S is 5v, so I had to attenuate the signal down to 3.5v with simple voltage dividers. It outperforms everything else I own. I also use output trafos with it.

I tried a CD502 but screwed that up trying to change it to NOS, it has a Motorola 50423 in it. Something happened and it went haywire, haven't figured it out yet.

It's pretty hard to beat those CDM4s if used with good clocks.

It would be great for someone to come up with a board that just has the 8421 and 4398 or other combo without the unnecessary crap.

Best, Bill
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Old 16th May 2010, 03:55 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fuss View Post
I've had great success with an older Magnavox CD2000 and the Chinese DAC with the CS8421 and 4398. The Magnavox is a NOS player with SA7210, the I2S is 5v, so I had to attenuate the signal down to 3.5v with simple voltage dividers. It outperforms everything else I own. I also use output trafos with it.

I tried a CD502 but screwed that up trying to change it to NOS, it has a Motorola 50423 in it. Something happened and it went haywire, haven't figured it out yet.

It's pretty hard to beat those CDM4s if used with good clocks.

It would be great for someone to come up with a board that just has the 8421 and 4398 or other combo without the unnecessary crap.
I have a Mag CD2000! A stange, NOS unit from a time when oversamplers were taking over the CDP market (a good trend if you ask me). I changed its native 1543 to a 1545A (sigh ... had to create a I2S to EIAJ ckt so the 1545 would work). But, unlike some other models, the CDB2000 is really easy to tear into and the PCB is cake to work on. Good to know you got the Cirrus ICs to work. Which "Chinese DAC" was it?

For your CD502, is the Motorola 50423 the decoder chip?
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Old 16th May 2010, 04:27 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hollowman View Post
I have a Mag CD2000! A stange, NOS unit from a time when oversamplers were taking over the CDP market (a good trend if you ask me). I changed its native 1543 to a 1545A (sigh ... had to create a I2S to EIAJ ckt so the 1545 would work). But, unlike some other models, the CDB2000 is really easy to tear into and the PCB is cake to work on. Good to know you got the Cirrus ICs to work. Which "Chinese DAC" was it?

For your CD502, is the Motorola 50423 the decoder chip?
Yeah, the 50423 pretty much does it all. It supplies I2S either NOS, 2X, or 4X, and has a SPDIF output also. The CD502 has a strange construction, the board is upside down and suspended right under the cover. Also, the entire transport is mounted in the drawer mechanism, kinda cool.

I'm using what they call the Big Dac on Ebay. They use daughter boards for the chips so you can pull the reciever chip and plug I2S right into the empty socket. I'm working on physically cutting the board down, just keeping what I need. They are around $90 and are good quality, but they are pretty fragile for modding. The 8421 can only handle around 3.7v so the signals from the 7210 have to be attenuated.
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Old 16th May 2010, 05:56 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fuss View Post
Yeah, the 50423 pretty much does it all. It supplies I2S either NOS, 2X, or 4X, and has a SPDIF output also. The CD502 has a strange construction, the board is upside down and suspended right under the cover. Also, the entire transport is mounted in the drawer mechanism, kinda cool.
A Motorola decoder chip is a direct substitute for the SAA7210. I have a Magnavox CDP or two (from late 1980s) that have Motorola decoder ICs when the Service Manual for these units indicates there should be a Philips SAA7210. (Dunno -- maybe Magnavox used Motorola sometimes while Philips versions use genuine Philips ICs all the time?? Pure guess, of course! My Mag CD2000 uses a Philips 7210 while other Mags., e.g. a CDB650 I have, use a Motorola 7210-substitute decoder).
Quote:
I'm using what they call the Big Dac on Ebay. They use daughter boards for the chips so you can pull the reciever chip and plug I2S right into the empty socket. I'm working on physically cutting the board down, just keeping what I need. They are around $90 and are good quality, but they are pretty fragile for modding. The 8421 can only handle around 3.7v so the signals from the 7210 have to be attenuated.
I found a "24bit/192Hz DAC DA CONVERTER W/ USB Kit" for ~$65USD from Hong Kong. Same kit I think. That's not a bad deal I must admit.
Thx for the warning about the lower voltage (others are also telling be about lower-than-5V requirements for certain situations, so I'm grateful to you all and am glad I posed this query!)

Last edited by hollowman; 16th May 2010 at 06:26 PM.
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Old 16th May 2010, 07:47 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hollowman View Post
A Motorola decoder chip is a direct substitute for the SAA7210. I have a Magnavox CDP or two (from late 1980s) that have Motorola decoder ICs when the Service Manual for these units indicates there should be a Philips SAA7210. (Dunno -- maybe Magnavox used Motorola sometimes while Philips versions use genuine Philips ICs all the time?? Pure guess, of course! My Mag CD2000 uses a Philips 7210 while other Mags., e.g. a CDB650 I have, use a Motorola 7210-substitute decoder).
I found a "24bit/192Hz DAC DA CONVERTER W/ USB Kit" for ~$65USD from Hong Kong. Same kit I think. That's not a bad deal I must admit.
Thx for the warning about the lower voltage (others are also telling be about lower-than-5V requirements for certain situations, so I'm grateful to you all and am glad I posed this query!)
If you want the upsampling option with the 8421 I believe it is around $90.
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