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Old 21st January 2010, 04:30 AM   #2471
Pano is offline Pano  United States
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Yes they do! And I've never been sure why. Maybe a "just in case".

When I started use low gain systems, I started liking the sound better. At least it was cleaner.
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Old 21st January 2010, 05:31 AM   #2472
AR2 is offline AR2  United States
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Quote:
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I might as well throw in my 2*bits. Yep, the first effort to make is getting the gain structure correct. Most systems have way too much gain which compromises every thing else.
That is actually the main idea behind Nelson's F amps. Why provide so much gain if it is not used. If preamp provides as much gain and amp even more, that that, in many cases, is already way too much.
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Old 21st January 2010, 06:38 AM   #2473
CLS is offline CLS  Taiwan
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Maybe it's because the dumb (inefficient) speakers people are using. So the power requirement keeps growing, and inevitably the voltage gain must be larger to get that output.

In my system, there're only 2 (tube) gain stages from DAC chip to speaker (for the range above 200Hz or so). Like pano just mentioned, it's very clean (along with superb details and intimacy). High sensitivity of the speakers helps a lot here.
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Old 21st January 2010, 08:01 AM   #2474
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My first speakers - tweet ribbons use to be 100 dB and PHL mids 101 dB. Going straight from DACs to Lundahls... oh, soooo gooood. 2A3 tubes for mids, small Aleph 30 Class A on ribbons.... What else to say, a dream comes through... What is nice with this minimalistic set up I was able to hear every nuance, transparency to cry for.
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Old 21st January 2010, 12:02 PM   #2475
pidigi is offline pidigi  Italy
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Looks good -
seems to have even a knob for gain adjustment at the upper side ...

Michael
Thanks Michael!

I've heard that arta and rmaa are the most useful programs availabe around. Is there any other interesting program you can suggest??

Ciao!

Paolo
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Old 21st January 2010, 02:51 PM   #2476
Pano is offline Pano  United States
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HOLMImpulse. Read about it on this forum. It's not just for speakers.
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Old 21st January 2010, 02:58 PM   #2477
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Yes they do! And I've never been sure why. Maybe a "just in case".

When I started use low gain systems, I started liking the sound better. At least it was cleaner.
As a small data point, all 4 amps that get switched in and out of my system have gains of ~17dB as apposed to the quasi standard of 26dB or more. The local feedback tube amps, the 47, and the Tabor were happiest in that range, the gain of the SS Tabor was reduced to match the tube amps to make swapping easier. The Crown Comtech 800 used for subs has input controls that I set to match the other amps.

In short, you should be able to peg the volume control to max on normally recorded material and not clip or just clip the amps.
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Old 21st January 2010, 03:01 PM   #2478
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Thanks Michael!

I've heard that arta and rmaa are the most useful programs availabe around. Is there any other interesting program you can suggest??

Ciao!

Paolo
Another good program is AudioTester. It can be a bit testy to get working right but the performance is great and the price is nice!
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Old 21st January 2010, 03:13 PM   #2479
mige0 is offline mige0  Austria
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besides the ones already mentioned - especially for acoustical measurement and speaker design have a look into SoundEasy too - biggest drawback though is that you can't get a demo version.

I haven't come across a measuring problem not to solve with either AudioTester or the ARTA / STEPS / LIMP package

Michael
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Old 21st January 2010, 03:50 PM   #2480
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These programs are excellent for PC machines. As for relatively new kid on the block, measurement systems for MAC OSX, I would gladly recommend Faberacoustical - Electroacoustics Toolbox. Very good app. I am a Mac user, that started using PC just because of audio measurement, and finally there is a good measurement app for Macs as well. They have even apps for iPhone. Very stable app with calibration for input and output...
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