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Old 12th January 2013, 11:28 PM   #651
acko is offline acko  Australia
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Default 9016 DAC Combo

Quote:
Originally Posted by TNT View Post
Will this happen? Balanced?


/
This is in the works. Has both Bal and SE on board (can be bypassed for external ones) I need to complete the left channel and then we are pretty much ready.
Possibly as board only with chip loaded...
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Last edited by acko; 12th January 2013 at 11:31 PM.
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Old 13th January 2013, 04:45 PM   #652
acko is offline acko  Australia
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Default AKD9016 Combo

Just to give some idea of the price:
Board as shown earlier with only the DAC chip loaded ~ USD 75
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Old 13th January 2013, 05:06 PM   #653
TNT is offline TNT  Sweden
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Nice! Please, teflon. Why not a 9012 on it instead ?

Is it that big difference on the DAC chips / tefon?


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Old 13th January 2013, 05:31 PM   #654
qusp is offline qusp  Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TNT View Post
Nice! Please, teflon. Why not a 9012 on it instead ?

Is it that big difference on the DAC chips / tefon?


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teflon in small orders and even in large numbers is massively different in price and yes 9012/18 add considerable extra complexity in layout, power supply etc. Even if he could, honestly why would he undercut his own premium products? that would be stupid, Acko does not appear stupid to you does he?

the price is good, Acko is not playing tricks here as some others do to make you believe its better value than it is, once you add everything up with parts, as these demand nice parts, nice power supplies, you watch it all add up.

Also I presume the MCU is not included
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Old 13th January 2013, 05:42 PM   #655
TNT is offline TNT  Sweden
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I knew You would come to his defense - I had the timer on Honestly, Ackos 9012/18 board has a few years on their neck now - maybe it's time to "upgrade". And maybe You should let the intended receiver answer these kind of questions - or are You their marketing department?

I'm considering my options and I will continue to try to form them in the way I would like them until saturated - then I will make up my mind about a purchase.

And no, I don't consider Acko stupid - actually, it never crossed my mind.

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Old 13th January 2013, 05:46 PM   #656
qusp is offline qusp  Australia
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well OK no problem, but honestly why would you think he could possibly make a teflon board with a $50 retail dac chip for $75

what is he going to upgrade? an upgrade is going to cost more. its a dac chip on high quality board with high quality decoupling caps. afaik and in my experience buying such exact parts, they still have no equal

sure he could make a dual mono or something, but expect a price hike. the parts all still cost the same as they did back then. just because some budget dacs have been released.

I react particularly to this type of question, because I bought my board with just the dac chip soldered, I bought the parts, I know what they cost.

Last edited by qusp; 13th January 2013 at 05:50 PM.
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Old 13th January 2013, 05:56 PM   #657
TNT is offline TNT  Sweden
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OK!

FTR: I never said that the cost had to be the same.

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Old 13th January 2013, 06:14 PM   #658
qusp is offline qusp  Australia
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yeah but its still the same thing, if he put a 9012 dac chip, on a board that will power it (hell one that will fit it, the 9016 is LQFP48, the 9018/2 is LQFP64) and a teflon board, that would be a dac he already has listed on his site... so I guess his answer to your question would be to link you to the AKD18P product page =)

besides dual mono just puts more stress on the IV stage with double the current (16ma is already too much for many discrete parts), i'm running dual dacs for 4 way, but not for dual mono, ive tried it and theres no benefit to my ears. (if I can manage it I may try to switch between them for headphone 2 channel use, but its not high on the agenda, I wouldnt buy it to do it put it that way)

the 9018/2 are already set up with their pin layout to be dual mono, they have separate power supply, reference, logic for Left and right channels as it is, so with good layout, like here, its already dual mono. IMO dual dacs for ES9018/2 is more the marketing department, or obsessive DIYers.

and good luck building an analogue stage that can get you more than the -120db THD+N, so even though ive spent some pretty crazy money on these dacs including copper foil vcap teflon caps, Zfoil power resistors etc etc, I dont consider it really worth it to build dual mono.

also, I paid more for the first generation FR4 version of the ackodac than you pay now for a fully stuffed Teflon board and paid more again for the teflon version as it cost more to build than it would to get pick and place. Tom and I bought the first ones off the rank, 2 for me, 2 for Tom and 1 or 2 for Acko, cant remember, it was us crazy enough to ask for the first teflon boards and w.fl connectors. so no veiled accusations please. I like the product and Ive come to like the man, plus hes an Aussie (wheres that Aussie Flag?!)

Last edited by qusp; 13th January 2013 at 06:19 PM.
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Old 14th January 2013, 05:24 AM   #659
acko is offline acko  Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qusp View Post
teflon in small orders and even in large numbers is massively different in price and yes 9012/18 add considerable extra complexity in layout, power supply etc. Even if he could, honestly why would he undercut his own premium products? that would be stupid, Acko does not appear stupid to you does he?

the price is good, Acko is not playing tricks here as some others do to make you believe its better value than it is, once you add everything up with parts, as these demand nice parts, nice power supplies, you watch it all add up.

Also I presume the MCU is not included
Totally my fault for the confusion. Board previewed is FR4 for the price indicated. Fab guys usually do not stock Teflon and I have to take the whole big panel even for sample quantity and they are pricey! For new products Teflon will be optional only from now on but I will press for better deals closer to release.
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Old 14th January 2013, 05:44 AM   #660
acko is offline acko  Australia
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Default AKD16-combo

Also, the bare board preview and price is no sales gimmick. It was actually feedback from those who bought the basic AKD16 which they can select their choice of components to load and customize. Of course right tools and skills required and there is going to be a lot of work mounting the tiny parts. Qusp has done this with the bare 9012 AKD12 board and I believe he has done better than my stock boards with some unique components. I will indicate price for a typical complete build later so you can have some idea before jumping in.
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