The equipment rack in my basement with Modified Oppo DVD player, DAC, Behringer DEQ2496 DSP equalizer in the processor loop, and a Sangean HD radio at the bottom. Not shown are the Popcorn Hour networked media player and plasma TV that comprise the four SPDIF inputs.
Attachments
Russ White said:
Nice work!
Did you use the Wolfson SPDIF receiver to MUX?
Did you use a 40mhz clock?
Cheers!
Russ
No, I am using CS8416. I didn't use Wolfson because of the 176K problem.
The DAC clock is 80 MHz Crystek. You can't really see it very well in the pics because it is surrounded by tall caps.
Russ White said:
I'm using OPA1632D. four of them.
The symmetrical balanced filter stage I ended up with is flat at 10KHz and down to -0.5dB at 20K.
The -3db point is 175KHz.
-27dB at 1.25MHz which is MCLK/64...
Simulated, not measured.
The caps used for the filter are WIMA and they are the orange ones you can see in post 1017
I'm listening to the DAC in six bit mode now. I have burned a PIC to use nine bit mode and I listened to that for a while.
I'm driving the wife crazy because I play the same songs over and over when I do the tweaks and the listening tests...
Of course, I have to play it loud to hear all the dynamic range
Answers to some questions sent by email about the Prototype DAC pictured above.
First question. No, I didn't use J*cko H*mo's SPDIF input circuit for the coax inputs.
I did use the general philosophy that calls for the isolation of the received signal with transformer, then terminate and convert to logic level before coupling to the CS8416 with a cap.
Next question. No, I didn't provide for a DSD input to my DAC. In the setup pictured above, post 1024, the DVD player converts DSD to PCM. Adding a DSD input to the board would require another mux chip in front of the Sabre8. Also, I am not aware of a standard cable and connector for DSD.
Another question. It took me about 10 hours to hand solder the parts to the circuit board... Soldering the TSSOPs and LQFP is difficult and takes a lot of practice. So, it would not be practical to sell a bare board. I am looking into getting a professional assembly contractor to solder up a batch. This will be expensive.
First question. No, I didn't use J*cko H*mo's SPDIF input circuit for the coax inputs.
I did use the general philosophy that calls for the isolation of the received signal with transformer, then terminate and convert to logic level before coupling to the CS8416 with a cap.
Next question. No, I didn't provide for a DSD input to my DAC. In the setup pictured above, post 1024, the DVD player converts DSD to PCM. Adding a DSD input to the board would require another mux chip in front of the Sabre8. Also, I am not aware of a standard cable and connector for DSD.
Another question. It took me about 10 hours to hand solder the parts to the circuit board... Soldering the TSSOPs and LQFP is difficult and takes a lot of practice. So, it would not be practical to sell a bare board. I am looking into getting a professional assembly contractor to solder up a batch. This will be expensive.
Hi all,
I believe that, at least in the pro audio industry, the DSD standard connector would be a 75Ohm BNC...
I've read the whole thread and it seems to me that the focus of it is primarily audiophile/hi-end consumer use. While I have nothing against it, I would like someone to elaborate on already being implemented or potential pro-audio and mastering use of the Sabre chip.
My main questions that the thread doesn't cover (or dismisses quickly) are:
1) Is anyone here using a single Sabre chip in its 8-channel mode? Aside from being slightly inferior to its stereo mode when it comes to DNR\THD figures, what are your real listening notes and observations in comparison to the parallel stereo mode? Is stereo image the same? Bass/air fidelity?
2) What would be the best scenario of implementing a Word Clock circuit? Someone has briefly mentioned (Neo2k?) that in general sense anything that is not internal and not as physically close as possible to the chip would produce significantly inferior results. Is there a way to utilize Sabre's internal DPLL to interface with WC directly? What would be a setup to minimize the chip's performance loss in this regard? I'm not an electronic engineer, so I'm just thinking out loud.
3) Has anyone compared either Buffalo or Sabre eval board to pro-audio DACs from the main key players in the industry? Specifically:
- Lavry Gold/Blue/DA10
- Prism DA2 or ADA series (or even Orpheus)
- Weiss DAC1/2
- Cranesong HEDD
- UA2192
rossl: great build! If you don't mind sharing some pricing details, how much was it to build the rack (metalwork+coating)? How many units (just metalwork) did you do? This is my greatest stumbling block so far - to find someone to outsource metalwork to without parting with my car or living on beans for a year =)
Thanks to all for such a great pool of information!
I believe that, at least in the pro audio industry, the DSD standard connector would be a 75Ohm BNC...
I've read the whole thread and it seems to me that the focus of it is primarily audiophile/hi-end consumer use. While I have nothing against it, I would like someone to elaborate on already being implemented or potential pro-audio and mastering use of the Sabre chip.
My main questions that the thread doesn't cover (or dismisses quickly) are:
1) Is anyone here using a single Sabre chip in its 8-channel mode? Aside from being slightly inferior to its stereo mode when it comes to DNR\THD figures, what are your real listening notes and observations in comparison to the parallel stereo mode? Is stereo image the same? Bass/air fidelity?
2) What would be the best scenario of implementing a Word Clock circuit? Someone has briefly mentioned (Neo2k?) that in general sense anything that is not internal and not as physically close as possible to the chip would produce significantly inferior results. Is there a way to utilize Sabre's internal DPLL to interface with WC directly? What would be a setup to minimize the chip's performance loss in this regard? I'm not an electronic engineer, so I'm just thinking out loud.
3) Has anyone compared either Buffalo or Sabre eval board to pro-audio DACs from the main key players in the industry? Specifically:
- Lavry Gold/Blue/DA10
- Prism DA2 or ADA series (or even Orpheus)
- Weiss DAC1/2
- Cranesong HEDD
- UA2192
rossl: great build! If you don't mind sharing some pricing details, how much was it to build the rack (metalwork+coating)? How many units (just metalwork) did you do? This is my greatest stumbling block so far - to find someone to outsource metalwork to without parting with my car or living on beans for a year =)
Thanks to all for such a great pool of information!
Re: Denon DVD-1920 DSD MOD
Hello Russ,
I am in the middle of turning my DVD-1930ci into a top loader and was looking at the DSD connection you have. Should the wire be soldered at the vias or on the other side of the resistor or will it have no effect?
Russ White said:OK for those of you who don't mind risking a Denon DVD-1920 and want to get DSD out of it...
Here is how I am doing it:
There are three vias at DBK,DSD1,DSD2. Solder a tiny wire into each via.
I am not sure how I will run these to the panel, but for now just to test the DAC I just used allegator clip jumpers to wires which are installed in the DAC.
It actually sounds very good despite the makeshift wiring! It is definitely much better than the stock DAC, but that would not actually take much.
The DVD-1920 is much easier to modify than the DVD2910, so I would go that route personally.
Cheers!
Russ
Here is a picture of the wires soldered into the whiskers.
Hello Russ,
I am in the middle of turning my DVD-1930ci into a top loader and was looking at the DSD connection you have. Should the wire be soldered at the vias or on the other side of the resistor or will it have no effect?
promixe said:
Hi promixe
Get used to eating beans
Well, here is the bad news. I ordered just one chassis unit. It was expensive.
I spent a good amount of time designing it also.
As it was, I paid a lot for just the one chassis and tooling. For the price of just that... I could have gone and bought a decent used DAC.
But then... I already have two decent used DACs in my closet. I need to clean out the closet and sell some stuff. And, I wanted to make MY own DAC.
I didn't want to put in a big order of chassis units because I wanted to make sure everything fit, connectors screw in, and everything looked OK.
As it worked out, everything fit OK but I don't care for the paint color or the silkscreen.
In order to make it cost effective, an order at least 5 or 10 would make the cost of the tooling amortize out and bring down the per-unit price. Even then it will still be way more expensive than cheap china imported junk.
Changing the paint color on a new order costs nothing, but a new silkscreen is another tooling charge.
rossl said:Overall, the Sabre8 as I have it right now sounds better than the Anagram DAC. It is a very detailed sound and is neutral. The problem with op-amp IV converters and op-amp output stages is that the op-amps have a sound of their own. Transformers have a sound too, but the effects sound very neutral to my ears. The THD distortions do not sound "digital".
Neutral is good.
Didnt you remove the op-amps???
My Camelot DAC with the Anagram module is now being stored in the parts cabinet. I thought it was great a few years ago, but now technology has passed it by.
Which Camelot DAC do you have?
This one?
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_9_1/ces-2002-report-day-4.html
Also, which revision of the anagram module was in it? My guess would be the mk4, as used in the excellent Audiomeca Enkianthus DAC that i had the pleasure to listen.
If that's the case the Sabre is looking really great.
HDCD
Regarding HDCD I recommend ripping these disks to a harddisk (HD). Use the FLAC format (Free Lossless Audio Codec). But make sure you rip with DBPowerAmp with the HDCD DSP functionality. This decodes the HDCD disks to 24/44.1 format to the HD. What is needed is then a PC connected to some DAC capable of 24/44.1, or some other playback device (Logitech etc). I use a HTPC running Media Monkey for playback. HDCD capable DACs are more and more scarce, so this is a good solution.
RK
Regarding HDCD I recommend ripping these disks to a harddisk (HD). Use the FLAC format (Free Lossless Audio Codec). But make sure you rip with DBPowerAmp with the HDCD DSP functionality. This decodes the HDCD disks to 24/44.1 format to the HD. What is needed is then a PC connected to some DAC capable of 24/44.1, or some other playback device (Logitech etc). I use a HTPC running Media Monkey for playback. HDCD capable DACs are more and more scarce, so this is a good solution.
RK