ESS Sabre Reference DAC (8-channel) - Page 210 - diyAudio
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Old 6th February 2013, 01:36 AM   #2091
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I'm going to keep experimenting (there are only 3 appropriate frequencies anyway) but I'm still interested in selling this DAC. The DAC sounds really good, as good as anything I've heard - great dynamics and imagery etc - but I have another DAC that sounds very similar ( a 384Khz DAC ). I don't need both, so, because ESS have decided to isolate themselves from their customers, the ESS is the one I'll sell.

The SAW is interesting. For some bits of music, it sounds quite aggressive - an explosion of detail and raw energy. The bass shakes the sofa, whereas, with the Crystek, I hear the bass as much as feel it. For other songs, it is simply revealing and accurate - true fidelity you might say. Piano is especially good with the SAW and I've always felt that getting a piano to sound right is one of the hallmarks of a good system.

The SAW also centres vocals very well, and pushes them forward a little, when sometimes the Crystek is a little more confused and flatter. It's a very small difference though.

So SAW is better ? Hmmm... different, and just as good in its own way, and better at some things, not others. Not a simple black/white answer for me.

What do you think about the 125 saw ? I guess you have compared it to other 125 clocks ?

So I think some will like it, and some will not, and many people who are invested in things like Ian's FIFO probably need not bother, unless they simply want to experience this for themselves.

cheers
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Old 6th February 2013, 06:29 AM   #2092
Coris is offline Coris  Norway
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Yes, I could compare too, two oscillators at 125Mhz. I have the same positive conclusion about 125Mhz SAW type. I had not enough time to go very deep in comparing the details, but an overall (end quite obviously for me) conclusion is that SAW it sounds better.
I`m just curious if we may hear from somebody else (who will want to try/use this oscillator type) some (honest...) negative conclusions about it...
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Old 6th February 2013, 06:56 AM   #2093
roender is offline roender  Romania
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Hi guys,

For those of you who doesn't saw this presentation yet, here you'll find an explanation why ESS do not wanna make public many of the HyperStream modulator details.
RMAF 11: Noise Shaping Sigma Delta Based Dacs, Martin Mallison, CTO, ESS Technology - YouTube


Kind regards,
Mihai
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Old 6th February 2013, 07:14 AM   #2094
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And that explains why they don't take emails ? It's total bs that they won't give out simple stuff - clock freq vs performance.

I'm quite surprised some ppl here don't seem to understand the difference between marketing terms like "hyperstream" and simple DAC performance data. If the data is good, then the marketing can be reduced because the data sells itself. But have we got lots of great data or lots of great marketing ? Hmmm...

Quote:
Originally Posted by roender View Post
Hi guys,

For those of you who doesn't saw this presentation yet, here you'll find an explanation why ESS do not wanna make public many of the HyperStream modulator details.
RMAF 11: Noise Shaping Sigma Delta Based Dacs, Martin Mallison, CTO, ESS Technology - YouTube


Kind regards,
Mihai
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Old 6th February 2013, 07:26 AM   #2095
roender is offline roender  Romania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KlipschKid View Post
And that explains why they don't take emails ? It's total bs that they won't give out simple stuff - clock freq vs performance.

I'm quite surprised some ppl here don't seem to understand the difference between marketing terms like "hyperstream" and simple DAC performance data. If the data is good, then the marketing can be reduced because the data sells itself. But have we got lots of great data or lots of great marketing ? Hmmm...
You are right about missing datasheets which by the way, you could get it by kindly email Bryan at "bryan at shawelectronics dot com" and ask for, and their reluctance to respond to e-mail but that doesn't mean the product is crap. In fact, is one of the best DAC ever created.
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Old 6th February 2013, 07:33 AM   #2096
qusp is offline qusp  Australia
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and heres me thinking 'MAX Clock Speed 100MHz' was a hint at the performance above 100MHz...

ive never seen such a 'simple' graph of speed vs performance in ANY DAC datasheet

write to Ti as a single hobbyist and ask them to do a special test for you and see how you go.... ESS deal primarily with corporate clients and normally someone 'designing' with their parts is expected to have equipment to measure performance....

you are a single hobbyist, who has bought a single dac chip via a third party, theyve already done testing that told them 100MHz was as fast as you should go if you want to meet spec. They have no need to document it in detail, particularly when it does not even present a theoretical performance gain. the cost of doing such testing would far outweigh any benefit you present to them and if you were a larger customer, they would simply advise you against it.

yes they could be more responsive, but have you seen how popular their chips are? what do you offer them? the DIY community is a drop in the ocean.

Last edited by qusp; 6th February 2013 at 07:44 AM.
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Old 6th February 2013, 07:35 AM   #2097
roender is offline roender  Romania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KlipschKid View Post
If the data is good, then the marketing can be reduced because the data sells itself. But have we got lots of great data or lots of great marketing ? Hmmm...
Actually, the DAC sells itself without much marketing. Every top audiophile company have a DAC or player based on ESS top Sabre chip.
Please take one hour from your free time and watch the presentation.
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Old 6th February 2013, 07:54 AM   #2098
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Great IC. Awful company. IMO. Dac 4 sale. Enough said ?
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Old 6th February 2013, 09:34 AM   #2099
Bunpei is offline Bunpei  Japan
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Hi, KlipschKid & Coris,

May I ask one thing to both of you?
Under which register setting conditions are you experimenting your clock devices?

Bunpei
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Old 6th February 2013, 09:43 AM   #2100
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Hi Bunpei,

Mine is in default because I haven't built a controller yet. Actually, I might not bother.

Which settings will improve sound quality ? How much difference can they make ?

Thanks,

Tom
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