I've read so many veneer threads my head is spinning. I need to veneer some speakers and I've never done it before.
I read one thread and iron on is simply the best and easiest, I read another thread and suddenly contact cement is the be all end all. One thread says veneer saws are by far the best way to cut the stuff and the next thread says don't use a veneer saw, use xx or yy. Then there's several best ways to put glue on, etc.
I've got a set of the Dayton D3s, so they are not all that big, no curves and simple openings, except the port that is flared a fair amount. I'm going with birch and just a clear finish, all sides. I'm thinking of getting the veneer from tapeease and using Titan DX, but I want something that's going to be easy for a first timer with very basic woodworking skills to get an acceptably good end result.
Please help...
Thanks!
I read one thread and iron on is simply the best and easiest, I read another thread and suddenly contact cement is the be all end all. One thread says veneer saws are by far the best way to cut the stuff and the next thread says don't use a veneer saw, use xx or yy. Then there's several best ways to put glue on, etc.
I've got a set of the Dayton D3s, so they are not all that big, no curves and simple openings, except the port that is flared a fair amount. I'm going with birch and just a clear finish, all sides. I'm thinking of getting the veneer from tapeease and using Titan DX, but I want something that's going to be easy for a first timer with very basic woodworking skills to get an acceptably good end result.
Please help...
Thanks!
paper backed or raw veneer?
I've veneered more than a few pairs of speaker boxes over the years, and would strongly advise against any type of CC (solvent or latex based) or the PSA if you're planning on wrapping around more than one face of a finished box . Just as with plastic laminate there's no margin for error for alignment, and it's way too easy to get bubbles or wrinkles.
I personally use paper backed veneer (4x8 or 4x10ft sheet), the iron on method with regular yellow wood glue and a short pile velor paint roller. Paper backed veneer is very easy to work with - cut to rough sizes with scissors, and trim overhang with either sharp utility knife (box -cutter), 2" thick chisel or sanding block (150G) - special tooling not essential
The only downside with paper veneer is the very thin top layer of wood can too easily be sanded through
Raw veneers tend to be much thicker, and do require a bit more time and skill - practice first. Veneer saws aren't particularly expensive
I've veneered more than a few pairs of speaker boxes over the years, and would strongly advise against any type of CC (solvent or latex based) or the PSA if you're planning on wrapping around more than one face of a finished box . Just as with plastic laminate there's no margin for error for alignment, and it's way too easy to get bubbles or wrinkles.
I personally use paper backed veneer (4x8 or 4x10ft sheet), the iron on method with regular yellow wood glue and a short pile velor paint roller. Paper backed veneer is very easy to work with - cut to rough sizes with scissors, and trim overhang with either sharp utility knife (box -cutter), 2" thick chisel or sanding block (150G) - special tooling not essential
The only downside with paper veneer is the very thin top layer of wood can too easily be sanded through
Raw veneers tend to be much thicker, and do require a bit more time and skill - practice first. Veneer saws aren't particularly expensive
paper backed or raw veneer?
I've veneered more than a few pairs of speaker boxes over the years, and would strongly advise against any type of CC (solvent or latex based) or the PSA if you're planning on wrapping around more than one face of a finished box . Just as with plastic laminate there's no margin for error for alignment, and it's way too easy to get bubbles or wrinkles.
I personally use paper backed veneer (4x8 or 4x10ft sheet), the iron on method with regular yellow wood glue and a short pile velor paint roller. Paper backed veneer is very easy to work with - cut to rough sizes with scissors, and trim overhang with either sharp utility knife (box -cutter), 2" thick chisel or sanding block (150G) - special tooling not essential
The only downside with paper veneer is the very thin top layer of wood can too easily be sanded through
Raw veneers tend to be much thicker, and do require a bit more time and skill - practice first. Veneer saws aren't particularly expensive
Exactly what I wanted to know, THANK YOU.
I had no idea that you could iron on regular wood glue like that, none. I was looking at the paper backed and I'd get the 4x8 size so that I have extra to experiment with first.
One more question, do I need to go over the MDF with coarse sandpaper first?
Thanks again for the help.
Well aside from risking a flame war by chiding your use of MDF instead of plywood,
- yes, assuming you're veneering to more than a single face, you'd want to give all joints and surfaces a good sanding ( I use 80G on random orbit sander myself) to avoid telegraphing of uneven joints and glue seams through the relatively thin paper/veneer, and to allow some penetration through the MDF's often lightly tempered surface.2 ply wwod on wood veneer is excellent. Available here, but made by formwood. Two-Ply Wood on Wood Veneer Stock List
you will get very little telegraphing.
I like unibond 800 for veneering. Vacuum Pressing Systems -- Veneer Glue
but yellow glue also works great.
If you are veneering all the way around the box I would cut veneer pieces slightly larger then each side using scissors. Put a piece of veneer face down on a flat work bench, spread your glue on the side of the box being worked on and lay it on the veneer. clamp the box down or just put a bunch of weight on it. Once the glue dries flush the veneer with the edges using a sharp knife and or a sanding block. Move on to another side and repeat until you have wrapped the whole box.
Hope this is helpfull,
Evan
you will get very little telegraphing.
I like unibond 800 for veneering. Vacuum Pressing Systems -- Veneer Glue
but yellow glue also works great.
If you are veneering all the way around the box I would cut veneer pieces slightly larger then each side using scissors. Put a piece of veneer face down on a flat work bench, spread your glue on the side of the box being worked on and lay it on the veneer. clamp the box down or just put a bunch of weight on it. Once the glue dries flush the veneer with the edges using a sharp knife and or a sanding block. Move on to another side and repeat until you have wrapped the whole box.
Hope this is helpfull,
Evan
The 2 ply and cold pressing (or even vacuum bagging) certainly works great, but I tend to rebate drivers and input terminal cups / plates as well as use narrow slot vents, and have found the paper back much easier for that application. I'll use the nose of iron to scorch the outline of edges and cutouts.
And of course a commercial millwork shop will always have a 5 gal bucket of Dural or Titebond yellow kicking around. It doesn't take long for each of us to find a process that works - if I'd actually had any formal trade schoolin, I might have learned the "correct" way .
The unibond does look interesting
And of course a commercial millwork shop will always have a 5 gal bucket of Dural or Titebond yellow kicking around
. It doesn't take long for each of us to find a process that works - if I'd actually had any formal trade schoolin, I might have learned the "correct" way . The unibond does look interesting
Unibond is slow to dry and has no initial tack but fills gaps and dries rock hard.
I would usually veneer first and then cut out for drivers, but if the hole is already there you could just use a flush trim bit to cut the veneer to the opening after veneering over the hole.
And yes my methods are what work for me and are not the only right way.
Evan
I would usually veneer first and then cut out for drivers, but if the hole is already there you could just use a flush trim bit to cut the veneer to the opening after veneering over the hole.
And yes my methods are what work for me and are not the only right way.
Evan
evan - I've used the 2-ply before, and you're right it certainly doesn't telegraph like paper back, but it's the rebates for flush mounting that are shallower than the bearing clearance on a trim bit that have messed me up
and of course being a lazy bugger with access to a CNC machine, I get the driver and terminal holes routed before assembly whenever possible, and post veneer
and of course being a lazy bugger with access to a CNC machine, I get the driver and terminal holes routed before assembly whenever possible, and post veneer
Sbrukow, thanks for making this beginner's thread. I am watching it carefully, as I want to veneer 2 speakers that I just made out of MDF. Enclosure size is 5" Wide x 32" High x 6" Deep with a 3-1/4" round opening for the driver, a 2-3/4" round opening for the binding posts terminal cup, and a front firing rectangular vent.
Before people start suggesting this and that type of venner or wood, be advised that in Puerto Rico everything is available, everything is only a few minutes drive away, but all the wood veneer is extremely expeeeeensiiiiive. I have some leftover raw (not paperbacked) gorgeous veneer that a friend of mine gave me, leftover from a job done refurbishing the inside of a private jet. So, that is what I will use. It is bare, not paper-backed. I have a router, which I will not use, as I am still trying to figure out how to control it. I would adhere using the iron method or the cold press method, and trim using a very sharp utility knife.
I will veneer a scrap piece of mdf to get the feel of it. If Sbrunkow doesn't mind the slight "hijack"...Any recommendations as far as finishing the pieces? Stains, clear oils, varnish, poly, lacquer, etc.? I would like a glossy finish, but would hate to be sanding 5 times. Also, what is the best tool to apply the protective coat (varnish/poly/lacquer)? A foam roller maybe?
Before people start suggesting this and that type of venner or wood, be advised that in Puerto Rico everything is available, everything is only a few minutes drive away, but all the wood veneer is extremely expeeeeensiiiiive. I have some leftover raw (not paperbacked) gorgeous veneer that a friend of mine gave me, leftover from a job done refurbishing the inside of a private jet. So, that is what I will use. It is bare, not paper-backed. I have a router, which I will not use, as I am still trying to figure out how to control it. I would adhere using the iron method or the cold press method, and trim using a very sharp utility knife.
I will veneer a scrap piece of mdf to get the feel of it. If Sbrunkow doesn't mind the slight "hijack"...Any recommendations as far as finishing the pieces? Stains, clear oils, varnish, poly, lacquer, etc.? I would like a glossy finish, but would hate to be sanding 5 times. Also, what is the best tool to apply the protective coat (varnish/poly/lacquer)? A foam roller maybe?
I've had better results using cold press / vacuum bagging than iron-on with the 2-ply, and while the thicker material is easy enough to cut with power tools (saw / router), it's harder with scissors or utility knife, and certainly trickier to trim out around the shallow recessed cutouts that I described earlier.
Guangui - practice particularly on the cross-grain trimming on edges ( I personally use a thick blade 2" wide chisel in a series of short downward rotating strokes when trimming cross grain). The bonus to using solid raw veneer flitches is that they're generally more than thick enough for any small tooling marks from router trim bearings or chisel marks to sand out. On paper backed, the paper is often thicker than the veneer - you find out the hard way how much so.
Re finishing top coats / application techniques - if the surface area is small enough, you can get very decent results with aerosol spray lacquer such as Deft, Mohawk, etc. , or hand rubbed oil etc.
As mentioned above, I'm a lazy bugger, and have access to commercial shop spray booth, so I tend to use a 2-3 coats of pre-catalyzed nitro cellulose lacquer, with a light sanding between each.
I'm not at all a fan of polyurethane finishes on wood - even the best tend to look like plastic laminate.
Guangui - practice particularly on the cross-grain trimming on edges ( I personally use a thick blade 2" wide chisel in a series of short downward rotating strokes when trimming cross grain). The bonus to using solid raw veneer flitches is that they're generally more than thick enough for any small tooling marks from router trim bearings or chisel marks to sand out. On paper backed, the paper is often thicker than the veneer - you find out the hard way how much so.
Re finishing top coats / application techniques - if the surface area is small enough, you can get very decent results with aerosol spray lacquer such as Deft, Mohawk, etc. , or hand rubbed oil etc.
As mentioned above, I'm a lazy bugger, and have access to commercial shop spray booth, so I tend to use a 2-3 coats of pre-catalyzed nitro cellulose lacquer, with a light sanding between each.
I'm not at all a fan of polyurethane finishes on wood - even the best tend to look like plastic laminate.
Last edited:
If I had access to a CNC machine and spray booth, I would use it all the time, that is not being lazy, that is being efficient. I only have access to a Victaulic Grooving Machine, a pipe plasma cutter, a Ridgid Pipe Threading Maching, industrial band saw, hydraulic crimper, steel plate cutter, hose cutter, McElroy HDPE fusion machine, and welding equipment. If I ever need to make a speaker in a steel enclosure it will be no problem.
Here is a picture of the Walnut Veneer I will be using.
Here is a picture of the Walnut Veneer I will be using.
Attachments
Interesting timing talking about finish top coat materials - I'm currently down to the short strokes on a pair of bespoke enclosures on which the client wanted an Watco oil stain and wax or varnish top coat
A local hardwood flooring & railing dealer turned me on to a product I'd not tried before - Saman Oil Based Hybrid Varnish. I had no trouble applying with foam brush, and was pretty happy with the results.
A local hardwood flooring & railing dealer turned me on to a product I'd not tried before - Saman Oil Based Hybrid Varnish. I had no trouble applying with foam brush, and was pretty happy with the results.
yes, sand between coats (usually 2-3 coats) - 180 to 220G with the grain is usually fine- not after the last coat
Wood Veneer Application
If you're new at applying wood veneer, here is a link to lots of tips and info.
Tips and Info: Applying Wood Veneer Sheets | Oakwood Veneer Company
Hope it helps!
If you're new at applying wood veneer, here is a link to lots of tips and info.
Tips and Info: Applying Wood Veneer Sheets | Oakwood Veneer Company
Hope it helps!
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.