Butt joints,wood glue strong enough?

[gareth]

Thanks pski, I had thought of using a biscuit jointer but I didn't think that I could get them to fit properly...the biscuits that is, even though I guess you could make small ones...unless what I am seeing in my head is different to what you are.

As I want the mitred sides/top/bottom to be on show I am warming to CALWeldon's idea of good old Duck Tape with an extra portion of fibreglass. Those cabinets he has turned out look pretty neat from where I am !! I would not have thought of doing it this way especially, as Cal says, the Duck tape on it's own is not strong enough to take any real sort of bonding pressure but this fibreglass tape sounds the biz.

Cal, are all the joints safe and sound from just using these tapes or have I misunderstood ? Surely some clamping would be needed, no.

Gareth

[pski]

Originally Posted by gareth

Thanks pski, I had thought of using a biscuit jointer but I didn't think that I could get them to fit properly...the biscuits that is, even though I guess you could make small ones...unless what I am seeing in my head is different to what you are.

As I want the mitred sides/top/bottom to be on show I am warming to CALWeldon's idea of good old Duck Tape with an extra portion of fibreglass. Those cabinets he has turned out look pretty neat from where I am !! I would not have thought of doing it this way especially, as Cal says, the Duck tape on it's own is not strong enough to take any real sort of bonding pressure but this fibreglass tape sounds the biz.

Cal, are all the joints safe and sound from just using these tapes or have I misunderstood ? Surely some clamping would be needed, no.

Gareth

Gareth,

You don't make biscuits. You buy them. They come in standard sizes: 00, 0, 10, & 20 <smaller to largest>

Check out youtube for videos but the basic idea is that the joiner cuts a slot that matches the size of the biscuit (half of it) and the "fence" of the joiner makes sure that the slots you cut are exactly the same distance from the edge. When you insert the biscuit(s,) the parts line up exactly square and the edges are exactly even.

The "fence" of the joiner adjusts up and down (usually) to fixed locations that are set with notches. So if you want to biscuit a mitre joint, it's just as easy as a butt joint.

The angle of the pieces and the biscuit looks like \-\ (if the slashes were 45%, the biscuit is perpendicular to the angles of the miter, sticking straight into each edge.)

See this: Mitered woodworking joints | Woodworking joints

This not only makes the joint stronger, it MAKES the boards line up at the edges while you clamp them.

P

[Cal Weldon]

Hi Gareth,

Because the tape is applied while the pieces are face down, by the time you turn them over and roll them up, the tape is under a lot of tension creating a tight joint. The tape is the clamp(s). The small wood pieces in the 4th pic are there to hold it at the last joint and to help realign those little whoops'

[gareth]

Originally Posted by pski

Gareth,

You don't make biscuits. You buy them. They come in standard sizes: 00, 0, 10, & 20 <smaller to largest>

Check out youtube for videos but the basic idea is that the joiner cuts a slot that matches the size of the biscuit (half of it) and the "fence" of the joiner makes sure that the slots you cut are exactly the same distance from the edge. When you insert the biscuit(s,) the parts line up exactly square and the edges are exactly even.

The "fence" of the joiner adjusts up and down (usually) to fixed locations that are set with notches. So if you want to biscuit a mitre joint, it's just as easy as a butt joint.

The angle of the pieces and the biscuit looks like \-\ (if the slashes were 45%, the biscuit is perpendicular to the angles of the miter, sticking straight into each edge.)

See this: Mitered woodworking joints | Woodworking joints

This not only makes the joint stronger, it MAKES the boards line up at the edges while you clamp them.

P

Aaaaah, O.K., I thought that these biscuits (kind of elliptical shaped aren't they ?) would have been too big to fit the mitre, I have seen them used in the past to join together pieces of kitchen worktop in the past, some of the chippies use them when doing fitted kitchens (sorry to go off a bit here !). O.K. So in one side of my mitred joint would be the 'receiver holes' for the biscuits and the biscuits themselves in the other half of the joint ? Is that what you are saying ?

Gareth

[Cal Weldon]

The receiving holes are on both sides and the biscuits fit into the slots created by the jointer. When using them on a corner mitre you also need the special clamps.

[gareth]

Cheers Cal, with it now ! I take it that you are a big fan of these biscuits then ?

Gareth

[Cal Weldon]

I don't use them any more. I never did on the mitres, only butt joints but I like the full cleats now.

[pski]

Originally Posted by Cal Weldon

The receiving holes are on both sides and the biscuits fit into the slots created by the jointer. When using them on a corner mitre you also need the special clamps.

No special clamps. Only bar clamps are needed if you have enough to do the full square at one time.. and a flat surface

Of course, "picture frame clamps" x 2 work very well. The issue there is whether they are big enough x and y.

P

[pski]

Originally Posted by gareth

Aaaaah, O.K., I thought that these biscuits (kind of elliptical shaped aren't they ?) would have been too big to fit the mitre, I have seen them used in the past to join together pieces of kitchen worktop in the past, some of the chippies use them when doing fitted kitchens (sorry to go off a bit here !). O.K. So in one side of my mitred joint would be the 'receiver holes' for the biscuits and the biscuits themselves in the other half of the joint ? Is that what you are saying ?

Gareth

Not really, each piece has a slot. Due to the beauty of the design (the dimensions of the slots and biscuits) and the fact the biscuit is made of compressed wood, you have back and forth movement <the "long" way with the slot, but not back and forth> until the glue sets and the water in the glue causes the biscuit to expand, making the joint stronger.

Since the joint cannot go "back and forth," the boards have to line up across the edges if they are clamped correctly.

Look carefully at the link in the other email.

p

[bunkie]

These days my biscuit joiner is mostly gathering dust. For most of what I do, pocket screws done with my Kreg jig work better, are faster and are even reversible.