Toner Transfer Paper Problems

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All paper will disolve or disintegrate in water as long as its not 'sized' or coated - This is exactly what you get with cheap 1 side coated photo or presentation paper (£2 for 20 sheets from local supermarket) - the water can get to the base paper through the non coated side and the paper just falls off
If only it was that simple.
The paper must have a coating to prevent the toner from being absorbed when heated with the iron. If half the toner is absorbed by the paper, then even with disintegrating paper you will only get half the toner stuck to the copper - lots of pinholes and broken traces...
The coating must be able to withstand the heat and pressure of the hot iron, and basically expel the toner onto the PCB when it cools. Hence some papers are better than others, as discussed in this thread.
 
The point I was making is very simple and I did not suggest that some papers are not better than others - a lot of papers talked about on this thread are coated both sides - the coating is there to provide a smooth uniform base that controls ink absorbsion, and as photo paper is designed for injet printers that use water based inks it is therefore relatively waterproof - the point I was making was that if you use cheap single sided coated paper the back of the paper (providing it is not sized to restrict water absorbsion) will soak up water like a sponge and disintegrate, leaving the coating on the board which is easy to removed leaving the toner image firmly stuck to the board - I have never seen any sign of toner migrating though the coating on any paper that I have tried, however much heat I have applied with an iron, and have therefore not suffered pinholes or broken traces because of it.

Regards

Richard
 
Hi.

I'm in UK on business and had hoped to buy a pack of the good paper from Staples.... - apparently the item-numbers are different in staples UK and staples US / Canada (why???)

Can Anyone confirm what the Item-numbers for the good papers are in the UK? I've tried to search the site without finding any that looks right.

Thanks for any help. I'm to tired to think for myself..

TroelsM
 
Bear in mind that Staples do not make paper (either laser or photo paper) - they will buy it in from a paper mill (normally the cheapest)and it is unlikely that paper available in the US/Canada will be from the same source as the UK. Even if the stock number is the same it is unlikely that the product will behave the same - the specification that Staples will have the paper made to will be specific the use they sell it for i.e. laser or injet printing - the qualities that we are looking for to make PCB's is unlikely to be considered or controled
 
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theAnonymous: which sku/item # is the HP presentation paper item 637889 Model Q2546A (HP color Laser Presentation Paper) or item #863054 Model CG988A (HP Laser Presentation Paper Glossy) sorry I couldnt think of a canadian postal code, I can just pick fake numbers from my head at random pretty much for the US ones, but dont have a clue about the cannucks.
 
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I'll pick a cheap one up and give it a try. If it doesn't do the job, I'll return it.

I tried the Staples brand laminator ($100) without success. It simply doesn't get hot enough. I ran the board through 4 times and it still hadn't started to stick.

I think I'll stay with the clothes iron. It really isn't much of a hardship and certainly isn't the most unpleasant aspect of the process - cleaning the board is MUCH worse.
 
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I tried the Staples brand laminator ($100) without success. It simply doesn't get hot enough. I ran the board through 4 times and it still hadn't started to stick.

I think I'll stay with the clothes iron. It really isn't much of a hardship and certainly isn't the most unpleasant aspect of the process - cleaning the board is MUCH worse.

Sorry to hear the laminator didn't work out.

How long did you let it heat up before you ran the board through? I let my GBC laminator heat up for 20-30 minutes. The transfers stick to the boards completely on the first pass.

If you ever feel like giving a laminator another shot, see if you can find a GBC H212 for a reasonable price. You can find them for under $100 down here, but everything in Canada seems to cost twice as much (if you can even find it there at all).

EDIT: Just out of curiosity, what is the power consumption of the Staples laminator? The H212 is 480W.
 
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Disabled Account
Joined 2007
Sorry to hear the laminator didn't work out.
EDIT: Just out of curiosity, what is the power consumption of the Staples laminator? The H212 is 480W.

Not a big deal. I make an average of a board every 2 - 3 days when I'm 'into' this (which I am now) and, like I said above, it isn't much of a hardship to use the iron.

I didn't notice how many watts the unit was and I returned it the same day. The web site doesn't list the specs either, as far as I can see.
I first let it heat up until the 'ready' light went on, then I left it for about 10 minutes more to see if it made a difference.
 
For my printer? HP printer, HP toner.
I think I need a new one soon - seems that maybe the fuser is starting to crap out and that printer has seen a LOT of action.

All those boards are hard on the toner .. aye !! $70 a pop :bawling: I am running out as well. My plan is to buy a refill (not HP original ) for 20$ and just use the new $70 genuine for PCB's. I might even try to refill my existing one myself (messy).

If you get a new printer , use the old one as a DIY PCB laminator. I read that the old laser printer fuser will run independant of the printer mounted on a board running on just standard AC. PS , the OEM laminators are junk , I trashed one with just 2 PCB's.

I did get the laminator to work by increasing it's temp to from 160 to 180C(HP toner melting point). This caused the plastic bearings to deform , which really ticked me off. I looked at my HP printer , it has metal bearings and a spring loaded fuser tension adjust ... would make the perfect laminator since it is set for the HP toner natively and could self adjust to various PCB widths.

OS
 
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Disabled Account
Joined 2007
When I get a new printer, I will look my old one over to see if it is possible to modify it to direct print to the board surface. Maybe a project worth trying, I think.
According to the manual, the printer consumes 380 watts when printing. I'm not sure if that is hotter than the Staples laminator I 'borrowed'.
I read somewhere about doing the transfer in an oven. Sandwich the board and paper between two pieces of thick glass (I think I'd use steel) and squeeze it together with a couple of spring clamps. Heat the oven to 400* and let bake for 20 minutes.
 
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I tried the Staples brand laminator ($100) without success. It simply doesn't get hot enough. I ran the board through 4 times and it still hadn't started to stick.

I think I'll stay with the clothes iron. It really isn't much of a hardship and certainly isn't the most unpleasant aspect of the process - cleaning the board is MUCH worse.

I have a $30 generic laminator from Walmart. It works good with my Samsung printer and magazine paper. I have the original Staples paper, but it doesn't work well with my printer. Your HP results look impressive. I will give them a try.
 
Here's a section of a double sided board I just made. The traces are 15 mil wide. I could easily have used 8. The via pads are 50mil dia. I used a Club Toyata magazine page for the toner transfer. The board was etched with copper chloride, which never needs to be disposed of.

The printer cost $40. The laminator was $30. They already paid for themselves after 2 boards.
 

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