Re: Of course you deserve it ...
It is a 36 pin slug up package. It's the same pacakge as that of the Tripath TA2021B. Does anyone need a layout made for this chip? I already have a footprint created for the package and can probably do better than the layout they provide in the datasheet.FastEddy said:
You need the front end. At a minimum you need non-inverted PWM and inverted PWM drive signals and a 12V supply for this chip to function. You will need to enable the chip too, which is as simple as pulling the enable pin low (it's an active low).-_nando-_ said:
But of course ...
BWRX: " ... It is a 36 pin slug up package. It's the same pacakge as that of the Tripath TA2021B. Does anyone need a layout made for this chip? I already have a footprint created for the package and can probably do better than the layout they provide in the datasheet. ..."
But of course we would like a fresh layout ... (If possible consider extra positions & thru holes for such things as "snubbing" caps on the PS rails, etc.)
That's a lot of work, isn't it?
If not, then layout plus parts list would be nice ... but I would hope that TI's recommendations would be followed. The only thing I am going to do to the design initially is to limit the power so as to hold down the full power THD into 8 ohms to something below ~=0.07% (if possible in reality).
....
-_nando-_ " ... what do I need (part numbers please, then I can check how much they are) to make this a complete amplifier with analog signal input, to be driven by mp3 players etc ..."
Yeah, me too! ... and got a recommendation for a board source? (I'm sure there are plenty of links here for this, but I would like to hear your recommendations.)
My goal is to make a vquality, cost effective, high efficiency Class-D amp. Eventually I want this combined with a low profile, higher efficiency switching supply ... aiming for a light weight, 100W+ / dual channel for use on stage as guitar/PA/monitor amp without embarassment = clean as a whistle. (Pre-Amp might be something like this: http://www.mesaboogie.com/Product_Info/Rectifier_Series/RectoPreAmps/RectoPreAmp.html )
(I may have one of my employees do the soldering 'cause of my tired 60+ year old eyes ...)
BWRX: " ... It is a 36 pin slug up package. It's the same pacakge as that of the Tripath TA2021B. Does anyone need a layout made for this chip? I already have a footprint created for the package and can probably do better than the layout they provide in the datasheet. ..."
But of course we would like a fresh layout ... (If possible consider extra positions & thru holes for such things as "snubbing" caps on the PS rails, etc.)
That's a lot of work, isn't it?
If not, then layout plus parts list would be nice ... but I would hope that TI's recommendations would be followed. The only thing I am going to do to the design initially is to limit the power so as to hold down the full power THD into 8 ohms to something below ~=0.07% (if possible in reality).
....
-_nando-_ " ... what do I need (part numbers please, then I can check how much they are) to make this a complete amplifier with analog signal input, to be driven by mp3 players etc ..."
Yeah, me too! ... and got a recommendation for a board source? (I'm sure there are plenty of links here for this, but I would like to hear your recommendations.)
My goal is to make a vquality, cost effective, high efficiency Class-D amp. Eventually I want this combined with a low profile, higher efficiency switching supply ... aiming for a light weight, 100W+ / dual channel for use on stage as guitar/PA/monitor amp without embarassment = clean as a whistle. (Pre-Amp might be something like this: http://www.mesaboogie.com/Product_Info/Rectifier_Series/RectoPreAmps/RectoPreAmp.html )
(I may have one of my employees do the soldering 'cause of my tired 60+ year old eyes ...)
Re: But of course ...
It is. That's why most people don't do layout work for free
Usually it helps to have a general idea of components specs and ratings so you know what size parts to use and can get a general idea of where to place components. I'll see what I can come up with in my minimal free time since I already have one of the hard parts completed.
FastEddy said:
It is. That's why most people don't do layout work for free
Usually it helps to have a general idea of components specs and ratings so you know what size parts to use and can get a general idea of where to place components. I'll see what I can come up with in my minimal free time since I already have one of the hard parts completed.
limited resources ?
" ... I'll see what I can come up with in my minimal free time since I already have one of the hard parts completed. ..."
Look, don't strain your ketchup here. the TI layout can be used without too much bother ... besides, when the time comes, there may actually be a market for this beast = "Anything worth doing, is woth doing for money ..." - Alfred E.Newman / Mad magazine.
" ... I'll see what I can come up with in my minimal free time since I already have one of the hard parts completed. ..."
Look, don't strain your ketchup here. the TI layout can be used without too much bother ... besides, when the time comes, there may actually be a market for this beast = "Anything worth doing, is woth doing for money ..." - Alfred E.Newman / Mad magazine.
Don't worry, I won't strain myself for something I won't even be building (at this moment anyway). There are some improvements that can be made though. Like I said above, the pin outs for this chip are nice in that they allow for a nice layout.
Some things worth doing, i.e. speaker/amplifier/electronics projects, are worth doing by yourself, for yourself
Some things worth doing, i.e. speaker/amplifier/electronics projects, are worth doing by yourself, for yourself
-_nando-_ said:
Maybe you need something like this:
http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tas5012.html
It is a PurePath(TM) PWM Controller: I2S or DSP input -> PWM output.
Input from 44.1 to 192khz , 16 and 24 bit, automatically selected. There are modules up to 8 channel input.
That's a good one ..
This: http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tas5012.html plus this: http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas5110.pdf plus this: http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas3001.pdf ... = ... a pretty good XM radio amp for your jeep ...
Nothing to be taken from the TI guys, but the PWM amp should be better.
This: http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tas5012.html plus this: http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas5110.pdf plus this: http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas3001.pdf ... = ... a pretty good XM radio amp for your jeep ...
Nothing to be taken from the TI guys, but the PWM amp should be better.
Brian, they sent me five chips, so if you want a couple for experimenting, then drop me a line with your address and I'll get them in the post. What package is the footprint you made in? I have Eagle and Protel, and if someone can point me to a PWM circuit I'm quite willing to do a layout, I just don't have the time to research it myself.
Re: That's a good one ..
Maybe TAS5110 power stage is not so good as TAS5261....
TI has an evaluation board with TAS5518 PWM controller (the 8 ch version of TAS5012) and TAS5261 PWM power stage:
http://www-s.ti.com/sc/psheets/slaa332/slaa332.pdf
The board costs 399$. Is it worth to try?
FastEddy said:This: http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tas5012.html plus this: http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas5110.pdf plus this: http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas3001.pdf ... = ... a pretty good XM radio amp for your jeep ...
Nothing to be taken from the TI guys, but the PWM amp should be better.
Maybe TAS5110 power stage is not so good as TAS5261....
TI has an evaluation board with TAS5518 PWM controller (the 8 ch version of TAS5012) and TAS5261 PWM power stage:
http://www-s.ti.com/sc/psheets/slaa332/slaa332.pdf
The board costs 399$. Is it worth to try?
Re: Re: That's a good one ..
For $399, I would say no. You could get decent modules and parts to make a really nice amplifier for that much.
Al - That would be great! I'll get an email out to you. I made the package (it's custom based on the dimensions from the TA2021B and TAS5261 datasheets) in Eagle and it was originally for the Tripath TA2021B. The TAS5261 just happens to be in the same package, so I rearranged the connections and that was that. I'll post it later today in case anyone else would like to do experimenting with PCB layouts in Eagle.pinkmouse said:
Spec-wise the 5261 looks better than the 5518.thomaseliot said:
For $399, I would say no. You could get decent modules and parts to make a really nice amplifier for that much.
This looks like a nice small, high power solution. Rds(on) is pretty low at only 40 mohms (0.040 ohms). But I also have some doubts. I notice that the THD+N specification is done with an AES-17 filter. That is a brick wall type so pretty heavily filtered above 20kHz (see: http://www.audiotech.com.tw/AES17 Filter.htm for more info). So this makes me a little suspecious of their graphs and how good the THD might actually be. The other thing that confuses me is the noise graph. Why is there a 1kHz signal and why is dBr used? What is the reference? It is not clear to me what this graph shows and then how accurate it is since the reference info is missing. Also notice the floor drops above 21kHz, more filtering? The efficiency graph looks nice but because of the way it is formatting it is hard to read some numbers and no info is given on load. Probably 8 ohm but, as is well know, efficiency will drop with lower impedance loads. The unlicpped output power graph is vauge. What is unclipped, 0.1%? 1%? Not enough graphs which always makes me suspecious also because what is NOT said can be more important than what is said. Notice no info on THD+N at any other frequencies, no graph of THD vs Frequency, so is it really bad at higher or still good? Is something being hidden?
I will have to read the write up and see if there is more info. I don't know why TI is so short on performance graphs. Front page look given the idea it is a great little solution once a PWM is added but hard to tell unless you actually test one yourself. Also no info on graphs on power dissipation, how much can that package handle? I didn't see any thermal information but still have to read the write up. But over all looks very interesting. I might have to try and get some samples and play with it. Would make for a great 300W sub amp. Interesting.
-SL
I will have to read the write up and see if there is more info. I don't know why TI is so short on performance graphs. Front page look given the idea it is a great little solution once a PWM is added but hard to tell unless you actually test one yourself. Also no info on graphs on power dissipation, how much can that package handle? I didn't see any thermal information but still have to read the write up. But over all looks very interesting. I might have to try and get some samples and play with it. Would make for a great 300W sub amp. Interesting.
-SL
The FFT noise spectrum plot is of the output with a -60dBFS 1kHz tone applied to the input. The supply voltage was 50V, the load was 8 ohms, the frequency was 48kHz, and the reference voltage is 31.9Vrms (0dbFS). That means the -60dbFS tone was 0.0319Vrms, which has an amplitude of 0.045V. Does that even make any sense to publish graphs using such low levels? Can somebody please confirm that my math is correct.
Re: Re: Re: That's a good one ..
Hi Brian,
help me to understand. TAS5518 is the digital driver for TAS5261 power stage: TAS5518 has digital inputs, I2S or DSP, and transform these to PWM signal to feed TAS5261.
What I don't understand is why use TAS5261 power stage alone, without its digital source (TAS5518). I thought the only advantage of TAS5261 is that it is able to be fed by a digital source, I2S=>>PWM, without any analogue conversion from CDP to speakers.
Otherwise you have a digital-analogue conversion from a DAC, then again a digital conversion to PWM. In this case I think a good class-d, or Tripath power stages that accept PWM (TP2150 or TP2350) would sound better.
BWRX said:
Hi Brian,
help me to understand. TAS5518 is the digital driver for TAS5261 power stage: TAS5518 has digital inputs, I2S or DSP, and transform these to PWM signal to feed TAS5261.
What I don't understand is why use TAS5261 power stage alone, without its digital source (TAS5518). I thought the only advantage of TAS5261 is that it is able to be fed by a digital source, I2S=>>PWM, without any analogue conversion from CDP to speakers.
Otherwise you have a digital-analogue conversion from a DAC, then again a digital conversion to PWM. In this case I think a good class-d, or Tripath power stages that accept PWM (TP2150 or TP2350) would sound better.
Re: Re: Re: Re: That's a good one ..
Hi Thomas. I typed TAS5518 when I meant to type TAS5110... Sorry for the confusion. Too many similar chip names and I mixed them up
All you need to use the TAS5261 is the PWM signals. You don't have to use a front end based on a TI chip, although TI certainly wants you to! The advantage of the TAS5261 is that it is capable of a lot of power output from a single chip and the specs are pretty decent. If you come up with your own front end you could apply global feedback and make a UcD type amp. You don't have to only use the designs they give to you in the datasheets and app notes.
thomaseliot said:
Hi Thomas. I typed TAS5518 when I meant to type TAS5110... Sorry for the confusion. Too many similar chip names and I mixed them up
All you need to use the TAS5261 is the PWM signals. You don't have to use a front end based on a TI chip, although TI certainly wants you to! The advantage of the TAS5261 is that it is capable of a lot of power output from a single chip and the specs are pretty decent. If you come up with your own front end you could apply global feedback and make a UcD type amp. You don't have to only use the designs they give to you in the datasheets and app notes.
BWRX said:
I keep watching for a digital amp that can drive about 20 watts into a 0.15 ohm resistive load. A higher frequency chip lkike the TAS5261 would seem valuable as it would reduce the inductor size. IS THIS CORRECT?
Anyone experiment with digital amps driving extremely low resistive loads?
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